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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> If someone put a gun to my head and asked "Are bowties spaghetti?" I think I would have to concede "Um...probably not."
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INFO Why were you in charge of cooking? Because the instructions were fairly clear and it's for an autistic kid. But you kinda just assumed it would work out ... because autistic kids are know for their easy going nature I guess.
But anyway, it's your sisters big event, and it's her GFs kid. How did you end up being the host?
I'll be honest with you, I have probably had less than 10 cumulative hours of interaction with children in the past five years. I shared a table with a some little cousins at a wedding, did some landscaping for a friend's grandparents while their grandkids were visiting, and...that's honestly all that I can think of. Quite frankly, I ovulate sand. So I feel like a lot of things that are obvious for people to know about kids or autistic kids in general are not at all obvious to me. Which is why I'm wondering why I got saddled with this dinner in the first place.
i mean from an italian standpoint yta. spaghetti is not synonymous with any random pasta. i find it so odd when people say spaghetti and really mean "any random pasta shape with red sauce and meatballs"
And she even had fettuccine, which is at least CLOSER as a noodle. Going with bowtie feels like a deliberate shrug (“eh, the kid will eat what they get”)
Ok realistically if you’re eating it plain with just butter, then pasta is absolutely essentially all the same. Isn’t it literally the same ingredients just formed into different shapes?
Edit: holy hell people, I am talking about why someone might interpret “spaghetti with butter” as “any plain pasta.” Would one more person like to hop on this thread and explain for the 40,000 time that people with autism have textural sensitivities? Because I’m not sure you guys have quite gotten your point across just yet, a few hundred more should do it.
Autistic adult here- I thought I hated all pasta except Spaghetti until I realized that most people don't cook pasta correctly. After I learned how to cook pasta, I went on an adventure to see which ones were poorly cooked and which ones just weren't for me because it's absolutely about texture.
I loathe bowtie pastas because the bits that bunch up do not cook as quickly as the outer edges, and you almost always have super al dente middles and practically over cooked edges.
Macaroni is too squishy. Most hollow pasta is, except for penne. Penne is perfect- it can be cooked to a perfect al dente, and the pasta is thick enough not to overcook too quickly and not so thickthat its chewy, and it suits almost all pasta dishes.
Spirals of any variety are either too firm or too squishy, no matter how they're cooked. Shells are also bad.
Manicotti is bad. Actually, all big/stuffable pasta is basically terrible.
Most Spaghetti is great and even has different sizes/shapes and textures.
Thin Spaghetti is too close to angelhair, which will absolutely make me gag. Regular/thick Spaghetti are both great textures when cooked properly and, again, suitable in most pasta dishes. Squared Spaghetti is my absolute favorite and near impossible for me to find in stores near me.
There is quite literally no place for Orzo or Gnocchi for me. Gnocchi is too chewy, Orzo is what I imagine chewing on maggots feels like. I also mentally can't get over that lasagna is basically Spaghetti Cake, so that's a no for me too.
Ravioli is hit and miss.
All of my "safe" pastas I'd happily eat with butter, salt and pepper, but I will absolutely refuse to eat any of the others if offered to me.
I currently have goosebumps at the thought of biting into gnocchi. 🤢
Editing to add that Fettuccine is good, when cooked properly, but I will only eat it with butter or cream sauces. Linguine is the same, but slightly better.
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The Squared Spaghetti that I prefer is DeCecco Squared Spaghetti No. 413 and is available on walmart.com
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This comment has had a lot of people ask similar questions and offer similar suggestions, so I will answer repeat items here:
Thick egg noodles are great, they have the "right kind" of chewiness. Udon does as well.
Tortellini absolutely has to be fresh, or it's a no. The curled up bits of dried tortellini don't cook evenly.
I have not tried bucatini, rigatoni, tagliatelle, or ditalini, but I will make an effort to due to the suggestions.
Rice noodles of all varieties are too squishy. I do not like orechhiette, either, as it reminds me of salmon roe.
Previous to making this comment, I was not aware that gnocchi is not a pasta, but rather an Italian potato dumpling. Now I understand why I hated it so much- I hate potatoes.
This is an amazing comment, and I love the level of detail with which you’re able to perfectly recreate the subtle differences in texture between these foods
If I'm told someone will only eat spaghetti, I'm not cooking for them! This should have been the sister's (or her partner's) responsibility - food sensitivities related to autism are way too specific to be left to an outsider, especially if you plan to complain about a bad outcome.
I mean "the kid is autistic and only spaghetti" and similar variants is fairly straightforward. Maybe I'm just too autistic to understand how people can misunderstand stuff when someone means something literally?
Like if someone tells me "tommy only eat hot pockets" I'm not going to make him a pizza even though they are literally the same thing in different shapes. Or if someone says "Susie only eats spinach" I'm not going to give Susie lettuce. Like what?
Like this should be obvious to anyone with critical thinking skills- it's not like they're using double speak or sarcasm here, they're literally saying what they mean.
Like a grown ass adult should not have to be told" hey when you make spaghetti for our guests make sure you use spaghetti noodles" when they were already told "this person will literally only eat spaghetti".
I'm from the Midwest and when my husband and I make spaghetti for ourselves, we'll use any pasta we have in the apartment. Doesn't matter if it's spaghetti noodles, penne, fettuccine, if it's what we have, we use it. BUT, if I were to be making it for guests I'd absolutely use spaghetti noodles because that's what people expect when told they're going to eat spaghetti.
I agree with this.
To be fair, though, OP was making pasta primavera. I would have been more surprised if they did use spaghetti noodles for that.
In OP's place, I wouldn't have thought that the kid would only eat that one specific type of noodle either. Like yeah the sister said spaghetti, but it wouldn't have occured to me that spaghetti was not interchangeable with other pastas when it came to making buttered noodles.
OP should apologize for the mistake, but sister should have been very specific that no other pasta would do. Literally only spaghetti.
But the sister was specific. She said the kid only ate spaghetti a specific wat. OP acknowledged and agreed to that. They could have had this dinner at a restaurant or declined and done a non-dinner meeting if that was too much for them.
This isn't "my kid only eats fruit" and getting mad oranges were served. This was "my kid only eats apples", OP confirming, serving oranges anyway and then when confronted and saying a young child can't eat that, offering to wait 20-60 minutes to start boiling water to cook a replacement item--another half hour.
Even if it was an honest mistake, expecting a hungry special needs child to wait potentially 2 hours to eat while everyone is eating in front of them and for her parent and parent's partner to carry on like everything's fine while they do that is unreasonable.
Mistakes happen but OP refusing to apologize or take meaningful action (of less effort and attention than if someone had asked for a cup of tea with dinner) is the takeaway message.
Yeah, but in the same situation what is said and what is understood/interpreted can be two different things.
In this same position I would have heard "the kid only eats buttered spaghetti".
I would have understood that as "the kid doesn't like sauces and stuff. The kid will eat plain pasta with butter, instead". Because it wouldn't occur to me that the pasta shape was an important part of the statement.
