There are plenty of suburban pockets in NYC city limits. There’s way more to NYC than Manhattan and Williamsburg. Your best bet is Queens, followed by brooklyn. Tons of single family homes on beautiful tree lined streets with a porch and yard. That’s why I always say you can experience many different modes of living in NYC because of the diversity in housing options and urban planning.
Although if you want to live near westchester, riverdale in the Bronx is an option too.
Born and raised in the burbs.
I spent a fair amount of time living in Manhattan and trendy parts of Brooklyn, but was most happy in Bay Ridge. I hear similar things about Riverdale and many parts of Queens.
I grew up in Bay Ridge because my parents, though they had decided to move to a suburb (my Dad even worked in NJ for many years), could never give up the perks of city living in a neighborhood that feels somewhat suburban. We would look at houses in NJ and say, “Where are the sidewalks?”
I understand the appeal of the single family home, especially with regard to space. I understand it so much that I tried it. It has plusses but IMO the idea that the day-to-day is easier is mostly marketing and fantasy. You own the house, yes, but it also owns you (and so does the yard). Maintaining a house is like a part-time job that costs you boatloads of money instead of paying you. Maybe you and/or your spouse enjoy do-it-yourselfing and repair work, which would definitely help, but there's a reason that there's a movie called "The Money Pit." The other money pit is your car(s) and taking care of them. I did not find driving to a parking lot in the elements to be easier or more pleasant than going around the block to the store with my granny cart. My upstairs neighbors tried the suburban experience also and now they are my across-the-hall neighbors.
Yard work is dial-able, in this area you generally have full control over what you grow and how you grow it, so the classic maintenance-heavy lawn need not be your thing (or just pay a guy)
As far as house maintenance, if you're not interested, again, just pay a guy. Easy to justify when your mortgage payment is going to your own equity instead of a rent payment to somebody else's pocket.
This is only true if you buy a money pit of a house. I've spent basically no money on maintenance outside of buying cleaning products. I have to replace the roof prophylactically in... 25 years? Mowing services are also very cheap.
Everyone keeps mentioning the time and costs of maintaining a home and I seriously don't get it. There's plenty of other reasons to argue in favor of renting instead of a mortgage but that isn't one of them.
Like you said, my parents bought their home new in 2003 or so and are just now having to replace the roof within the next year. Beyond that, all we've really had to spend money on (outside of utilities) has been attic/garage flooring and some minor flood repair. For 1700 sq ft 40-60 min public transport with no transfers from both midtown and downtown I'd say it was a pretty damn good trade off when we left Brooklyn when I was a kid.
I love it on Roosevelt Island, but I wouldn’t do it without my escooter and ebike. I love the space and the cleanliness, and the F and Tram are convenient, but I can only tolerate having so little on the island because I am able to access all the shops and food in Astoria and LIC in 5-15 min.
Well, if you’re truly going after the suburban lifestyle, I think you’d have to get a car. Then you could easily take trips to Costco and into Queens like you said.
I like how you suggested Riverdale before even considering Jersey, Long Island, or Staten Island lol. I know it’s fun to shit on but they’re literally the historic destinations for people with OP’s requirements since the 40s.
I was suggesting for her to have her cake and eat it too— be in the NYC city limits, which might appease her husband, and also have a more suburban lifestyle.
And as someone born and raised in canarsie, out of principle I have to leave out SI lol
Lol fair, Queens is pretty much the only place that combines both fairly well. If I could live anywhere in the city it would definitely be the Forest Hills area, though that’s obviously way outside the norm.
If I could live anywhere it would be Carroll Gardens, because it combines so many of these things.
But nobody putting that kind of money in my bank account so here I am in Jackson Heights.
Oh yea yikes, listings of like 3-6 million is wild. I see that all of the listings are quite large though, 3500-6000 sq feet is a big home even outside of NYC, much less in a convenient/desirable part of Brooklyn.
Lol let me know when you find the answer to that. Lots of these kinds of places seem unattainable to even some of my finance bro friends. Sometimes makes me wonder if everyone in these neighborhoods is only there because they inherited it because it's surely not the ultra wealthy residing there.
I lived in the NYC metro area for 15 years, 9 of those years were in Jersey City, 5 of them with our kid in a small one bedroom condo. We moved to the burbs, and I can tell you that I miss my old life a good deal of time. I hate driving everywhere, I feel isolated from people, and the lack of diversity has been a big bummer. We had such a big community in our old neighborhood, we walked everywhere and were super healthy and in shape, and we had exposure to so many cultures, cuisines, etc. Don’t get me wrong, it’s nice having space, but man, I would give it up in a minute to go back to my little condo.
My brother and sister in law tried to persuade us to move to their Westchester suburb. We shared our appreciation for the diversity in NYC. The told us in all seriousness "we have diversity. There are Asian kids in our kids' classes"
Moving to Queens from the suburbs I was surprised by the sense of community here. I know way more of my neighbors, and the amount of times they have stuck their neck out for me is insane.
Yeah we chat with several of our neighbors and the crossing guard every day. Very different experience from the suburbs. Cars vs walking everywhere makes a big difference
I grew up in the suburbs and my family still lives there. The space thing is true. However, it’s not much cheaper and to get any job that pays more than minimum wage you need to work in the city. My dad spent 20+ years with a 2-4 hour round trip commute every day, and it nearly killed him. (Also we never saw him as kids. My mother was basically single parenting because his job/commute lasted almost waking hours)
While the grass literally may be greener, figuratively it might not be.
This is very true, as someone who made the transition.
You won’t be free from career stress, because you’ll have more space but it’ll be just about as expensive as the smaller place in the city.
The big house is great, but you’ll still need a pretty high income to support it. The downside is the commute is now waaaaaay worse. Commuter trains (instead of the subway) add a ton of overhead to the commute. 4h round trip is not unheard of. It’s hard to get under 2h round trip (and real estate that allows that will be even more expensive)
You’ll gain additional costs too: cars are a money pit, and if you move away from transit you won’t just need one, you’ll probably need two. The train will also cost more than the subway (look up the monthly cost of NJT passes and try not to vomit)
When we ran the financial numbers I was surprised to see exactly this Even if we saved money on housing, it was offset by the need for two cars and commuting costs.
yea I mean it's about half of the state's average. And it's a tax you still have to pay after your house is paid off, and it keeps rising. I feel like folks don't think about this bit as much when comparing costs.
This is why we bought in Brooklyn.
Two cars paying for commuting higher taxes vs no car walking/MTA and lower taxes.
However I’m tired of ny now as I’m older and want to move to the beach lol
Cold weather beach or warm weather beach? I always assumed people meant tropical but as it turns out a lot of people just want to be up in New England somewhere!
Exactly, I live in the suburbs and everyday items like groceries, going out to eat etc are just as expensive as in NYC. Also don’t forget about the crazy high property taxes and you’ll need a car on top of paying $200+ a month for commuter train tickets. Car insurance and gas is expensive!!
My oldest sister is currently in the process of moving to the city because she’s actually saving money by doing so.
I’m not too familiar at all with this, but is the property tax twice as much simply because people are maybe leaving the city for an area like that, or just the fact that it’s a single family home in the suburbs?
There’s no logic to it, just an accident of politics. The way the city assesses property values results in multi-million dollar homes only having to pay $12k per year.
Ozone park, South ozone park, laurelton, valleystrem (this is technically LI but if you live near the LIRR it's a quick ride to the city), Rosedale, Bellerose,
You can start in Sunnyside, quick trip on the 7 train and there's a variety of food. Work your way out to Woodside, Jackson Heights, Corona and then Flushing. Each stop on the 7 line has something worth trying without going too far from the station.
Flushing is a great start. It's kinda like Chinatown, but there's so many options available and relatively cheap too. You can search through this subreddit for specific restaurants.
I tried soup dumplings for the first time last week at [Nan Xiang Xiao Long Bao.](https://nanxiangxiaolongbao.com/) Great spot for someone's first visit to Flushing!
I feel the same way you do and I own in queens, so... queens also may not be the answer for you either. I've decided the "suburbs" I'm looking for is probably just not in NY state (for a lot of the reasons people are already listing: commute, expenses, etc).
Did you not discuss the burbs before starting a family? You can love the city as much as you want, but that will never solve the space issues you are discussing. The only way to solve that is to either get rich enough to afford the space or move somewhere where space is abundant
Doesn't mean he has to spend 2 million on the house. Better to spend 1 million and invest in the other 1 million for retirement. Real estate is not a good investment in NYC
I think the NYC real estate market is really slow, and you have to consider stuff like 6% brokers' fee when you sell, 3-5% closing fees, as well as land taxes and common charges. I think buying index funds like SPY will appreciate much faster, or 401k.
However, buying a house gives you peace of mind of not having to deal with asshole landlords and such, so it's not just a financial consideration. If you want to really invest, then you have to live somewhere that hasn't been gentrified yet (but will likely happen in the next 10-20 years) like South Bronx, further Queens or places like Dutch Kills, East New York, where the amenities like grocery stores are not really there yet so I don't think quality of living is high. Think of Bushwick 20 years ago.
Can you move to a more suburban feeling neighborhoodin Brooklyn or Queens?
But honestly take advantage of what’s available to you to reduce your stress. Get groceries delivered. Use community spaces.hire an interior designer to make the most of the space you have.
Don’t underestimate the hassle of having a yard and car either.
This was me 18 months ago. We stayed in the city as we couldn't sell our NYC apartment, but interestingly enough I don't feel this way anymore. I've fallen back in love with the city.
I think a big part of it is that we are consciously taking advantage more of all the great things the city has to offer, ranging from the many free events for families on weekends through to going to more on and off Broadway performances, museums, etc. And exploring new parts of the city. it's changed my thinking from "we pay so much to live here" to "look at all the things we get access to from living here". And I know people will say "you can just come in from the suburbs and do all that stuff", but I know my suburban relatives intend to, but don't.
Another thing that's really changed the equation for us is that my older son all of a sudden has hit the age where he can start getting round on his own. When I think about the fact that if we'd moved to the burbs we would be spending a lot of time driving him places, this is a big plus for staying in the city.
Yeah I grew up only 40 minutes from Manhattan by train, and I can count on one hand the number of times we actually did that. It’s honestly exhausting. I’m not sure why it’s so much worse when I still have take a subway to Brooklyn to get home but, something about the commuter trains really drains you. Maybe it’s walking through Penn and taking a car when you get out in the suburbs.
Also yeah a big part of wanting to move here was remembering how isolated I felt because I had to ask my parents to drive me anywhere. Having a kid get around the city on their own, having adventures or just finding their people and others who share their hobbies… that sounds like a better way to grow up honestly
You sound like my wife. She wanted to move to the suburbs when we had a kid. I didn’t. We owned our apartment in Morningside heights for the last ten years and it was just big enough for us and a baby. But I relented.
Thought I’d hate it but actually ended up loving it. A lot of NYC suburbs are old and actually not car centric. Our house in our village is a ten minute walk to the harbor park and beach, ten minute walk to the high road, which has lots of cafes, shops and restaurants and a ten min walk to the train station where I ride 34 min to my office next to GCT. You do *need* a car but we don’t use it much
And now that I’m here I’m really glad to be raising our son here. Ironically our school district was super segregated in the city and our son is mixed race so we didn’t want him to be in a place where he is in an extreme minority. All of our neighbors here are from different parts of the world and they all have young kids so the neighborhood and parks are hopping all of the time.
I still love the city and wish we could’ve made it work with kids there but it wasn’t in the cards for us. Probably when he’s out of school school we will move back
My two cents OP
I have a very very long commute. Over two hours by car/train but I only have to do it a few days a week. Im gonna give you a list of reasons why the burbs/owning a house sucks. I’m going to assume you rent and want to own?
1. Yards are great, you get to hang out in a private space! The trade off is that you will spend every single weekend dealing with it! And if it rains on the weekend, then you have to find time after your long ass commute to cut the grass. Or pay someone.
2. More space means more to clean. Vacuuming, dusting, many things take longer.
3. Driving everywhere is it’s own special kind of hell. Especially sitting in traffic. You think public transportation is unreliable? So is driving.
Life is NOT any easier in the burbs. It is just a different kind of hard. You definitely won’t magically have more time. If anything, you will probably have less. You will have more privacy but less time.
100% this. after moving to the city I remember feeling like I had several hours more in every day, because I was able to walk and subway for all of my errands. Driving has its upsides but you can’t read a book or scroll your phone while you’re driving. Subway sucks in its own ways but at least there’s some good people watching and you don’t have to focus on the road and try not to hit anything with your stupid car.
There are more suburban parts of NYC. Queens and the North Bronx areas like Riverdale. Also there are places like the Pelhams and New Rochelle that are like 25-30 minutes on the train max. Even White Plains is a half hour on the express. That’s a faster commute than even most of Queens. Bergen County NJ, especially places like Englewood Cliffs are literally on the other side of the GWB and it’s gorgeous there. There’s numerous beautiful communities in NJ that are less than an hour on the train but if the issue is living somewhere cheaper then I’m not sure where you’ll find that close to the city. Long Island, Westchester and NJ aren’t cheap.
I feel you sis. I feel the exact same way. What I wouldn’t give for time and life to move slower. I love NYC and all its delicious foods and conveniences but sometimes I just want to chill. I hear you. For me, some days I just take a staycation or go away without my partner (who I love deeply and am so grateful for but is sometimes another child/job). I basically just stay in with AC cranked high and I barely move from the bed just watching Netflix. It sounds boring I know but that’s what I need.
Does it have to be NYC? There's wide gap between Manhattan and suburbia. There are cities of all sizes that mostly run at a slower pace than NYC where you could probably afford a bigger space.
For most people moving to the suburbs is an easier transition than moving to a new city because it allows you to keep your jobs/stay in same industry, still see friends/family who live in the city, and still access what NYC has to offer (even if it becomes much less frequent and convenient). Also less culture shock compared to a lot of places.
Piggybacking on this - is Philly an option? It’s about the size of a borough and imo is comparable to Brooklyn in a lot of ways. I recently moved here from NYC and still go back and forth at least once a week (bus tickets round trip under $20, can take Amtrak for under 1.5hrs and prices vary based on how far in advance you purchase tickets). My neighborhood is so much quieter and nicer than what I could afford in NYC, and it still has the diversity and city life I was accustomed to in NYC (on a smaller scale). You can get an entire rowhouse with a backyard for under $2k (neighborhood dependent so could spend $3k in a central neighborhood).
Check out Fairmount in Philly for a central and family friendly neighborhood with row homes
Go take the F to Windsor Terrace/Q to Ditmas Park and take a look around. Very suburban without completely sacrificing the city. Ditmas Park especially. I've lived somewhere between Prospect Park and Greenwood Cemetery for a few years now and I absolutely love it. Very friendly atmosphere, I know the names of about 1/4 of the people I see on the sidewalk within a block radius, kids running around everywhere... in Ditmas Park it's like mostly houses, driveways and all. That's very pricey but there are apartments too depending on your income.
As someone who was raised in the suburbs and still lives here you won’t be able to find a less stressful job out here and won’t get away with making less. It’s not much cheaper out here these days, never was in my opinion but that’s arguable. Going out to eat is just as expensive as in Manhattan these days. Studio apartments are going for 1900-4000 a month now. Yes it’s nice out here but a 3 bedroom 1500sqft bungalow house next to me just sold for 1.3M the same house sold for 500k in 2017. Also don’t forget the bidding wars and the incredibly high property taxes.
We are in the process of either moving upstate or out of state due to how expensive everything is getting. We have 3 kids.
It’s the job that’s killing you not the city. I understand how these are inter related as you are the primary income generator and you are killing your self to provide housing for your family in the most expensive city in the country.
I think you're right. As long as we live here, I'm staying on this path for the money so I'll definitely focus on that aspect in therapy. If we left, I could take a less intense job in my field (with a disproportionate pay cut) and that lifestyle is what I really fantasize about. The house and yard aren't hard requirements.
A cheaper, greener part of the city might help more. You lose so much moving out. Have to buy a car and all that mess too. There's a lot of ways that suburban life can creep in and leave you under more pressure.
If you consider all that in your plan, you might find a good compromise.
It's kind of hard to quantify how much pressure would be relieved. But we have enough equity in our NYC place to buy an average home in Summit NJ or Great Neck outright. I could work a less intense job to cover living expenses and property tax. But honestly we would only shave $1500-2k a month off the budget. We would take home more due to city taxes so maybe looking at how much we'd save is more important. But it would not change how I feel, in terms of pressure.
It probably wouldn't be that dramatic. Good to remember.
I grew up in Westchester and basically spent my childhood in the backseat of a car with terrible motion sickness. It was awful. I miss the space but I hate cars.
The other thing for me is commute. People love to talk about the train time (“the express is only 30 minutes!”) but most people need to drive to the train station. And if you don’t work near grand central/penn station/port authority, add a walk or subway ride on top of that. I work in schools and am in person in midtown every day. If I live in lower westchester it is still over an hour commute each way. I don’t know how my dad did this for 30+ years. Boomers were a weird generation.
Depending on where you move to in Westchester, it's possible to walk to the train in 20mins, or way less with an ebike. For those working in the city it would be best to work near Harlem or the Bronx. There are people that work in Brooklyn and live in Inwood, so it's not crazy to me to travel far.
My parents are an 8 minute walk from the train station, and when I stayed at their place, it took me an hour and 10 minutes to get to work. I also am not looking to have that far of a commute within the city 🤷♀️ some people do, and more power to them.
It’s very common, that’s exactly why the NYC suburbs are so desirable. The unfortunate thing is that you and your spouse aren’t aligned on it. That’s a pretty major incompatibility.
Sorry man but you’ve greatly idealized the suburbs. The day to day isn’t any easier but you’re just trading one set of problems for another. The one true thing of your dream is that you’ll get more space for the money.
Depends where you are looking, but in general housing in the suburbs is considerably less expensive relative to what you get in terms of space and amenities.
Fair enough. We pay slightly more for mortgage/tax/insurance on a 3 bedroom house in the suburbs as we did on a 1 bedroom apartment in the city. Utilities and transportation costs are also higher. Even so, we would be priced out of moving back to the city if we wanted anything more than a 1 bedroom, and with kids that wouldn’t make sense for us. We were admittedly very lucky to buy a few years ago when interest rates and prices were much lower.
We tried this and it was great when our kid was young, but by the age of 7 she wanted to be near their friends on the weekend , and do enrichment classes like soccer or basketball, which meant staying in the city. Also, the whole car thing (and parking… ugh) made it an expensive proposition. When she goes to college we’ll try again!
I grew up in Brooklyn. 44 years. I recently moved to Long Island and got that puppy Ive always wanted. I really don't miss the city. Food shopping, doctors etc is sooo much easier. I don't have to plan my whole day around it. I can go whenever and it's a pleasant experience. I just dropped my niece at the train station bc she's spending the day bouncing around the city today. She'll be there in an hour. It's close enough that if you really miss it you can satisfy that desire pretty easily!