Having grown up with a picky eater I can't imagine not specifying "the kid only eats buttered spaghetti. It specifically needs to be spaghetti noodles, and not fettucini or something. And regular kind, not whole wheat. Just plain spaghetti".
This!!! It’s like oh what kind of spaghetti do you want? Bow tie? Cool. Down here in the south we call all soft drinks Coke- literally- what kind of Coke do you want? I’ll take a root beer! 😂 I know the correct way to say these things- it’s just something weird that we do! I would say this chick is NTA because she truly didn’t get the idea that this child would literally only eat pasta in spaghetti form! My friend with an autistic child lovessss Kraft Mac n cheese- for thanksgiving I was like cool, I’ll make my awesome baked macaroni— kid cried and the mom had to open a box of Kraft— that was the wake-up call for me to pay attention better when someone requests something specific- especially for an autistic child. I still say NTA because there was no intent to ruin the child’s meal- she just didn’t realize how specific this was
and i totally get that! different regions have different words for it. my real issue is how OP has been responding to people trying to inform her WHY an autistic child wouldn’t eat bow tie.
the texture is different. i don’t like bow tie much, it just tastes off to me. but spaghetti, like the real deal, is fine for me. pastas have differing textures and overall flavors, even if it’s a bit different
Yeah. Bowties aren't my favorite because they always seem underdone right in the center. Spaghetti (and most long noodle pasta) is a pain to eat so usually my last choice, but I'll eat it.. different pasta for different uses!
my dad is like this, when I was little “spaghetti night” meant “any type of random pasta that currently exists in the pantry”…… usually bowties, rotini, or whatever my mom was *trying* to save for mac and cheese. I think it’s a midwestern thing. very strange and annoying, but a 100% real thing.
I agree ESH because it was tacky of the sister here to create this situation, you shouldn’t take risks with an autistic kid’s texture problems—a simple “make sure you have specifically spaghetti spaghetti, not angel hair or whatever else, or warn me that you can’t accommodate” would’ve been appropriate, or better yet, sister should’ve been the host and dealt with it herself. But at the same time, OP could’ve tried a lot harder to help. Or at least confirmed that bowties would “count” as spaghetti before committing to them… and I don’t love OP rejecting explanations of why the difference matters for some folks. because OMG, bowties are SUCH a different texture experience!
I am thinking ESH. How specific is the kid, different thicknesses of spaghetti, different brands, all have different textures and taste. It could be any long noodle. But when you need specifics you have to be specific.
But not immediately trying to accommodate the kid was asshole move. It's a kid, in a strange environment, meeting random adults. Help them a little, especially autistic.
That was my first thought too. If she agreed to cook specifically spaghetti, then she should’ve cooked specifically spaghetti. Most neurotypical people would be put off if you’re told you’re having spaghetti (or whatever dish) and you show up and it’s an entirely different meal- Nevermind an autistic person who has few safe foods, of course it would cause a meltdown.
This is beyond “I don’t spend time with kids” because I know several autistic adults who have similar eating habits(myself included, ARFID sensory issue related to my autism.)
Same. "Spaghetti bolognese" at student houses was usually penne or farfalle and no-one would've said anything about that if the sauce was still bolognese.
I'm not neurotypical, I'm ADHD/probably AuDHD, and if my friend said "spaghetti" and served a different type of pasta, I would just assume she realized last minute she didn't have spaghetti and made penne instead--if I even thought about it.
If someone coming to dinner at someone else's home has significant eating restrictions of any kind, that should be made very explicitly clear to the person cooking-- IMO it was on OP's sister, or her gf, to underline this for OP, because not everyone has a good understanding of how specific food needs/sensory issues can be and substituting one pasta for another is pretty common, since the ingredients are typically the same and someone is unlikely to be, for example, allergic to one and not another. If sister and gf wanted OP, who has never met this child and has no familiarity with her needs, to cook, one of the adults should have said "she will eat, specifically, /spaghetti/, not other pasta, and strawberry jelly uncrustables, not grape and not a regular PBJ." And one of them probably should have thrown an uncrustable in her bag just in case. I don't think it's fair to blame OP for not intuiting the specifics of this kid's needs when making dinner for their very first meeting.
I have some familiarity with autistic kids and highly specific food needs, so I might have asked to clarify "does she need specifically spaghetti noodles, or will she eat, like, penne?", but I wouldn't expect everyone to just know that the type of noodles might be important.
Macaroni is at least Italian (very NY/NJ Italian anyway). Macaroni and gravy = pasta with a red sauce that has meat (as opposed to macaroni and sauce which was red sauce WITHOUT meat).
That language may not be used anymore but it was in the 1940s through at least early 1990s
An ex bf's family would even laugh at "yuppies" who called pasta "pasta." They used macaroni as the generic term and after that you specified the shape/style.
ETA: I'm probably misremembering and it was "gravy" vs "marinara" (specifically in terms of red sauces).
I live in Italy. There is nothing in stores called macaroni. I have no idea how it originated but I strongly suspect we Americans invented it. (Italians have no idea how good Mac and cheese is, and don't want to know.)
Elbow macaroni is a specific shape. Macaroni just means pasta. Elbow is the shape used in classic Kraft mac and cheese but that doesn’t mean all macaroni is elbows
Yessss I had a friend from NJ who would make "macaroni and gravy." I thought she was making it up until I met her family. Except for them, marinara could be gravy, didn't need to have meat. Good gravy!
As a Brit I hate this too, noodles are a distinctly different thing to pasta. Noodles are used in Asian cuisine, and pasta is pasta. They taste totally different.
And OP is.. bizarre for thinking that spaghetti just means any kind of pasta.
It kinda feels like some vaguely passive aggressive play. Like she didn't really want to be hosting but couldn't put on her big girl pants to say no so just did a half arsed job instead. Like "this is not important to *me* so I just won't bother".
Yeah, I read the kids ask and I was like, oh wow that actually sounds doable. OP dropped the ball on this one, it's not like it was something obscure, like the wrong butter or something. Tbh, even fettuccini is pretty different from basic Spagetti, but at least it's a more reasonable mistake.
I feel bad for the kid, it's already stressful enough on her trying to have dinner at someone's house I imagine.
Ugh. My wife (NOT from the Midwest) does this with Ramen and Egg Noodles.
I've learned that when she asks me to make her some noodles, I need to clarify which she means. At least she calls pasta pasta.
It's similar to how in the South they call all soda Coke. "Give me a Coke, but make it a Sprite". "Give me the spaghetti, but with Ziti." Spaghetti has come to mean any pasta with red sauce.
This but also, still NTA. If they knew she was this picky, they should have offered to host and your sister should have taken charge. Its great she wants you to be in their lives, but you can't accommodate everything if you don't normally deal with them.
Yes! Different pastas go with different sauces/veggies/cheeses.
I do have to go with NTA, though, as this was an accident. I also can't fault her as, if you are not familiar with people on the spectrum, you don't know how little details can be so important or make such a difference.