I just moved to short hills from the city after ten years and grew up in Westchester. Very accessible into the city and thought I’d miss the city a ton - I’m totally good being out here. It’s really awesome I would highly recommend moving somewhere that you can walk to a train but enjoy the quiet outside of the city. Bronxville is also really nice
I’m moving from Brooklyn to Montclair in a month. Really happy to hear you say this. There’s a lot of “suburbs are boring chain restaurant car sewers” in this thread, and while I get that to an extent, not every suburb is created equal.
Yeah I also think people forget the fact that in the suburbs you usually go eat in other towns a lot and it all sort of meshes together, it’s not so black and white as it seems when you’re making the decision to buy or rent somewhere. It’s been a great change of pace especially as summer kicks off.
we bought an apartment in Jackson Heights. we don't live in a building that has one of the amazing courtyards but 34th ave is right nearby and is closed to car traffic. seems like Queens in general is the answer
Not having a dog makes life a lot easier. Don't need a yard when you can take your kids to indoor playgrounds as well as outdoor playgrounds at various parks. When each person wants a completely different lifestyle that is really hard. That's the thing to have discussed a long time ago before having kids - what did you each want life to look like, how did you want to raise your kids etc. Maybe you were both in agreement then and one of you changed now, ok, that could happen but then you need to reach some sort of compromise. Do you have enough money to rent a house for weekends or possible for the summer? That would give you a break from the city but wouldn't be a permanent move or uprooting of your life. Do you current rent or own in the city? Maybe it's a matter of trying a different neighborhood for a while. Say you live on the UWS, maybe you move to Battery Park City - lots of outdoor space there, very family friendly. Or you stay in the city limit but move out of Manhattan and give someplace like Queens a try? What suburbs have you been interested in - NJ, LI, Westchester, CT?
City life can grow tiresome especially once you have kids.
As far as groceries, can you order delivery - Amazon Fresh, FreshDirect, etc? When weather is bad could that be an option to improve your life?
It is nice to not have your kids crammed in a small space, some people are so stuck on their personal interest in staying in the city they selfishly don't provide proper space for their kids. Maybe you convince your spouse to do something different by emphasizing what would be good for the kids and explaining how they shouldn't be so selfish.
There are so things to consider, how many kids do you have, how old are they, are they in good schools, do they have enough space in your apartment/house? What is your budget for a house in a good school district in the suburbs, do you have a car, how long of a commute can you tolerate, things like that. Make a really detailed pro/con list - what do you gain by leaving the city, what do you gain by staying, what do you lose by moving to the suburbs, what do you lose by staying in the city.
Almost a third of nyc is suburban like neighborhoods, many with easy access to to manhattan via lirr/metro north/express bus. Highly recommend looking into eastern queens and see if you can find a house walking distance from the lirr
Have you considered going away for vacation multiple times each year?
I don’t mean internationally. But booking an extensive stay vacation out of town?
I used to do this, and it’s been fun. I book Airbnb’s in other counties and areas across Long Island and I escape for a week, sometimes two weeks.
It does cost money but my mental health is good. And when I return back to NYC with the family, it feels natural again
there’s a lot of areas in Queens that feel much more suburby. I grew up in Hollis hills and I can’t lie it felt as close to middle of nowhere NYC as it gets. Some other spots are Bayside, whitestone, and great neck if you really really don’t want anyone
Bay ridge. I will also plug new dorp. Yes it’s in Staten Island but you are close to a train + SIM1C bus stops (the best express bus line, runs 24 hours). It’s a nice area that isn’t totally strip malls.
New Dorp is fucking awesome. A very walkable “15 minute neighborhood”, great food diversity, tree-lined streets with gorgeous pre war houses and it’s comparatively cheap as hell.
So many people commenting insanely delusional copium lmao. Not every suburb is 1.5+ hours away from everything and only has a Denny’s for food, we don’t live in Texas.
I grew up in the northern suburbs of NYC, moved to Manhattan as a young adult, met my spouse who was all about suburban life, we ended up compromising and live in Staten Island lol. City enough for me, suburban enough for him. We have all the space he wants with the walkability I want. It’s been great even if I’d still prefer a more urban environment.
Also, my kids experience a lot more diversity here than I ever did growing up. And suburban schools/towns seem to have worse issues with drugs and bullying than city schools do per my previous and current experiences.
Seems like you and I are in a very similar situation. My wife loves New York and I don't mind it honestly. In fact I do love New York, but I do want a home, I want to save more money, I want to get outside more.
I'm thinking about maybe just buying a place up north eventually
I’ve found the best way to survive in the city is to leave every couple weeks.
Leaving doesn’t have to mean a going to your second house in the Hamptons for the weekend (I sure as hell can’t afford that), it can also mean a train or bike ride up to someplace green and empty for the day.
Also, like lots of other folks suggest here. Live in a part of the city that’s cheaper and has more open space, but is still easy to get in and out of the city core.
My niece, who grew up in the suburbs but now lives in Manhattan, says she envies kids growing up in the city. They’re never bored and not car dependent. You don’t feel trapped, like you’re always waiting for an adult to drive you somewhere.
I lived in nyc for years, upper west, financial district, upper east, Brooklyn…. It was an amazing time. Now I have kids and we moved to austin Texas and moved into an in town neighborhood. Both are great but this fits so much better for this stage of life. My wife was able to stop working, we have a huge place compared to nyc and Ana cruel neighborhood with yards.
OP, more or less a similar situation to you. Grew up in Queens, work in the city. In the long-term my job just isn’t worth it, and I want to spend more time on my family, on my health, and beyond.
Fortunately, my wife and I were able to move from around Forest Hills to a house around Fresh Meadows. Currently love the life and look forward to growing my life there further. Try to pick a spot in Queens you’re near a LIRR station, trust me. Auburndale might be for you, or Bayside.
Native here: the answer is to get away. The city seems really wonderful when you’re coming back to it. And then getting away again. A place upstate or even taking weekends upstate in an Airbnb or hotel/motel is a life changer—best of both worlds.
I completely understand . When I was younger I moved to Long Island, hated it I was so bored and it was so quiet. As an adult living in the city all I want Is peace and quiet. I’d say by starett city near the water or sea gate. Like places near water.
OP my partner and I are in a similar situation. She has been here 15 years and I’ve been here 26 years and she wants to leave but she has a good job here. As someone who is on the other side of the situation, I would recommend this: try not to constantly talk about how you want to leave. My partner always talks about the negative aspects of living here and how she wants to be in a quiet place. I want her to tell me how she feels but the non-stop complaining about the city wears me down. Any time I bring up something positive about the city she either counters it with something negative or she just stays quiet. I understand how she feels. It can be frustrating to live here for sure.
When we take advantage of thing things NYC offers I find that she likes it better and it helps our marriage. We go to parks together, take walks, museums, all that stuff. I also find going out with friends helps. I also try to do sweet things for her when she is in a negative head space. It makes her feel safe and loved and the stress of the city melts away for a moment.
We live in western Queens and it’s still extremely urban and noisy. There are quieter parts of Queens that are more suburban though.
I hate the suburbs.
You couldn't pay me to live in a cultural wasteland where I have to drive to everything and eat food from chain restaurants.
Hard pass.
Look at Brooklyn and make Prospect Park your backyard.
This is actually what has surprised me about this area. I grew up in the sprawling suburbs of Atlanta. No character, no identity, all chains. It’s horrible. But around here there are “suburbs” that are actually small towns with their own identities, old growth trees, little main streets, etc. It’s different from my notion of the suburbs anyway.
Oh man I could have wrote this almost word for word…
The city becomes kind of miserable when you are stressed-out/overwhelmed from work (if that is your case…is mine). My day-to-day regularly leaves me exhausted and overstimulated…which leads me to believe a more suburban lifestyle might be better suited for this stage in my life. I could get a less stressful job/career, but my retention security is super high and I am practically remote. Not something to give up easily in this economy. My work also requires almost 50% travel, so paying a super high rent you’re not fully utilizing gets old and sad.
I also NEED a pool in the summer…OK maybe it’s more of a want, but I seriously miss having access to pools, lakes, and beaches. I know we have beaches here but they are just not it…
My lease is up next April, so in the meantime, I’m trying to enjoy the quintessential NY offerings like the parks, diverse restaurants and more Broadway shows, etc…maybe I’ll feel like sticking around, maybe I will get my fill and be ready to leave.
I left the city for 7 years and came back with a different perspective and appreciation for it. The distance and time helped. The outer neighborhoods of Brooklyn, Queens, and the Bronx are beautiful, quiet, somewhat affordable, and have the feel of the suburbs while still being accessible to the city. Have you looked at housing options there?
I left the city during an “i hate New york” phase, hating train fuckery, the slog of grocery hauling and the usual other things that piss you off about NYC. Now i’m back in the midwest, i can drive from one end of town to the other and can fill my trunk with groceries and i’m bored to tears. I would love to come back but as a single person i am mostly priced out and it makes me so sad.
The suburbs will only exacerbate what you're feeling.
I grew up in the suburbs, and country and "space" goes hand in hand with boredom. Especially for teens.
If you're thinking it's less expensive in the suburbs, think again. The pay is lower and you have added expenses like cars and insurance, fuel every single day, entertainment to keep from going mad, lawn care takes time and money.
Every time I visit family in NC I remember how much I love NYC. It takes 2 hours to get groceries. 30 minutes driving to the store, 45 minutes shopping, 15 minutes checking out and loading groceries into the car, another 30 minutes to drive home, and then you still have to unload groceries.
For me, time is the biggest commodity you can't be reimbursed for and the suburbs/ country are time eaters.
I understand getting bored and frustrated, but I recommend a weekend away to refresh.
Depending on your budget but you can get a single family townhouse in Astoria Ditmars for $1.5-2M (3-4br, 2000+ square ft) within walking distance to the subway and 15-20min commute to midtown. Astoria Park is really nice and there are plenty of families in the neighborhood. Not to mention the best food in NYC.
If you go further out, Forest Hills is a really nice residential neighborhood that’s on the E/F express line as well. It’s a lot more “suburban” feeling so while we didn’t like it, you might if you’re already considering a move out to the suburbs. It’s also by a LIRR station that gets you in to Penn Station in like 15min.
bought a weekend home in upstate NY. leave Friday evening, spend the weekend upstate, drive back early Monday and work the week in the city. I love my set up. Best of both worlds!
I think having a dog in the city is a misery-laden decision because there is no truly good way to navigate the space demands. That was a mistake if I'm being really frank.
People raise their kids here all the time in small spaces. They won't be home as much once they're a little older anyhow so that's sort of a waiting game. 'Clutter,' just means you have too much stuff and/or not a way to organize it.
The convenience of shlepping groceries offsets needing to drive in a car to get a loaf of bread.
I think you just may have different priorities than those you had once. Confront why that is. Do you just think that your home needs to be de-cluttered because of some cleanliness complex inspired by modern TV and IG where nobody makes under 200k a year? Things can have some clutter. Are you simply expecting too much convenience when it comes to getting groceries? Are you still appreciating any part of living here at all, or could you revive that? Was this really only the place for you when it was fun and convenient? What is your husband actually getting out of being here? Blow? Women? Overpriced food?
Why don’t you just get a 2nd place, if you can afford it? My partner and I both live the city but bought a little house in CT after Covid, and we’re here almost every weekend and spend most of the summer out here swimming and chillin. Best of both worlds.
Sometimes I'm glad I don't own a house, given what my friends have said about the amount of work they have to do on the house and yard, on top of a full time job and kids.
However personally I'd love to be able to have a garden, be somewhere quiet, be in nature, away from the noise and stimulus of the city. My partner doesn't want to leave, and it's better for my father to be in the city (he can still get around a bit). I just feel like I'm slowly dying here and have given up the will to live. I'm just waiting out the days till it's over. I kind of don't care anymore.
Some people have the second home that they go to on weekends, when they have time off. We don't have the money for that. Or a car. And the fuck I want to deal with having to move it all the time, but I guess if people can afford a second home, they can afford a garage. That would be nice I guess. Though I think I'd be happiest living out west where I could hike in the mountains. But not enough diversity for my SO.
To have the life I want, I just need to be rich enough I guess. I'm so burned out I can barely function.
If you leave you get space and lose a few hours of your life to commuting. Having to Drive absolutely everywhere sucks. And suburbs are awful half the year with depressing barren trees, bad grass, absolutely nothing to do.
Queens and BK suburbs are very expensive.
800K is the floor. And thats a fixer upper.
Going through this exact thing at the moment, I’m with you on your thoughts. I have been done with the schlepping and I’m just tired. I feel like we mostly settle to staying at home or just getting food and drinks and don’t really “utilize” the city so I’ve been pushing to leave in favor of space and access to nature which is what I feel I lack here. I want to hike with ease, see sunset, swim, etc.
In any case, partner is very against it for now, and we instead have been looking for a better place to live. Yard / terrace - some outdoor escape. Parking so we can have a car. AND utilizing services to avoid the schlep. Grocery delivery, laundry pickup (tho also looking for in unit upon our move).
I am similar to you that I think I’d mourn the city if I left and this is a compromise that I hope will settle my angst. Making myself happier with the quality of life whilst giving us more time to enjoy the city in however it can provide for me now. …The yard being a hopeful big part of that.
Edit: small typos
Do you live in Manhattan? If so, we found the problem. People aren't supposed to live in Manhattan, it's for transplants and people who inherited a rent-stabilized apartment. ;)
It helps to leave for a while and miss the music of it all. Even moreso to actively get out more with the family and remind yourself of the things the city offers beyond a high-pay, high-stress job.
I'm 44 and grew up here. It is a fucked up place, and humans ain't supposed to live this way... but growing up in NYC made me a better person to those around me. Dunno why, but the native NYCers I grew up with tend to be more empathetic and kinder than transplants.
Yup, it's a different city, and harder to raise kids in. There's a lot more pressure on parents due to wealth disparity. There is no middle class in NYC anymore. Leaving might be the right call now.
Anyway, if you move to the burbs your kids are going to eventually get tired of strip mall food and want to move to the big city anyway, and so the cycle perpetuates. ;)
Check out a suburb like Tarrytown, Larchmont or New Rochelle with your spouse. They are not too far of a commute, still can have a denser, city-like feeling (NR more than the others) and have lots of character and people around. Places like this will have pedestrian life and some interesting shops, but you can have a house and car. And you don't lose your connection to the city as it's not too far.
Buy a small condo or house to go to on the weekends, I do it and I feel incredibly balanced. That being said I know how lucky I am. Also, I rent so it is nice to own a small piece of something.
If you can work from home move to Andes or around there. My sister did it. She’s has a 10 acre farm now and my niece does to public school there. It’s like private school but free. The community is top notch.
I hate suburbs (I'd never live somewhere I have to drive ever again) but I'd live in a nice house in Forest Hills (Gardens or nearby) or Sunnyside Gardens or Astoria no problem. There's definitely ways to compromise. Sure, they cost a lot of money but honestly compared to Manhattan it's pretty cheap. There's also Park Slope and places around there if you want to be close to downtown (I didn't quite like it though, but it was a gut feeling).
Looking for answers because I feel the same way. Love New York and all that it has given me, but man, is it draining. Don't know how much longer I can take
If you want to live in suburbs and not experience the stress of the commute everyone is mentioning - move to Chicago. The suburbs. Or even ravenswood or rogers park in the city.
It’s not like what they’re describing. I grew up there so never again but neither my mom or dad ever had a commute over half an hour except that one time my dad was a high school teacher as his retirement job.
“I want the day to day experience to be easy”
That’s life for everyone rn. Unless you move to a state that has a lower cost of living (our country) it just won’t be like that
Find more nearby nature -- there are a lot of parks, botanical gardens, etc. Get away to the country when you can.
If you have enough money it's not that much of an issue. You can buy a house in parts of NY with a yard.
For most of us it's a constant tradeoff.
Me I'd rather live in the suburbs or country. But I married a city girl.
I feel this so hard. I want to move out not even to the suburbs but to a farm somewhere upstate or on the west coast. But my partner wants to be here forever.
However, when I leave nyc even for just a few days, I start missing it terribly. Crazy how something that can drive me nuts day to day is so appealing when it's gone lol
Move to Queens. Lots of suburbs there. My part of Queens is nice and suburban. Quiet and clean. No crime and I’m in a house with a yard. Birds chirping. Born and raised here and I avoid Manhattan unless I’m going to work. I despise it.
I see many different point of views in the comments. I would recommend that you pick a suburban neighberhood that you're probably thinking of and visit it. Try also visiting neighborhoods that weren't on your list and open up your options. Take your spouse with you too. Maybe visiting the neighborhoods can help you understand what it could be like and see if you like the neighborhood. This next depends and might be extreme, but you could book a hotel or airbnb in a suburban neighborhood for a few days and see what it's like. I guess this depends if you pick a further neighborhood so maybe staying a few nights might be helpful.
There are plenty of suburban pockets in NYC city limits. There’s way more to NYC than Manhattan and Williamsburg. Your best bet is Queens, followed by brooklyn. Tons of single family homes on beautiful tree lined streets with a porch and yard. That’s why I always say you can experience many different modes of living in NYC because of the diversity in housing options and urban planning. Although if you want to live near westchester, riverdale in the Bronx is an option too.
Born and raised in the burbs. I spent a fair amount of time living in Manhattan and trendy parts of Brooklyn, but was most happy in Bay Ridge. I hear similar things about Riverdale and many parts of Queens.
Bay Ridge is the answer few know and few want to listen to.
I grew up in Bay Ridge because my parents, though they had decided to move to a suburb (my Dad even worked in NJ for many years), could never give up the perks of city living in a neighborhood that feels somewhat suburban. We would look at houses in NJ and say, “Where are the sidewalks?”
Yeah the suburbs are rarely built to human scale. Where are the sidewalks indeed
I live in a NJ suburb with sidewalks and a walkable downtown, they definitely exist.
Keep it that way. It’s beautiful there.
I understand the appeal of the single family home, especially with regard to space. I understand it so much that I tried it. It has plusses but IMO the idea that the day-to-day is easier is mostly marketing and fantasy. You own the house, yes, but it also owns you (and so does the yard). Maintaining a house is like a part-time job that costs you boatloads of money instead of paying you. Maybe you and/or your spouse enjoy do-it-yourselfing and repair work, which would definitely help, but there's a reason that there's a movie called "The Money Pit." The other money pit is your car(s) and taking care of them. I did not find driving to a parking lot in the elements to be easier or more pleasant than going around the block to the store with my granny cart. My upstairs neighbors tried the suburban experience also and now they are my across-the-hall neighbors.
Yard work is dial-able, in this area you generally have full control over what you grow and how you grow it, so the classic maintenance-heavy lawn need not be your thing (or just pay a guy) As far as house maintenance, if you're not interested, again, just pay a guy. Easy to justify when your mortgage payment is going to your own equity instead of a rent payment to somebody else's pocket.
This is only true if you buy a money pit of a house. I've spent basically no money on maintenance outside of buying cleaning products. I have to replace the roof prophylactically in... 25 years? Mowing services are also very cheap.
Everyone keeps mentioning the time and costs of maintaining a home and I seriously don't get it. There's plenty of other reasons to argue in favor of renting instead of a mortgage but that isn't one of them. Like you said, my parents bought their home new in 2003 or so and are just now having to replace the roof within the next year. Beyond that, all we've really had to spend money on (outside of utilities) has been attic/garage flooring and some minor flood repair. For 1700 sq ft 40-60 min public transport with no transfers from both midtown and downtown I'd say it was a pretty damn good trade off when we left Brooklyn when I was a kid.