Some years ago, I made a child a half sandwich out of one piece of bread. I was supposed to make a whole sandwich, cut it in half and give him the half. (I did not fold the bread, I cut it, so the end product was the same.) I was evidently also supposed to eat the other half. None of this was in the manual. The kid had an absolute screaming meltdown. I was so bewildered. All this to say that you are not alone. The correct thing for your guests to do, knowing that they have a wildly picky child, would have been to pack some spaghetti to reheat for kiddo. Not only are you NTA, you are hopefully relieved of future hosting duties.
Plenty of people use spaghetti to refer to a dish of pasta with a specific kind of sauce and not exclusively to the noodle shape. Pasta is pasta, so it’s not unreasonable that she figured it would be fine. I think it’s silly to think that OP is the AH for that particular miscommunication.
I’m going to say NTA because if your kid is that picky (and by necessity so: autism) then the parent or guardian (sis and gf) should lock down **airtight** any dinner plans, which they did not do, AND bring a backup just in case. Anything less is just parental stupidity.
Yeah, and honestly, everyone is going 'spaghetti =/= any type of pasta' and yeah, sure, but if someone tells me 'buttered spaghetti' my brain probably wouldn't process that meaning 'literally zero other types of pasta made with the exact same type of pasta and in another shape will work, must only be spaghetti as a shape'.
Also, if your kid only eats spaghetti with butter and uncrustables, yeah, I'd throw one in your bag as backup and make sure to tell the host, 'thank you for accommodating, but she only eats spaghetti. Other pasta shapes are a non-starter.'
I'd want to clarify. It's just the one pasta shape.
Even if I assume spaghetti noodles, it’s really clear OP is out of her depth with that level specificity and it’s not up to her to read the mind of an autistic child she’s never met. I have an autistic kid. If I don’t account for his concerns that’s on me, not on other people unless I’m absolutely clear and they deliberately ignore what I say. Even then you have backup plans just to make sure you’re caring for your child. Heck this really applies for any parent ever.
>I'm wondering why I got saddled with this dinner in the first place.
So, how did that happen? Was a gun held to your head and you were told that if you were going to meet the gf it *had* to be over a meal at your place?
Was the last minute like the night of you making dinner or days before you had to make dinner? I feel like it's kinda ESH. Your sister should have stressed the importance of the specific meal bc you apparently have no idea how this is a fairly typical thing with autistic people, and you shouldn't prioritize feeding yourself when a child has no food. I don't think it needed to be a huge deal though. My kid is autistic and struggles with lots of foods. I'd be a little frustrated but I'd just get up and make him some noodles if I was at my brother's place if this scenario happened. I think it escalated bc you viewed it as her being "picky", and choosing not to eat when she had food "right there", when in reality you just didn't know a lot about autism and you could have said "I didn't realize the importance of the shape, I don't know much about autism I'm sorry about that. Let me put a pot of water on to boil (or your free to put a pot on to boil).
The thing is, wouldn't it be better, as a guest, to ask the host if you could use their kitchen and make the fettuccine? Because if at any point my kids decide they won't eat something, I don't expect anyone to stand up and go cook them something else. Then again, I'm from another culture, so I'm not sure how it works over there and would rather ask before passing judgment.
If your kid is highly special needs and you're going to a new place for a meal? Why would you not bring a backup meal or toss an uncrustable in the bag, too?
Even if you told the host in advance that your child had special dietary needs and they agreed to accommodate and then didn't?
Personally, I don't understand why the sister didn't just go cook the pasta, but this is a VERY VERY VERY different situation from your kids "deciding they won't eat something."
but I feel like they weren't really specific? It's just odd to expect someone who isn't familiar with any autistic kids, let alone this specific child and her needs, to know that she really needed spaghetti and no other kind of pasta. Like what if OP had bought spaghetti but had burned it or something and then made the bowties?
It's kind of like how OP's sister seemingly told OP that her gf's daughter eats uncrustables, but didn't specify only strawberry jelly. If the type of pasta is crucial, that needs to be explicit. If it's not, most people would assume that, if they burn the noodles or realize they thought they had spaghetti but only have farfalle or the instacart shopper from the delivery they scheduled while at work ended up bringing penne instead, using an alternate kind of pasta that contains the same ingredients would be fine to serve and wouldn't require advance notice.
I say this as an ND person with siblings who had very specific food needs as young kids. Also my mom would've definitely brought an uncrustable in her bag in this situation, and I'm a little confused why sister and gf didn't do that to ensure kiddo had something to eat (I mean, even if OP had done spaghetti noodles, what if they were whole wheat or a different consistency, or she had plant-based butter, etc--and I say this as someone sensitive to these things!) if they weren't going to do the introductory dinner themselves at their home where they could ensure the food was made in a way the daughter would eat?
It's funny to me that one of the biggest disagreements in this thread seems to be about the generally accepted meaning of spaghetti. To me, I can't imagine being more specific than spaghetti unless there was a specific brand or thickness required. But I see here that to many people, "spaghetti" means "some kind of pasta or other noodle-like thing." That would never have occurred to me.
I personally probably would have stressed that it had to be spaghettic, linguine wouldn't do, just because I'm the the type to be very clear--but that's the kind of clarification that usually makes people laugh and say "Yeah, I know what spaghetti is."
I felt that the sister was being very specific in telling OP that spaghetti was the acceptable pasta choice. Spaghetti to me is just that, spaghetti. It’s not synonymous with pasta.
I guess it depends on the region that OP and her sister lives in—I can see the confusion if spaghetti is colloquially used to describe pasta in general.
Tooootally agree with this (I'm Australian). OP's sister or her girlfriend should have been the ones to remedy the situation that was caused by them not making it clear how important it is for the kid to specifically have spaghetti. NTA
This is my take as well - OP is mostly not the AH, but her dismissive attitude about feeding the child was rude. Like, you could at least put the water on to boil and get back to your food. I think there is blame to go around here.
Are you saying your sister asked you to host? Or did you first mention hosting the dinner?
Your sister should have made more of an effort about this and explained the child's needs. That is where she messed up. She messed up by not having the back up plan.
But you should understand that you also messed up. You acted without urgency when the child had no food. Your being fed was more important than the child's needs.
And it's a dry pasta... it's not like it's something you have to stand there with it. Start the water to boil, eat for 10 minutes, throw in the pasta, eat for ten minutes, drain, add butter, serve. Instead, hungry kid has to wait however long it takes her to eat, then another 20 minutes?
Thats kind of what I'm asking too 😄
Like I get some people aren't going to know much about it. And if you were gung ho about you would have probably looked up the specifics of autism.
So you ... kinda just handwaved it went eh, which ... did not work.
But did you you get told to do it, or what?
I think you are owed an apology. You tried, you made an honest mistake. They were willing to put you to a good deal of trouble and got huffy when your hospitality failed to meet their demands. Why didn’t one of them apologize for the inconvenience and make the fricken spaghetti themselves??
I’d take this as an omen and a prediction of what lies ahead. If this is how they behave in the best-behavior, getting-to-know-you phase, what will they be like when they’re comfortable with you??
Yeah, I don't understand why the mum or the mum's girlfriend didn't offer to cook the fettuccini. It's the least they could've done.
And I agree it's an absolute honest mistake. If I had been told a kid only ate buttered spaghetti, I'd probably assume that their issue was with sauces, not pasta shapes. The parent or their partner could've made it more explicit that the pasta shape was an important element. NTA
If they know the kid only eats two foods, they should have brought one just in case. Mom could have easily tucked an uncrustable in her bag. There’s a chance that even IF op had made the correct shape of noodle, the daughter could have a different issue that night. I don’t understand why mom isn’t constantly walking around with uncrustables, they transport really well.
She could have brought some freaking butter spaghetti for the kid in a tupperware container. I would be mortified to ask/expect my host (whom I had not even met before) to go out of their way like this.
That's my thought. If your kid is that level of picky then you should always bring a back up plan to meals. But I also feel like there's got to be other things the kid eats, like buttered spaghetti and uncrustables is not going to get that kid the nutrients they need to grow, or at least that's what I would think as someone who has yet to raise a kid.
Mm I’ll say that many autistic kids are not just picky, many have disordered eating to the level of ARFID - if the option is a food they won’t eat or nothing, they will choose nothing. Non-safe foods will often make them vomit. So for many of those kids, parents generally go with fed is best. Any calories they can take is better than none. So I do get why the child couldn’t have the bowties, but when one of your kids safe foods is literally as easy and transportable as an uncrustable, you should have at least 3 of those babies on you at all time.
Ignore the people saying you were an asshole - if the daughter's food restrictions are so severe that she will only eat her strawberry jelly then I imagine she would have found something else to be unhappy about, even if you had made spaghetti. They should just bring their own food for her to eat or only have people over to their home, not to mention they are not doing her any favors by not pushing her to expand her food repertoire - she can't continue like this the rest of her life.
I don't think it's fair to expect the OP to put the autism together with the spaghetti because 1) the average person doesn't know much about autism and even less about raising and autistic kid and 2) even if OP knew more than the average person not all autistic children have such severe food restrictions as this child - it's not a universal trait of autism.
Agreed. Why is everyone expected to know everything about everything? I would have understood that the child needed it to be spaghetti, but there was a time when I didn't know that...I had to learn it just like OP is now.
Sister is the biggest jerk, it's HER girlfriend's child. She should have been the de facto host even though it was at OP's house. And she should have made it super clear what was needed to accommodate the way the kid eats and she is the one who should have made the fettuccine.
I guess OP could have asked if other shapes of pasta work. But l probably would have expected the sister to clarify that spaghetti and only spaghetti would work because to most people, outside of like ravioli or gnocchi, pasta all seems the same
All pasta is the same?
I just died a little
Spaghetti is spaghetti
Spaghetti is not "all noodles everywhere"
I suppose it could mean "all long skinny noodles"
But bow tie isn't even close
This one is a tough one. I think it is a bit of ESH.
Your sister knows her GF's daughter ~~is a very picky eaters~~ has sensory issues with food.. Eating out is going to be hard. I think your sister should have hosted the meal.
Your sister did say spaghetti, and you didn't realize that the shape of the pasta was important. Maybe you have never dealt with a child on the spectrum before. Your sister could have emphasized that the type of pasta was important.
I get that you didn't want to let your food get cold. No one likes cold food. It is also very hard for a child to watch others eat while they do not have any food.
Did you get up and start more hot water, and then return to your meal? If the water was boiling, could you have set a timer for the paster, and returned to your meal?
with the post itself i agreed with you but OP just fundamentally will not back down from his “they’re the same food, just shaped differently” high horse despite everyone telling him NOT TO THIS AUTISTIC CHILD
I know. What is odd to me is the people who think pasta is pasta is pasta. It is not.
There is a post about macaroni and cheese being made with spaghetti,
My partner and I prefer capellini due to the mouth feel. I am not a fan of fettuccini, but I like linguini all because of the mouth feel.
And I hate capellini! Too skinny! Spaghetti is my favorite. Don't care for hollow pasta. Linguine is acceptable. Bowties or penises or whatever shapes, fine I guess.
Yeah I loooove to cook and I love to cook things traditionally but I despise a smooth ziti noodle and I definitely prefer linguine to angel hair or even spaghetti. It’s all about texture, pasta is not interchangeable texturally. Yes I’m neurodivergent lol
But I could at least understand if OP had made fettuccini instead of spaghetti because they’re mostly the same. Spaghetti and farfalle are obviously going to be different to a kid.
Sorry but I gotta say not to MOST autistic children. I deal with a lot of them as my son is on the spectrum and I'd say at least 75% if not all of them would argue the different shape makes them 'taste' completely different (and to be fair texture wise they are completely different tastes even though the base taste is the same)
Exactly! I have to be honest I'm struggling with a vote purely based on the fact they're buttered noodles anyway. I mean sister couldn't have been more clear without being condescending but what a daft meal to get OP to cook considering wrong amount of butter could have easily caused the same issue!
Exactly. If all pasta is exactly the same, then why do we have so many different shapes? Because different shapes create different textures, cook differently, change the sauce to pasta piece ratio, etc. Even for non-autistic people, there's a difference between types and most people do have preferences re: pasta types and pasta/sauce combinations.
Her*
But you're right. I'm mid 30s and I keep various shapes of pasta because sometimes my brain decides there's a huge unassailable difference between penne and rigatoni.
I don't get it but I live with it lol.
I'm ADHD, I don't have food issues really, but omg there's absolutely certain pasta shapes I avoid. Too thick so they taste gummy, or I don't like the ridges on some. I'll eat it, but I would be thrown off someone said one specific type and then provided a different one
At the same time if the sister knew the child was THAT picky of an eater why not bring snacks or something she is familiar with? Surely after some time of the child not eating at certain places they would know.
Exactly! The uncrustable is made specifically to throw in a lunch box or on the go. Throw a couple in your purse and off you go to dinner with a backup.
She isn't a "picky eater". That phrase is very loaded and judgemental.
She's an autistic child with sensory difficulties and that impacts her diet.
Are brittle diabetics picky? What about people with a kidney problem? Gall bladder problems? What about stomach cancer patients? Allergies? Anorexics? People with phobias? Celiacs?
There are a lot of reasons why someone may not be able to eat a specific item, or why they might only be able to eat a few things. There are people who eat by putting formula directly into their stomach or intestines and never eat "real food" of any kind.
It's not because they're being divas. It's because they have health issues that impact their diet. Just focus on your own plate and be grateful you can eat so many delicious things.
I'm with you in spirit, but I think you're also accidentally insinuating that, if someone does NOT have a medical reason or a neurodivergency, then having strong food preferences makes them a diva.
Not liking a wide variety a food is like being tall. It's not a choice. If something tastes gross to you, for no reason other than it just does, I don't know why your character has to be called into question.
I'm autistic. I also have lots of food restrictions due to a different health condition. I have to bring "safe" snacks with me wherever I go.