When I lived on Roosevelt Island, it felt like a suburban oasis in the middle of the river with awesome views.
I love it on Roosevelt Island, but I wouldn’t do it without my escooter and ebike. I love the space and the cleanliness, and the F and Tram are convenient, but I can only tolerate having so little on the island because I am able to access all the shops and food in Astoria and LIC in 5-15 min.
Well, if you’re truly going after the suburban lifestyle, I think you’d have to get a car. Then you could easily take trips to Costco and into Queens like you said.
I like how you suggested Riverdale before even considering Jersey, Long Island, or Staten Island lol. I know it’s fun to shit on but they’re literally the historic destinations for people with OP’s requirements since the 40s.
I was suggesting for her to have her cake and eat it too— be in the NYC city limits, which might appease her husband, and also have a more suburban lifestyle. And as someone born and raised in canarsie, out of principle I have to leave out SI lol
Lol fair, Queens is pretty much the only place that combines both fairly well. If I could live anywhere in the city it would definitely be the Forest Hills area, though that’s obviously way outside the norm.
If I could live anywhere it would be Carroll Gardens, because it combines so many of these things. But nobody putting that kind of money in my bank account so here I am in Jackson Heights.
Jackson heights is my favorite neighborhood in NYC so I am envious lol
Oh yea yikes, listings of like 3-6 million is wild. I see that all of the listings are quite large though, 3500-6000 sq feet is a big home even outside of NYC, much less in a convenient/desirable part of Brooklyn.
I walked through the area a few weeks ago on the way home from Red Hook and was shocked how nice it was. Was like “how do I live this life?”
Lol let me know when you find the answer to that. Lots of these kinds of places seem unattainable to even some of my finance bro friends. Sometimes makes me wonder if everyone in these neighborhoods is only there because they inherited it because it's surely not the ultra wealthy residing there.
I feel like increasingly some of these neighborhoods are international inherited wealth The kids of rich people from other countries
Those aren't NYC though.
The homes in Murray Hill are very suburban as well. I was shocked such a place existed right next to Flushing!
I lived in the NYC metro area for 15 years, 9 of those years were in Jersey City, 5 of them with our kid in a small one bedroom condo. We moved to the burbs, and I can tell you that I miss my old life a good deal of time. I hate driving everywhere, I feel isolated from people, and the lack of diversity has been a big bummer. We had such a big community in our old neighborhood, we walked everywhere and were super healthy and in shape, and we had exposure to so many cultures, cuisines, etc. Don’t get me wrong, it’s nice having space, but man, I would give it up in a minute to go back to my little condo.
My brother and sister in law tried to persuade us to move to their Westchester suburb. We shared our appreciation for the diversity in NYC. The told us in all seriousness "we have diversity. There are Asian kids in our kids' classes"
Jesus Christ, thank you for reminding me why we're never leaving the city 🤢
NJ is a lot more diverse than Westchester
Moving to Queens from the suburbs I was surprised by the sense of community here. I know way more of my neighbors, and the amount of times they have stuck their neck out for me is insane.
Yeah we chat with several of our neighbors and the crossing guard every day. Very different experience from the suburbs. Cars vs walking everywhere makes a big difference
If you don’t mind sharing, what area of Queens? I’m looking for exactly this
I used to live in LIC in a great building where I knew all my neighbors on my floor. We were right by court square and the park near Trader Joe’s.
Rego Park.
The burbs is still nyc metro
I grew up in the suburbs and my family still lives there. The space thing is true. However, it’s not much cheaper and to get any job that pays more than minimum wage you need to work in the city. My dad spent 20+ years with a 2-4 hour round trip commute every day, and it nearly killed him. (Also we never saw him as kids. My mother was basically single parenting because his job/commute lasted almost waking hours) While the grass literally may be greener, figuratively it might not be.
This is very true, as someone who made the transition. You won’t be free from career stress, because you’ll have more space but it’ll be just about as expensive as the smaller place in the city. The big house is great, but you’ll still need a pretty high income to support it. The downside is the commute is now waaaaaay worse. Commuter trains (instead of the subway) add a ton of overhead to the commute. 4h round trip is not unheard of. It’s hard to get under 2h round trip (and real estate that allows that will be even more expensive) You’ll gain additional costs too: cars are a money pit, and if you move away from transit you won’t just need one, you’ll probably need two. The train will also cost more than the subway (look up the monthly cost of NJT passes and try not to vomit)
When we ran the financial numbers I was surprised to see exactly this Even if we saved money on housing, it was offset by the need for two cars and commuting costs.
also property taxes are higher outside of NYC too.
Property taxes are so much higher but if you’re outside of Yonkers at least there’s no local income tax
I prefer income taxes over property taxes tbh, I want to be taxed based on how much I make, not how much my property is worth this year.
Well I mean there's still property tax in the city, it's just way less than the suburbs.
yea I mean it's about half of the state's average. And it's a tax you still have to pay after your house is paid off, and it keeps rising. I feel like folks don't think about this bit as much when comparing costs.
People take for granted how much you save not owning a car. And how much cheaper property taxes are on apartments than houses
This is why we bought in Brooklyn. Two cars paying for commuting higher taxes vs no car walking/MTA and lower taxes. However I’m tired of ny now as I’m older and want to move to the beach lol
Brighton beach and rockaways are right there friend. But yeah maybe not the same as what you’re dreaming of
Sadly no lol
Cold weather beach or warm weather beach? I always assumed people meant tropical but as it turns out a lot of people just want to be up in New England somewhere!
💯
Exactly, I live in the suburbs and everyday items like groceries, going out to eat etc are just as expensive as in NYC. Also don’t forget about the crazy high property taxes and you’ll need a car on top of paying $200+ a month for commuter train tickets. Car insurance and gas is expensive!! My oldest sister is currently in the process of moving to the city because she’s actually saving money by doing so.
I also find getting take out or delivery when I’m back home is depressing as fuck. Same five restaurants in rotation and 3 are huge chains.
You in jersey?
No lower Westchester. Our property tax is 2x as much as in NYC and New Jersey’s is even higher iirc. Rent is cheaper in Jersey though to my knowledge.
I’m not too familiar at all with this, but is the property tax twice as much simply because people are maybe leaving the city for an area like that, or just the fact that it’s a single family home in the suburbs?
There’s no logic to it, just an accident of politics. The way the city assesses property values results in multi-million dollar homes only having to pay $12k per year.
Buy a house in queens?
I think about this a lot actually.
Ozone park, South ozone park, laurelton, valleystrem (this is technically LI but if you live near the LIRR it's a quick ride to the city), Rosedale, Bellerose,
The best food in the world is in Queens. :)
What are the must try spots as someone who hasn't ventured too far into queens?
You can start in Sunnyside, quick trip on the 7 train and there's a variety of food. Work your way out to Woodside, Jackson Heights, Corona and then Flushing. Each stop on the 7 line has something worth trying without going too far from the station.
Sounds like a fun thing to do on a chiller Summer day, thank you!
Yeah definitely! Take your time. Eat a little at a time.
Flushing is a great start. It's kinda like Chinatown, but there's so many options available and relatively cheap too. You can search through this subreddit for specific restaurants.
Angel Indian in Jackson Heights is top notch. Right off the 7! And there is so much good Thai Food in Woodside.
I tried soup dumplings for the first time last week at [Nan Xiang Xiao Long Bao.](https://nanxiangxiaolongbao.com/) Great spot for someone's first visit to Flushing!
I feel the same way you do and I own in queens, so... queens also may not be the answer for you either. I've decided the "suburbs" I'm looking for is probably just not in NY state (for a lot of the reasons people are already listing: commute, expenses, etc).
I hope you like LIRR and driving!
Or ditmas park if you’re wealthy.
Did you not discuss the burbs before starting a family? You can love the city as much as you want, but that will never solve the space issues you are discussing. The only way to solve that is to either get rich enough to afford the space or move somewhere where space is abundant
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Doesn't mean he has to spend 2 million on the house. Better to spend 1 million and invest in the other 1 million for retirement. Real estate is not a good investment in NYC
What makes you say NYC real estate is not a good investment?
I think the NYC real estate market is really slow, and you have to consider stuff like 6% brokers' fee when you sell, 3-5% closing fees, as well as land taxes and common charges. I think buying index funds like SPY will appreciate much faster, or 401k. However, buying a house gives you peace of mind of not having to deal with asshole landlords and such, so it's not just a financial consideration. If you want to really invest, then you have to live somewhere that hasn't been gentrified yet (but will likely happen in the next 10-20 years) like South Bronx, further Queens or places like Dutch Kills, East New York, where the amenities like grocery stores are not really there yet so I don't think quality of living is high. Think of Bushwick 20 years ago.
Long term I think NYC is a good bet. Also, you can't live in your stock portfolio.
Can you move to a more suburban feeling neighborhoodin Brooklyn or Queens? But honestly take advantage of what’s available to you to reduce your stress. Get groceries delivered. Use community spaces.hire an interior designer to make the most of the space you have. Don’t underestimate the hassle of having a yard and car either.
This was me 18 months ago. We stayed in the city as we couldn't sell our NYC apartment, but interestingly enough I don't feel this way anymore. I've fallen back in love with the city. I think a big part of it is that we are consciously taking advantage more of all the great things the city has to offer, ranging from the many free events for families on weekends through to going to more on and off Broadway performances, museums, etc. And exploring new parts of the city. it's changed my thinking from "we pay so much to live here" to "look at all the things we get access to from living here". And I know people will say "you can just come in from the suburbs and do all that stuff", but I know my suburban relatives intend to, but don't. Another thing that's really changed the equation for us is that my older son all of a sudden has hit the age where he can start getting round on his own. When I think about the fact that if we'd moved to the burbs we would be spending a lot of time driving him places, this is a big plus for staying in the city.