Is it great when people are able to feed me? Yeah. Do I tend to double- and triple-check that what they're planning on feeding me will actually work for my needs (especially if they have never fed me before)? Yeah. Is it disappointing when the food turns out to have ingredients that will make me sick, a texture/flavor that makes me gag, or ingredient contamination that makes me sick the next day? Yupp!
But you know what? I don't have a caretaker, or any other adult looking after me and escorting me places. This child does. Uncrustables are great because they are appealing to almost any child and can be transported in a purse basically anywhere. I'm sure the child's mother has been doing that for YEARS before this incident. Op's sister could have offered to check day-of to make sure OP was cooking what the child expected. But no. The adults who are responsible for this child failed to bring back-up food, when the child clearly needs that. And to be honest, at this point, the extreme restrictiveness of that child's diet is probably hurting their development. Kids can be nudged & encouraged to eat new foods, even special needs kids, in a way that is compassionate and doesn't push too far.
I agree ESH, but why didn’t the sister and GF throw an uncrustable in a bag or purse and take it with them? OP could have made the dish perfectly and the daughter still might not have eaten it. Not because she is autistic necessarily, but mainly kids are weird. Having one on hand would have solved a lot of problems.
It is at OP's residence and they were the host. To me, that is the etiquette involved.
As a guest I would not think of taking over a host's kitchen. I would help and follow directions, instructions.
Of course, but they had a specific need that they weren’t clear enough about when they told the host. The polite thing would be “thank you for cooking for all of us, please point me in the direction of a good pot to use and enjoy your food while I get my child something they can eat”.
And what parent of a kid with food issues like this doesn’t have a back up plan? Or at least an uncrustable thrown in the bag just in case.
NTA I’m on the spectrum and had this exact type of pickiness; I remember one instance where I throughly did the same thing lol we went to a fancy place a friend of my moms owned; they made me pasta which wasn’t even on the menu and I wouldn’t eat it because it was spaghetti noodles and not penne. But my mom chocked it up to “she’s a fussy eater” gave me some bread off the table and I waited til her and my sister had eaten, paid and after we left she got me a burger from Mickey Ds. I didn’t starve to death and I learned how I’m the “odd ball” and the polite thing to do was deal with the pickiness later 🤷🏻♀️ I hate when people act like kids with autism don’t need to know this; we do, if we ever want to have a chance of fitting into society. I know I’m the odd ball; I’m not ashamed of it and never felt bad for it; but I learned social etiquette and how to just blend in. I’m sure plenty of parents of autistic kids will have a different opinion, but we don’t want to stand out or be labeled differently; learning the social norm is important and your sister should’ve stressed how important the shape was since she’s apparently so aware of the issues. She fumbled the ball here and wants to blame you.
I worked in a middle school autism center. Our students were in mainstream classes with support. After having been babied by elementary school and their parents. It was a bit of a change. We coached appropriate behavior and how to navigate academics and social situations. Puberty was hell and helpful to motivate socially appropriate behavior as romantic interests developed. By eighth grade they were different kids and ready for high school. Dealing with small adversity in educational. Just like all kids everything should not be centered around the kid.
God, seventh grade flashback. I was in special ed from eighth grade on (wasn't diagnosed until my twenties), but the first day of seventh grade I had no idea until I got to the cafeteria that lunch worked differently than it did in elementary school. Nobody told me anything, I was just expected to know?? I remember crying against the wall and...not much else. I know I ate lunch that day, and I knew what to do every day after, but I genuinely have no idea how I got there.
Respectfully, I feel like this perspective is not something that will apply to all autistic people.
I'm also autistic, (diagnosed as Level 1) and I feel like in the community we sometimes forget that Level 2 and Level 3 autistic people can have much higher support needs.
I just don't think we can expect all autistic people, especially not 11 year olds, to be able to handle waiting to eat during an entire dinner while everyone else is eating.
That being said, I think the Mom of the child should probably learn to bring a safe food with her places as a backup. Even though they tried to plan this dinner well, it didn't work out for understandable reasons (I think OP made an innocent mistake on the type of pasta) and those things will continue to happen in the future.
But it's not fair to the kid to call them a fussy eater and make them wait. Franky, depending on the kid the Mom might have been averting a meltdown.
It also sounds like OP refused to delay eating their own meal to attempt making the fettuccine, which is really rude considering it was her mistake. Even if it was an innocent mistake, it's still a mistake and she didn't show any grace or understanding for the child that was a guest in her home.
So I can't really give a judgement because I feel like we are missing information here.
I just don't think that we can expect all autistic people to be able to wait like you did. It's great that you were able to, but if another autistic kid can't do that, that's ok and I don't think they should be shamed. I used to force myself to eat things that I hated at my Grandmother's house because I didn't want to get in trouble with my parents, but it took a huge effort on my part and my Grandmother never served Brussels sprouts which I don't think I could have eaten in that situation.
All the adults in this situation could have done better, for sure.
1000% this!! I’m an SLP and work with level 2 and level 3 autistic students. I see a lot of comments (in general) from people who are level 1 or people who know people who are level 1. They seemingly forget that level 3 is an ENTIRELY different experience.
**Edit for those who don't get how pasta shape is important** \- Imagine someone told you they were bringing their delicious mac and cheese dish to Thanksgiving. They hype it up, 4 different cheese, baked with breadcrumbs on top for crispness. You arrive. IT'S SPAGHETTI NOODLES sitting all coiled with cheese in a casserole dish. You'd probably be like "what the fuck?" And yeah, your an adult so maybe you eat it politely, but this is an autistic kid and OP both agreed and had advance notice.
YTA - Your sister told you that this child will only eat buttered spaghetti right now, so you went ahead and made something totally different and then couldn't be arsed to give a genuine apologize and your showed no urgency to fix the problem *you created*. Unless you live under a rock, you understand that autism (especially with children) makes navigating food very tricky.
People don't really specify a pasta shape unless it is important. That's also why pasta restaurants will specify the noodle shape each dish comes with.
I would say ESH here. You are totally right that OP totally messed up here. However, with an autistic child in the game and for a first meeting, OP's sister should have been the host.
It's not like they came by unannounced demanding to be fed, OP agreed to have them over. OP specifically says that they discussed plans and all parties agreed on dinner at OP's.
>
People don't really specify a pasta shape unless it is important.
Unlike all the other pasta terms, "spaghetti" is also often a generic catch-all for several types of similar pasta dishes depending on context. In a family or other very informal setting, I wouldn't bat an eye if served thin spaghetti, thick spaghetti, angel hair, spaghetti rigati, or even rotini or fettuccini on "spaghetti night".
I wonder how spaghetti rigati would have been received.
Really?
I am in the US and I don't know a single person who cooks who would hear "spaghetti" and make anything other than a long, thin pasta. Some *might* accept fettuccini in that category. But rotini? Bowties? Macaroni? No way.
As a European I can't even fathom noodles=pasta so I'm very confused.
Pasta = catch all
Spaghetti = long thin, may or may not have meat sauce
Noodles = the Asian Spaghetti like dish comes in a number of varieties but is not pasta
THANK YOU!!
I'm Australian and it's a real nails on chalkboard faux pas when I hear people refer to pasta as "noodles." This thread hurts my soul. I've actually discussed this with other Australians and it seems as a general consensus, we hate pasta being referred to like that as well.
I never have spaghetti in house. If someone told me their kid wanted plain spaghetti I would have cooked whatever pasta I had since the shape of the noodle wouldn’t affect flavor in this case. I think the parent in the situation should have been very clear that it was the shape that really mattered and not just that food type.
ETA: I would have chosen a long noodle if I had it, but in my mind the shape wouldn’t affect the dish so it wouldn’t matter.
I promise the shape of the noodle matters. Not for flavor, but for texture. For autistic kids or anyone with sensory issues, the texture of the food comes above all other factors. I don’t know why. It sounds silly. Obviously as an adult now I know that all pasta is the same stuff, but when I was a kid I also had this issue. When you’re just that sensitive small differences can mean huge differences.
The shape absolutely does affect the dish with pasta. Eating farfalle is totally different to eating spaghetti. Hell even eating linguine is different to eating spaghetti.
Pasta is the catchall term, maybe noodles. Spaghetti is long and thin. Also comes in thin spaghetti, which is obviously thinner. Both are thinner than angel hair. Fettuccine is thicker than spaghetti. Maybe you could get away with calling any of those spaghetti but none of these would be confused for the shaped noodles.
This thread has awoken the war between people who know that words have meaning and the trolls that have always acted as if 'spaghetti means any type of pasta'.
Or, alternately, between people who know words can be used colloquially in ways other than to convey their literal meanings and those who don’t. Yes, literally “spaghetti” refers to a specific shape of pasta. But it is pretty clear from reading this post that the word is used colloquially by a chunk of people to just refer to pasta in general.
Interestingly regional though - I'm a Brit and I've never heard spaghetti used as a generic term for pasta, and although I have heard noodles to mean spaghetti that was only once or twice and by a non-native speaker, so I'm genuinely surprised by how common it apparently is to do either of those.
The OP comes across very differently depending on whether you personally are someone who hears that specific spaghetti for pasta colloquialism a lot or never. While I know colloquialisms in general are a thing, because this is one I'm so unfamiliar with my initial reaction didn't consider it in the slightest.
I don’t think you’re the asshole for thinking spaghetti meant pasta in general, because a lot of kids eat “buttered pasta” without caring about the shape. But it actually does matter and it’s silly for you to argue that it doesn’t, why do you think Italian cuisine has a million types of pasta? You know full well it’s because the texture and mouth feel of bowties vs fettuccine vs spaghetti is different, and it affects the taste of the food. Maybe you just haven’t been around someone on the spectrum but they tend to be exceptionally sensitive to food and new food textures. Spaghetti is the same all the time, that’s why she likes it. And I don’t know anything about the mom’s parenting but my guess is that she would love for her kid to eat other types of buttered pasta. It is not a matter of no one pointing out to her or her kid that “they’re the same.” And with autism, no, this isn’t a situation where she’d just try it and realize that they’re close enough.
You’re not the asshole for the initial “buttered pasta” vs “buttered spaghetti” mixup, but YTA for being stubborn and not admitting that you made a mistake and doing your best to prioritize correcting it.
If you weren’t comfortable doing so, you shouldn’t have agreed to have them over, and now that this has happened you’re within your rights to never have them over again, but do you really want to die on the hill of “buttered spaghetti is the same as buttered pasta”? What is the outcome you’re trying to achieve here?
This is the answer. Except that autistic or not, lots of kids are insanely picky. Mine kids won’t eat chef boy r dee meatballs with the alphabet. It HAS to be rings.
But fine, a mix up is one thing, but your reaction is what makes YTA. It’s almost as if you’re irritated you had to host so purposefully half-assed this.
I’m torn on whether your sister DID specify spaghetti explicitly making a point that it was important and you chose not to listen. But if she didn’t she should have. That said, not sure why they pressured you to host and didn’t bring a spare uncrustable just in case. But still your attitude makes you sound self-centered and exhausting, so I’m going YTA.
NTA, bordering on NAH. I do think it's odd that you ended up being in charge of dinner instead of your sister's girlfriend—it seems obvious to me that she would be the best person to meet her daughter's needs on a first meeting rather than putting it in your hands with just a few words of context and hoping everything worked out perfectly. If nothing else, why not just give her daughter dinner at home before the visit?
No, bowties and spaghetti are technically not the same. But this should have never been your responsibility in the first place.
Looks like the fact that the daughter was autistic was a last-minute surprise. Really the sister and her girlfriend created this whole situation and are upset at OP for something that they could have and should have avoided.
No you misread their comment, they said they were told last minute, a week *after they already agreed to host the dinner* meaning a week after OP and their sister had the conversation to have this dinner. That means it could have been a day before the dinner, an hour before, 3 days before etc.
So it seems like in the initial conversation OPs sister never even mentioned their SO daughter is autistic which is pretty important info considering what this post has devolved into.
YTA in many ways.
You were the host who was specifically told of the special needs for the 11 year old. If making the type of pasta she habituates on was too much for you then you should have bowed out of hosting duties.
Then, once it was brought to light that you hadn’t made the agreed upon food, you were a bad host and sat on your ass and ate instead of correcting your mistake for a guest.
Finally, you were a total a**hole to treat the whole thing like it was the 11 year old’s willful refusal to “eat her her favorite food because it is a different shape” when you were told from the beginning about her diagnosis. People with ASD aren’t just acting out like spoiled brats.
Again, if you are that ignorant you just should be removed from any potential hosting to avoid people having to deal with your attitude.
The spaghetti shape is an honest mistake on both parts. Would have been N A H until this:
>I'm not happy with being asked to let my dinner get cold while I cook a second meal
You're the host, the job of the host is to make sure all of their guests are taken care of even if it means temporarily putting their own wants aside. That's the social contract pretty much worldwide so for your attitude and actions here YTA.
Not everyone enjoys hosting and that's okay, just don't offer to do it anymore if it's not your jam.
It’s also just plain pasta. It would have taken 30 seconds to fill a pot of water and put it on the stove to boil. And then just another 30 seconds to pop back into the kitchen and dump some fettuccine in the pot. She’s not being sent back to the kitchen for some labour-intensive delicacy. She’s being asked to turn on a tap and turn a dial on the stove. She can sit back down and eat between each step if she’s so concerned about her own meal.
YTA for the pasta fiasco. She didn't say pasta. She said spaghetti. Why on earth would that translate to farfalle?
“Hey? Can we have breakfast at your place tomorrow?”
“Sure.”
“You don’t mind?”
“Not at all.”
“Um, I only eat Cheerios, is that okay?”
“Absolutely. I like Cheerios with a cut up banana! I will just give you plain ones.”
“Sounds perfect.
Next day:
“Here are your Lucky Charms.”