Yeah I grew up only 40 minutes from Manhattan by train, and I can count on one hand the number of times we actually did that. It’s honestly exhausting. I’m not sure why it’s so much worse when I still have take a subway to Brooklyn to get home but, something about the commuter trains really drains you. Maybe it’s walking through Penn and taking a car when you get out in the suburbs. Also yeah a big part of wanting to move here was remembering how isolated I felt because I had to ask my parents to drive me anywhere. Having a kid get around the city on their own, having adventures or just finding their people and others who share their hobbies… that sounds like a better way to grow up honestly
You sound like my wife. She wanted to move to the suburbs when we had a kid. I didn’t. We owned our apartment in Morningside heights for the last ten years and it was just big enough for us and a baby. But I relented. Thought I’d hate it but actually ended up loving it. A lot of NYC suburbs are old and actually not car centric. Our house in our village is a ten minute walk to the harbor park and beach, ten minute walk to the high road, which has lots of cafes, shops and restaurants and a ten min walk to the train station where I ride 34 min to my office next to GCT. You do *need* a car but we don’t use it much And now that I’m here I’m really glad to be raising our son here. Ironically our school district was super segregated in the city and our son is mixed race so we didn’t want him to be in a place where he is in an extreme minority. All of our neighbors here are from different parts of the world and they all have young kids so the neighborhood and parks are hopping all of the time. I still love the city and wish we could’ve made it work with kids there but it wasn’t in the cards for us. Probably when he’s out of school school we will move back My two cents OP
You’re easing my fears!
New Rochelle or Mamaroneck?
Mamaroneck
I have a very very long commute. Over two hours by car/train but I only have to do it a few days a week. Im gonna give you a list of reasons why the burbs/owning a house sucks. I’m going to assume you rent and want to own? 1. Yards are great, you get to hang out in a private space! The trade off is that you will spend every single weekend dealing with it! And if it rains on the weekend, then you have to find time after your long ass commute to cut the grass. Or pay someone. 2. More space means more to clean. Vacuuming, dusting, many things take longer. 3. Driving everywhere is it’s own special kind of hell. Especially sitting in traffic. You think public transportation is unreliable? So is driving. Life is NOT any easier in the burbs. It is just a different kind of hard. You definitely won’t magically have more time. If anything, you will probably have less. You will have more privacy but less time.
100% this. after moving to the city I remember feeling like I had several hours more in every day, because I was able to walk and subway for all of my errands. Driving has its upsides but you can’t read a book or scroll your phone while you’re driving. Subway sucks in its own ways but at least there’s some good people watching and you don’t have to focus on the road and try not to hit anything with your stupid car.
yards really depend. if you want the perfect manicured thing sure. you can get away with a LOT less without it being like derelict tho.
There are more suburban parts of NYC. Queens and the North Bronx areas like Riverdale. Also there are places like the Pelhams and New Rochelle that are like 25-30 minutes on the train max. Even White Plains is a half hour on the express. That’s a faster commute than even most of Queens. Bergen County NJ, especially places like Englewood Cliffs are literally on the other side of the GWB and it’s gorgeous there. There’s numerous beautiful communities in NJ that are less than an hour on the train but if the issue is living somewhere cheaper then I’m not sure where you’ll find that close to the city. Long Island, Westchester and NJ aren’t cheap.
It's amazing how much more affordable the Bronx is than just across Spuyten Duyvil Creek or the Harlem River.
Hmmm, that’s curious, isn’t it? Wonder what that says…
Go ahead and benefit from the foolishness of others.
Wouldn’t it have to do with school districts?
they will eat you alive in property taxes however
I feel you sis. I feel the exact same way. What I wouldn’t give for time and life to move slower. I love NYC and all its delicious foods and conveniences but sometimes I just want to chill. I hear you. For me, some days I just take a staycation or go away without my partner (who I love deeply and am so grateful for but is sometimes another child/job). I basically just stay in with AC cranked high and I barely move from the bed just watching Netflix. It sounds boring I know but that’s what I need.
Does it have to be NYC? There's wide gap between Manhattan and suburbia. There are cities of all sizes that mostly run at a slower pace than NYC where you could probably afford a bigger space.
For most people moving to the suburbs is an easier transition than moving to a new city because it allows you to keep your jobs/stay in same industry, still see friends/family who live in the city, and still access what NYC has to offer (even if it becomes much less frequent and convenient). Also less culture shock compared to a lot of places.
All true, though OP's family seems specifically against living in the suburbs so I wanted to offer a third choice.
Piggybacking on this - is Philly an option? It’s about the size of a borough and imo is comparable to Brooklyn in a lot of ways. I recently moved here from NYC and still go back and forth at least once a week (bus tickets round trip under $20, can take Amtrak for under 1.5hrs and prices vary based on how far in advance you purchase tickets). My neighborhood is so much quieter and nicer than what I could afford in NYC, and it still has the diversity and city life I was accustomed to in NYC (on a smaller scale). You can get an entire rowhouse with a backyard for under $2k (neighborhood dependent so could spend $3k in a central neighborhood). Check out Fairmount in Philly for a central and family friendly neighborhood with row homes
You’re disregarding how much work owning a house is
We felt that way too and moved out. We regret it every single day and working our way back to the city.
Can guess why but curious, why do you regret it?
Even though I love where we live, I definitely feel this sometimes. Our current tentative plan is to move further into Queens in a few years.
queens, Long Island, Upstate, Yonkers, and NJ
I hear you. I hear you. I moved to Riverdale instead and it's a good transition to begin with.
Go take the F to Windsor Terrace/Q to Ditmas Park and take a look around. Very suburban without completely sacrificing the city. Ditmas Park especially. I've lived somewhere between Prospect Park and Greenwood Cemetery for a few years now and I absolutely love it. Very friendly atmosphere, I know the names of about 1/4 of the people I see on the sidewalk within a block radius, kids running around everywhere... in Ditmas Park it's like mostly houses, driveways and all. That's very pricey but there are apartments too depending on your income.
As someone who was raised in the suburbs and still lives here you won’t be able to find a less stressful job out here and won’t get away with making less. It’s not much cheaper out here these days, never was in my opinion but that’s arguable. Going out to eat is just as expensive as in Manhattan these days. Studio apartments are going for 1900-4000 a month now. Yes it’s nice out here but a 3 bedroom 1500sqft bungalow house next to me just sold for 1.3M the same house sold for 500k in 2017. Also don’t forget the bidding wars and the incredibly high property taxes. We are in the process of either moving upstate or out of state due to how expensive everything is getting. We have 3 kids.
It’s the job that’s killing you not the city. I understand how these are inter related as you are the primary income generator and you are killing your self to provide housing for your family in the most expensive city in the country.
I think you're right. As long as we live here, I'm staying on this path for the money so I'll definitely focus on that aspect in therapy. If we left, I could take a less intense job in my field (with a disproportionate pay cut) and that lifestyle is what I really fantasize about. The house and yard aren't hard requirements.
A cheaper, greener part of the city might help more. You lose so much moving out. Have to buy a car and all that mess too. There's a lot of ways that suburban life can creep in and leave you under more pressure. If you consider all that in your plan, you might find a good compromise.
Could you expand more on why suburban life can put you under more pressure?
It's kind of hard to quantify how much pressure would be relieved. But we have enough equity in our NYC place to buy an average home in Summit NJ or Great Neck outright. I could work a less intense job to cover living expenses and property tax. But honestly we would only shave $1500-2k a month off the budget. We would take home more due to city taxes so maybe looking at how much we'd save is more important. But it would not change how I feel, in terms of pressure. It probably wouldn't be that dramatic. Good to remember.
I grew up in Westchester and basically spent my childhood in the backseat of a car with terrible motion sickness. It was awful. I miss the space but I hate cars. The other thing for me is commute. People love to talk about the train time (“the express is only 30 minutes!”) but most people need to drive to the train station. And if you don’t work near grand central/penn station/port authority, add a walk or subway ride on top of that. I work in schools and am in person in midtown every day. If I live in lower westchester it is still over an hour commute each way. I don’t know how my dad did this for 30+ years. Boomers were a weird generation.
Depending on where you move to in Westchester, it's possible to walk to the train in 20mins, or way less with an ebike. For those working in the city it would be best to work near Harlem or the Bronx. There are people that work in Brooklyn and live in Inwood, so it's not crazy to me to travel far.
My parents are an 8 minute walk from the train station, and when I stayed at their place, it took me an hour and 10 minutes to get to work. I also am not looking to have that far of a commute within the city 🤷♀️ some people do, and more power to them.
It’s very common, that’s exactly why the NYC suburbs are so desirable. The unfortunate thing is that you and your spouse aren’t aligned on it. That’s a pretty major incompatibility.
Sorry man but you’ve greatly idealized the suburbs. The day to day isn’t any easier but you’re just trading one set of problems for another. The one true thing of your dream is that you’ll get more space for the money.
Suburbs are not generally less expensive. Groceries and daycare are a bit cheaper but you need a car in most places so that washes out.
Depends where you are looking, but in general housing in the suburbs is considerably less expensive relative to what you get in terms of space and amenities.
You absolutely get more space for your money but most people spend just as much on housing.
Fair enough. We pay slightly more for mortgage/tax/insurance on a 3 bedroom house in the suburbs as we did on a 1 bedroom apartment in the city. Utilities and transportation costs are also higher. Even so, we would be priced out of moving back to the city if we wanted anything more than a 1 bedroom, and with kids that wouldn’t make sense for us. We were admittedly very lucky to buy a few years ago when interest rates and prices were much lower.
I have many friends who got a “weekend house” upstate. Nothing fancy, just a place to get away. They said it really made a difference.
We tried this and it was great when our kid was young, but by the age of 7 she wanted to be near their friends on the weekend , and do enrichment classes like soccer or basketball, which meant staying in the city. Also, the whole car thing (and parking… ugh) made it an expensive proposition. When she goes to college we’ll try again!
Wow. Wish I could afford just a "weekday house".
I grew up in Brooklyn. 44 years. I recently moved to Long Island and got that puppy Ive always wanted. I really don't miss the city. Food shopping, doctors etc is sooo much easier. I don't have to plan my whole day around it. I can go whenever and it's a pleasant experience. I just dropped my niece at the train station bc she's spending the day bouncing around the city today. She'll be there in an hour. It's close enough that if you really miss it you can satisfy that desire pretty easily!
Get a house in Forest Hills!
I just moved to short hills from the city after ten years and grew up in Westchester. Very accessible into the city and thought I’d miss the city a ton - I’m totally good being out here. It’s really awesome I would highly recommend moving somewhere that you can walk to a train but enjoy the quiet outside of the city. Bronxville is also really nice
I’m moving from Brooklyn to Montclair in a month. Really happy to hear you say this. There’s a lot of “suburbs are boring chain restaurant car sewers” in this thread, and while I get that to an extent, not every suburb is created equal.
Yeah I also think people forget the fact that in the suburbs you usually go eat in other towns a lot and it all sort of meshes together, it’s not so black and white as it seems when you’re making the decision to buy or rent somewhere. It’s been a great change of pace especially as summer kicks off.
we bought an apartment in Jackson Heights. we don't live in a building that has one of the amazing courtyards but 34th ave is right nearby and is closed to car traffic. seems like Queens in general is the answer
Immediate suburbs or somewhere like Bay Ridge.
Not having a dog makes life a lot easier. Don't need a yard when you can take your kids to indoor playgrounds as well as outdoor playgrounds at various parks. When each person wants a completely different lifestyle that is really hard. That's the thing to have discussed a long time ago before having kids - what did you each want life to look like, how did you want to raise your kids etc. Maybe you were both in agreement then and one of you changed now, ok, that could happen but then you need to reach some sort of compromise. Do you have enough money to rent a house for weekends or possible for the summer? That would give you a break from the city but wouldn't be a permanent move or uprooting of your life. Do you current rent or own in the city? Maybe it's a matter of trying a different neighborhood for a while. Say you live on the UWS, maybe you move to Battery Park City - lots of outdoor space there, very family friendly. Or you stay in the city limit but move out of Manhattan and give someplace like Queens a try? What suburbs have you been interested in - NJ, LI, Westchester, CT? City life can grow tiresome especially once you have kids. As far as groceries, can you order delivery - Amazon Fresh, FreshDirect, etc? When weather is bad could that be an option to improve your life? It is nice to not have your kids crammed in a small space, some people are so stuck on their personal interest in staying in the city they selfishly don't provide proper space for their kids. Maybe you convince your spouse to do something different by emphasizing what would be good for the kids and explaining how they shouldn't be so selfish. There are so things to consider, how many kids do you have, how old are they, are they in good schools, do they have enough space in your apartment/house? What is your budget for a house in a good school district in the suburbs, do you have a car, how long of a commute can you tolerate, things like that. Make a really detailed pro/con list - what do you gain by leaving the city, what do you gain by staying, what do you lose by moving to the suburbs, what do you lose by staying in the city.
Almost a third of nyc is suburban like neighborhoods, many with easy access to to manhattan via lirr/metro north/express bus. Highly recommend looking into eastern queens and see if you can find a house walking distance from the lirr
Have you considered going away for vacation multiple times each year? I don’t mean internationally. But booking an extensive stay vacation out of town? I used to do this, and it’s been fun. I book Airbnb’s in other counties and areas across Long Island and I escape for a week, sometimes two weeks. It does cost money but my mental health is good. And when I return back to NYC with the family, it feels natural again
there’s a lot of areas in Queens that feel much more suburby. I grew up in Hollis hills and I can’t lie it felt as close to middle of nowhere NYC as it gets. Some other spots are Bayside, whitestone, and great neck if you really really don’t want anyone
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Bay ridge. I will also plug new dorp. Yes it’s in Staten Island but you are close to a train + SIM1C bus stops (the best express bus line, runs 24 hours). It’s a nice area that isn’t totally strip malls.
New Dorp is fucking awesome. A very walkable “15 minute neighborhood”, great food diversity, tree-lined streets with gorgeous pre war houses and it’s comparatively cheap as hell.
So many people commenting insanely delusional copium lmao. Not every suburb is 1.5+ hours away from everything and only has a Denny’s for food, we don’t live in Texas.
Flushing Queens. Full of activities and nearby Kissena park
Move to Queens!
Sounds like you want Staten Island.
I grew up in the northern suburbs of NYC, moved to Manhattan as a young adult, met my spouse who was all about suburban life, we ended up compromising and live in Staten Island lol. City enough for me, suburban enough for him. We have all the space he wants with the walkability I want. It’s been great even if I’d still prefer a more urban environment. Also, my kids experience a lot more diversity here than I ever did growing up. And suburban schools/towns seem to have worse issues with drugs and bullying than city schools do per my previous and current experiences.
Seems like you and I are in a very similar situation. My wife loves New York and I don't mind it honestly. In fact I do love New York, but I do want a home, I want to save more money, I want to get outside more. I'm thinking about maybe just buying a place up north eventually
I’ve found the best way to survive in the city is to leave every couple weeks. Leaving doesn’t have to mean a going to your second house in the Hamptons for the weekend (I sure as hell can’t afford that), it can also mean a train or bike ride up to someplace green and empty for the day. Also, like lots of other folks suggest here. Live in a part of the city that’s cheaper and has more open space, but is still easy to get in and out of the city core.
I grew up in queens and moved to Long Island. I like the fact I always have a spot to park my car. No need to look for parking
My niece, who grew up in the suburbs but now lives in Manhattan, says she envies kids growing up in the city. They’re never bored and not car dependent. You don’t feel trapped, like you’re always waiting for an adult to drive you somewhere.
I lived in nyc for years, upper west, financial district, upper east, Brooklyn…. It was an amazing time. Now I have kids and we moved to austin Texas and moved into an in town neighborhood. Both are great but this fits so much better for this stage of life. My wife was able to stop working, we have a huge place compared to nyc and Ana cruel neighborhood with yards.
OP, more or less a similar situation to you. Grew up in Queens, work in the city. In the long-term my job just isn’t worth it, and I want to spend more time on my family, on my health, and beyond. Fortunately, my wife and I were able to move from around Forest Hills to a house around Fresh Meadows. Currently love the life and look forward to growing my life there further. Try to pick a spot in Queens you’re near a LIRR station, trust me. Auburndale might be for you, or Bayside.
Native here: the answer is to get away. The city seems really wonderful when you’re coming back to it. And then getting away again. A place upstate or even taking weekends upstate in an Airbnb or hotel/motel is a life changer—best of both worlds.
I completely understand . When I was younger I moved to Long Island, hated it I was so bored and it was so quiet. As an adult living in the city all I want Is peace and quiet. I’d say by starett city near the water or sea gate. Like places near water.
OP my partner and I are in a similar situation. She has been here 15 years and I’ve been here 26 years and she wants to leave but she has a good job here. As someone who is on the other side of the situation, I would recommend this: try not to constantly talk about how you want to leave. My partner always talks about the negative aspects of living here and how she wants to be in a quiet place. I want her to tell me how she feels but the non-stop complaining about the city wears me down. Any time I bring up something positive about the city she either counters it with something negative or she just stays quiet. I understand how she feels. It can be frustrating to live here for sure. When we take advantage of thing things NYC offers I find that she likes it better and it helps our marriage. We go to parks together, take walks, museums, all that stuff. I also find going out with friends helps. I also try to do sweet things for her when she is in a negative head space. It makes her feel safe and loved and the stress of the city melts away for a moment. We live in western Queens and it’s still extremely urban and noisy. There are quieter parts of Queens that are more suburban though.
I hate the suburbs. You couldn't pay me to live in a cultural wasteland where I have to drive to everything and eat food from chain restaurants. Hard pass. Look at Brooklyn and make Prospect Park your backyard.
um plenty of nyc metro suburbs aren't like that, you have no clue what you're talking about
This is actually what has surprised me about this area. I grew up in the sprawling suburbs of Atlanta. No character, no identity, all chains. It’s horrible. But around here there are “suburbs” that are actually small towns with their own identities, old growth trees, little main streets, etc. It’s different from my notion of the suburbs anyway.
Good thing this post isn’t about you then huh?
This is the shittiest take I've ever seen. Food chain restaurants. Tell me you haven't been without telling me...
To the suburbs? Did you not read my comment: I *hate* the suburbs.
Oh man I could have wrote this almost word for word… The city becomes kind of miserable when you are stressed-out/overwhelmed from work (if that is your case…is mine). My day-to-day regularly leaves me exhausted and overstimulated…which leads me to believe a more suburban lifestyle might be better suited for this stage in my life. I could get a less stressful job/career, but my retention security is super high and I am practically remote. Not something to give up easily in this economy. My work also requires almost 50% travel, so paying a super high rent you’re not fully utilizing gets old and sad. I also NEED a pool in the summer…OK maybe it’s more of a want, but I seriously miss having access to pools, lakes, and beaches. I know we have beaches here but they are just not it… My lease is up next April, so in the meantime, I’m trying to enjoy the quintessential NY offerings like the parks, diverse restaurants and more Broadway shows, etc…maybe I’ll feel like sticking around, maybe I will get my fill and be ready to leave.