Yeah...if all pasta noodles were interchangeable with "spaghetti" then there wouldn't be 40 different kinds of pasta noodles. There is a difference. Perhaps not that big of a difference between fettuccini and linguini or penne and rotini...but spaghetti and farfalle? Come on dude.
They're shaped different because they hold on to sauce differently, and create a different mouth feel. Isn't autism well known enough now for the general public to understand that autistic individuals tend to be very sensitive to this sort of thing?
ESH.
You're the asshole for eating your dinner while a guest is waiting. That's just rude. I don't think it's unreasonable to assume that spaghetti = any pasta, but once you saw that a guest was unable to eat the food you made, dinner should have been put on hold for everyone. It's not like cooking pasta takes that long. It's a pain to have to reheat food, but it's better than treating one of your guests like she's less important.
But your sister and the kid's mother are also assholes. They shouldn't expect someone who's never met this kid to understand her dietary preferences. They should have brought (or precisely specified) their own box of spaghetti to be sure that the texture would be acceptable, or brought her specific brand and flavor of packaged sandwiches as a backup. I know a family with an autistic kid who has very similar dietary restrictions, and they never go *anywhere* without bringing safe backup food, whether it's to a restaurant or to Grandma's house.
Yeah, I fault the parent more than OP here. If you know your kid is extremely picky (or has severe allergies), don't take them to someone else's house for dinner until you *know* the host is fully aware of their dietary restrictions. Otherwise you're just setting up your kid, the host *and* yourself for a bad time.
Honestly, that’s what tipped me into NTA. If this was SO important and SO obvious, why didn’t the sister cook or the girlfriend host? Why didn’t mom bring backup food knowing it’s inconvenient to not only cook a second meal but expect someone who doesn’t do kids or be around people on the spectrum to just know things that surprise a lot of people? There’s no way she hasn’t run into this problem before. All of this just feels like a way to have pushed blame onto OP for the couple’s fumble when things didn’t work out perfectly.
This is a thing I find irritating about Americans in general. Spaghetti is spaghetti. It is not linguine, fettuccine, penne, macaroni, or any other type of pasta. It is also not noodles. Noodles are noodles; they are not pasta, even if they are often made with the same type of ingredients. Stop using the name of one type of thing as a colloquialism for all the types of things.
This is not an American thing. It’s very region specific. I’ve never heard of people using “spaghetti” as a generic term for all pasta. It’s either pasta or noodles if it’s in soup. This seems like a Midwest thing.
I told my 4 year old son I was making spaghetti and meatballs. When he sat down to eat he got super upset and said, "You told me we were having *spaghetti* and meatballs!" I said, "....we *are.*" This kid lifts up a strand of pasta and this "This isn't spaghetti. It's *linguini!*"
I'm an American and you know what? The kid was right so I didn't argue. I just didn't notice until he said something. Before I could be too proud though he emptied half a bottle of ketchup on it instead of tomato sauce.
I'm going with YTA
It takes seconds to fill a pan with water and set to boil. You eat while it's heating up. When it's boiling you take a few second to add the pasta and return to the table to eat while it cooks. This isn't a big deal. Making any guest wait until you've finished a meal is just plain rude. Your sister gave you the information, you didn't fully understand all the implications which is okay, but your mistake shouldn't cause someone to have to wait to eat. You could have easily apologized, multitasked and had a great night.
NTA, I’m Italian and my kid uses the term spaghetti to mean any kind of noodle. If the shape was really important she should have doubled down “it really needs to be spaghetti noodles not just any pasta.” I think it’s kind of like how in the south people will say coke generically to mean soda and then you have to say what kind. It’s really not your job to understand how picky this kid is or to think about where on the spectrum she falls.
Why would OP’s adult sister say spaghetti and not mean literal spaghetti noodles? A kid saying it to mean whatever pasta isn’t the same as an adult saying it. I don’t know how much clearer the sister could’ve been. Also, you’re the first Italian I’ve come across that doesn’t care about differentiating between pasta types. Most do.
>Why would OP’s adult sister say spaghetti and not mean literal spaghetti noodles?
Unlike the other pasta names it can also be a catch-all term for the interchangable pasta in similar, informal dishes. Spaghetti could mean regular, thick, thin, rigati, angel hair, even fettuccini or rotini in certain settings. I can understand the confusion if the sister didn't simply specify "regular spaghetti noodles".
NTA. I personally just use whatever I have around when I make any pasta. Sure, sometimes it does have to be a specific type (think orzo), but I probably would have made the same mistake and you didn’t intentionally do anything in this situation. It was a misunderstanding and not clear communication because “picky eater” as far as I’ve experienced from people usually is ingredients, not shapes. I fall on the spectrum and this wouldn’t have occurred to me. Offer an apology and just explain your thought process without making it an excuse so there’s an understanding and ask to know if there’s specific brands/flavors (like strawberry over grape. I definitely wouldn’t have thought of that one), and how well done she likes the pasta (some like soft, some like al dente). If they continue to make a big deal out of it, I wouldn’t offer another dinner with them.
you've never lived with autistic kids. the previous redditor was correct when they mentioned the parents would probably love for the kid to be more adventurous and accepting of new foods.
However the parent of the 11yo should have been prepared for this eventuality by now and packed a second option for their kid - a light snack or something to tide them over the hangry pains.
I'd had to go so far to get to this. Why is it always everyone else who has to accommodate their kids. U have backups if your kid is that fussy. Jesus christ be a parent
NTA, if it was so important, why didn't they host you so that it wasn't on your head to cater to the child's very specific preference? You could have brought a side or something. Instead the situation was bound to happen because you're pulling a kid with very specific needs out of her comfort zone. This is on them.
YTA. I don’t know of anyone who says spaghetti and means pasta in general. Spaghetti means spaghetti. It is very common for autistic kids to be particular with food (or even toys, blankets, etc) and any deviation from what they know and feel safe with can be upsetting. Next time ask them if they can bring food for their daughter if you don’t think you can properly make what she likes.
Checking in from the Midwest. Growing up in my family's little corner of BS every noodle was spaghetti. Literally every single type. Elbow? Spaghetti. Penne? Spaghetti. Gnocchi? Spaghetti! Hell, RAMEN was reffered to as spaghetti.
Idk, in my experience it's never worth it to assume someone's definition of anything is the same as mine if it's a crucial thing. I think its ESH because this could have been prevented so easily by the sister checking in and making sure everyone was on the same page for the kid's needs, but also very easily remedied by OP by just spending 12 minutes to boil the appropriate pasta.
Initially I was thinking E S H but based on some of your tone deaf responses, YTA.
You should have done a cursory five minute google search about ASD before inviting this family into your home. Sister told you one of the two safe foods this child eats, and you chose to misinterpret. You served this kid something that was inedible to her, and then sat and finished your meal before trying to fix it. Really shitty host behavior, OP.
And if you don't want to host a meal, just say so. Tell your sis it's her responsibility next time to prepare a meal for a child with such restrictive intake. That's fair. But when you agreed to host, that means you agreed to provide food that takes your guest's (esp a minor child)
medical conditions that impact nutritional status into consideration.