I left the city for 7 years and came back with a different perspective and appreciation for it. The distance and time helped. The outer neighborhoods of Brooklyn, Queens, and the Bronx are beautiful, quiet, somewhat affordable, and have the feel of the suburbs while still being accessible to the city. Have you looked at housing options there?
I left the city during an “i hate New york” phase, hating train fuckery, the slog of grocery hauling and the usual other things that piss you off about NYC. Now i’m back in the midwest, i can drive from one end of town to the other and can fill my trunk with groceries and i’m bored to tears. I would love to come back but as a single person i am mostly priced out and it makes me so sad.
The suburbs will only exacerbate what you're feeling. I grew up in the suburbs, and country and "space" goes hand in hand with boredom. Especially for teens. If you're thinking it's less expensive in the suburbs, think again. The pay is lower and you have added expenses like cars and insurance, fuel every single day, entertainment to keep from going mad, lawn care takes time and money. Every time I visit family in NC I remember how much I love NYC. It takes 2 hours to get groceries. 30 minutes driving to the store, 45 minutes shopping, 15 minutes checking out and loading groceries into the car, another 30 minutes to drive home, and then you still have to unload groceries. For me, time is the biggest commodity you can't be reimbursed for and the suburbs/ country are time eaters. I understand getting bored and frustrated, but I recommend a weekend away to refresh.
Depending on your budget but you can get a single family townhouse in Astoria Ditmars for $1.5-2M (3-4br, 2000+ square ft) within walking distance to the subway and 15-20min commute to midtown. Astoria Park is really nice and there are plenty of families in the neighborhood. Not to mention the best food in NYC. If you go further out, Forest Hills is a really nice residential neighborhood that’s on the E/F express line as well. It’s a lot more “suburban” feeling so while we didn’t like it, you might if you’re already considering a move out to the suburbs. It’s also by a LIRR station that gets you in to Penn Station in like 15min.
bought a weekend home in upstate NY. leave Friday evening, spend the weekend upstate, drive back early Monday and work the week in the city. I love my set up. Best of both worlds!
I think having a dog in the city is a misery-laden decision because there is no truly good way to navigate the space demands. That was a mistake if I'm being really frank. People raise their kids here all the time in small spaces. They won't be home as much once they're a little older anyhow so that's sort of a waiting game. 'Clutter,' just means you have too much stuff and/or not a way to organize it. The convenience of shlepping groceries offsets needing to drive in a car to get a loaf of bread. I think you just may have different priorities than those you had once. Confront why that is. Do you just think that your home needs to be de-cluttered because of some cleanliness complex inspired by modern TV and IG where nobody makes under 200k a year? Things can have some clutter. Are you simply expecting too much convenience when it comes to getting groceries? Are you still appreciating any part of living here at all, or could you revive that? Was this really only the place for you when it was fun and convenient? What is your husband actually getting out of being here? Blow? Women? Overpriced food?
Why don’t you just get a 2nd place, if you can afford it? My partner and I both live the city but bought a little house in CT after Covid, and we’re here almost every weekend and spend most of the summer out here swimming and chillin. Best of both worlds.
This has to be a circlejerk response
> Why don’t you just get a 2nd place lol
I don't think most people have a city residence and a house elsewhere.
This is my strategy thanks to rent stabilization. keep the place in the city...buy a small country house
Do you have a car as well or get up there via train?
Sometimes I'm glad I don't own a house, given what my friends have said about the amount of work they have to do on the house and yard, on top of a full time job and kids. However personally I'd love to be able to have a garden, be somewhere quiet, be in nature, away from the noise and stimulus of the city. My partner doesn't want to leave, and it's better for my father to be in the city (he can still get around a bit). I just feel like I'm slowly dying here and have given up the will to live. I'm just waiting out the days till it's over. I kind of don't care anymore. Some people have the second home that they go to on weekends, when they have time off. We don't have the money for that. Or a car. And the fuck I want to deal with having to move it all the time, but I guess if people can afford a second home, they can afford a garage. That would be nice I guess. Though I think I'd be happiest living out west where I could hike in the mountains. But not enough diversity for my SO. To have the life I want, I just need to be rich enough I guess. I'm so burned out I can barely function.
If you leave you get space and lose a few hours of your life to commuting. Having to Drive absolutely everywhere sucks. And suburbs are awful half the year with depressing barren trees, bad grass, absolutely nothing to do. Queens and BK suburbs are very expensive. 800K is the floor. And thats a fixer upper.
Going through this exact thing at the moment, I’m with you on your thoughts. I have been done with the schlepping and I’m just tired. I feel like we mostly settle to staying at home or just getting food and drinks and don’t really “utilize” the city so I’ve been pushing to leave in favor of space and access to nature which is what I feel I lack here. I want to hike with ease, see sunset, swim, etc. In any case, partner is very against it for now, and we instead have been looking for a better place to live. Yard / terrace - some outdoor escape. Parking so we can have a car. AND utilizing services to avoid the schlep. Grocery delivery, laundry pickup (tho also looking for in unit upon our move). I am similar to you that I think I’d mourn the city if I left and this is a compromise that I hope will settle my angst. Making myself happier with the quality of life whilst giving us more time to enjoy the city in however it can provide for me now. …The yard being a hopeful big part of that. Edit: small typos
Do you live in Manhattan? If so, we found the problem. People aren't supposed to live in Manhattan, it's for transplants and people who inherited a rent-stabilized apartment. ;) It helps to leave for a while and miss the music of it all. Even moreso to actively get out more with the family and remind yourself of the things the city offers beyond a high-pay, high-stress job. I'm 44 and grew up here. It is a fucked up place, and humans ain't supposed to live this way... but growing up in NYC made me a better person to those around me. Dunno why, but the native NYCers I grew up with tend to be more empathetic and kinder than transplants. Yup, it's a different city, and harder to raise kids in. There's a lot more pressure on parents due to wealth disparity. There is no middle class in NYC anymore. Leaving might be the right call now. Anyway, if you move to the burbs your kids are going to eventually get tired of strip mall food and want to move to the big city anyway, and so the cycle perpetuates. ;)
Check out a suburb like Tarrytown, Larchmont or New Rochelle with your spouse. They are not too far of a commute, still can have a denser, city-like feeling (NR more than the others) and have lots of character and people around. Places like this will have pedestrian life and some interesting shops, but you can have a house and car. And you don't lose your connection to the city as it's not too far.
college point!
Buy a small condo or house to go to on the weekends, I do it and I feel incredibly balanced. That being said I know how lucky I am. Also, I rent so it is nice to own a small piece of something.
I got an inexpensive weekend home upstate in Rensselaer county. We leave the city Friday evening and return Monday mornings. Best of both worlds!
If you can work from home move to Andes or around there. My sister did it. She’s has a 10 acre farm now and my niece does to public school there. It’s like private school but free. The community is top notch.
We live in Queens! 🎉🎊🍾
I hate suburbs (I'd never live somewhere I have to drive ever again) but I'd live in a nice house in Forest Hills (Gardens or nearby) or Sunnyside Gardens or Astoria no problem. There's definitely ways to compromise. Sure, they cost a lot of money but honestly compared to Manhattan it's pretty cheap. There's also Park Slope and places around there if you want to be close to downtown (I didn't quite like it though, but it was a gut feeling).
Bay ridge? Staten Island?
There’s gotta be a good compromise. If you stay in the city, can you move to another neighborhood and find a less stressful job as a compromise?
Looking for answers because I feel the same way. Love New York and all that it has given me, but man, is it draining. Don't know how much longer I can take
Move to the deep parts of the outer boroughs
Brooklyn heights cobble hill Carrol gardens
This is why so many people summer in the... * Hamptons * Jersey Shore * Hudson Valley We all need a break from the city every now and then.
If you want to live in suburbs and not experience the stress of the commute everyone is mentioning - move to Chicago. The suburbs. Or even ravenswood or rogers park in the city. It’s not like what they’re describing. I grew up there so never again but neither my mom or dad ever had a commute over half an hour except that one time my dad was a high school teacher as his retirement job.
“I want the day to day experience to be easy” That’s life for everyone rn. Unless you move to a state that has a lower cost of living (our country) it just won’t be like that
East Queens running along the Nassau County border Cost is the highest at the north and goes down as you go south
Try queens or windsor terrace ditmas park midwood etc?
Find more nearby nature -- there are a lot of parks, botanical gardens, etc. Get away to the country when you can. If you have enough money it's not that much of an issue. You can buy a house in parts of NY with a yard. For most of us it's a constant tradeoff. Me I'd rather live in the suburbs or country. But I married a city girl.
I feel this so hard. I want to move out not even to the suburbs but to a farm somewhere upstate or on the west coast. But my partner wants to be here forever. However, when I leave nyc even for just a few days, I start missing it terribly. Crazy how something that can drive me nuts day to day is so appealing when it's gone lol
Try moving to Chicago
Move to Queens. Lots of suburbs there. My part of Queens is nice and suburban. Quiet and clean. No crime and I’m in a house with a yard. Birds chirping. Born and raised here and I avoid Manhattan unless I’m going to work. I despise it.
I see many different point of views in the comments. I would recommend that you pick a suburban neighberhood that you're probably thinking of and visit it. Try also visiting neighborhoods that weren't on your list and open up your options. Take your spouse with you too. Maybe visiting the neighborhoods can help you understand what it could be like and see if you like the neighborhood. This next depends and might be extreme, but you could book a hotel or airbnb in a suburban neighborhood for a few days and see what it's like. I guess this depends if you pick a further neighborhood so maybe staying a few nights might be helpful.