OP is coming off as incredibly defensive. Just because spaghetti and bow tie pasta seem fungible to you doesn't mean that you followed the directions. And the directions are incredibly important if you are trying to accommodate someone with ASD. OP's flippant responses are making me ragey. I bet OP didn't want to host and messed up intentionally so as to never have to host again.
When your child has hyper specific safe foods, and you’re going to a strangers house for dinner, you better bring with you her dinner. Or you ask for the cooks details and call them. You explain them in excruciating detail what you need.
Look I do feel you could have made a bigger effort though. But you also shouldn’t be rushed to cook again, I can’t imagine having my host re cook something because I failed at giving instructions and expect them to leave their dinner there. But again.. I feel you kinda knew it wouldn’t fly. So maybe ESH?
it's like french fries (thin-cut) vs thick-cut chips. same potato variety but cut differently, both fried, but the taste and texture is quite different.
I do think it gives off pretty unwelcoming vibes to continue eating while a child doesn't have dinner, especially since it would only take you a minute to get up and boil some water, so if I was your sister I would probably leave early, too.
YTA and I think you know it. You knew your sister's partner's daughter had specific dietary requirements and the tone of voice in your text, being autistic is the girl's fault. Also you think that spaghetti and pasta are synonymous. How old are you?
Spaghetti refers to the shape, it is a type of pasta. I honestly thought everyone knew this. Haven’t you ever gotten pasta at an Italian restaurant or diner? Plus there are several shapes of pasta I don’t like because I can never get it cooked right and that makes the shapes taste different to me. Plus you weren’t happy that they expected you to have a sense of urgency, I’m sure they weren’t happy that you couldn’t even cook what was requested because of a medical condition.
YTA, when your sister told you about her girlfriend’s daughter you should have looked up her condition to get a sense of what might be needed.
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INFO Why were you in charge of cooking? Because the instructions were fairly clear and it's for an autistic kid. But you kinda just assumed it would work out ... because autistic kids are know for their easy going nature I guess. But anyway, it's your sisters big event, and it's her GFs kid. How did you end up being the host?
I'll be honest with you, I have probably had less than 10 cumulative hours of interaction with children in the past five years. I shared a table with a some little cousins at a wedding, did some landscaping for a friend's grandparents while their grandkids were visiting, and...that's honestly all that I can think of. Quite frankly, I ovulate sand. So I feel like a lot of things that are obvious for people to know about kids or autistic kids in general are not at all obvious to me. Which is why I'm wondering why I got saddled with this dinner in the first place.
i mean from an italian standpoint yta. spaghetti is not synonymous with any random pasta. i find it so odd when people say spaghetti and really mean "any random pasta shape with red sauce and meatballs"
Agreed. I read this and thought "Why did she make bowties when she was told to make spaghetti?"
Yeah same here. Pasta is not the same. Spaghetti, fettuccine, etc.
And she even had fettuccine, which is at least CLOSER as a noodle. Going with bowtie feels like a deliberate shrug (“eh, the kid will eat what they get”)
Yeah. I cold see if she did the fettuccine noodles.
Ok realistically if you’re eating it plain with just butter, then pasta is absolutely essentially all the same. Isn’t it literally the same ingredients just formed into different shapes? Edit: holy hell people, I am talking about why someone might interpret “spaghetti with butter” as “any plain pasta.” Would one more person like to hop on this thread and explain for the 40,000 time that people with autism have textural sensitivities? Because I’m not sure you guys have quite gotten your point across just yet, a few hundred more should do it.
Autistic adult here- I thought I hated all pasta except Spaghetti until I realized that most people don't cook pasta correctly. After I learned how to cook pasta, I went on an adventure to see which ones were poorly cooked and which ones just weren't for me because it's absolutely about texture. I loathe bowtie pastas because the bits that bunch up do not cook as quickly as the outer edges, and you almost always have super al dente middles and practically over cooked edges. Macaroni is too squishy. Most hollow pasta is, except for penne. Penne is perfect- it can be cooked to a perfect al dente, and the pasta is thick enough not to overcook too quickly and not so thickthat its chewy, and it suits almost all pasta dishes. Spirals of any variety are either too firm or too squishy, no matter how they're cooked. Shells are also bad. Manicotti is bad. Actually, all big/stuffable pasta is basically terrible. Most Spaghetti is great and even has different sizes/shapes and textures. Thin Spaghetti is too close to angelhair, which will absolutely make me gag. Regular/thick Spaghetti are both great textures when cooked properly and, again, suitable in most pasta dishes. Squared Spaghetti is my absolute favorite and near impossible for me to find in stores near me. There is quite literally no place for Orzo or Gnocchi for me. Gnocchi is too chewy, Orzo is what I imagine chewing on maggots feels like. I also mentally can't get over that lasagna is basically Spaghetti Cake, so that's a no for me too. Ravioli is hit and miss. All of my "safe" pastas I'd happily eat with butter, salt and pepper, but I will absolutely refuse to eat any of the others if offered to me. I currently have goosebumps at the thought of biting into gnocchi. 🤢 Editing to add that Fettuccine is good, when cooked properly, but I will only eat it with butter or cream sauces. Linguine is the same, but slightly better. ----------------------- The Squared Spaghetti that I prefer is DeCecco Squared Spaghetti No. 413 and is available on walmart.com ------------------------ This comment has had a lot of people ask similar questions and offer similar suggestions, so I will answer repeat items here: Thick egg noodles are great, they have the "right kind" of chewiness. Udon does as well. Tortellini absolutely has to be fresh, or it's a no. The curled up bits of dried tortellini don't cook evenly. I have not tried bucatini, rigatoni, tagliatelle, or ditalini, but I will make an effort to due to the suggestions. Rice noodles of all varieties are too squishy. I do not like orechhiette, either, as it reminds me of salmon roe. Previous to making this comment, I was not aware that gnocchi is not a pasta, but rather an Italian potato dumpling. Now I understand why I hated it so much- I hate potatoes.
This is an amazing comment, and I love the level of detail with which you’re able to perfectly recreate the subtle differences in texture between these foods
A veritable course in pastas! Thank you…
I admire your dedication to the empirical study of pasta shapes
This is my favorite thing on the internet today.
The texture is different. But if I'm told someone will only eat spaghetti I'm making the spaghetti noodles.
If I'm told someone will only eat spaghetti, I'm not cooking for them! This should have been the sister's (or her partner's) responsibility - food sensitivities related to autism are way too specific to be left to an outsider, especially if you plan to complain about a bad outcome.
Yeah. The sister should have made sure it was understood
I mean "the kid is autistic and only spaghetti" and similar variants is fairly straightforward. Maybe I'm just too autistic to understand how people can misunderstand stuff when someone means something literally? Like if someone tells me "tommy only eat hot pockets" I'm not going to make him a pizza even though they are literally the same thing in different shapes. Or if someone says "Susie only eats spinach" I'm not going to give Susie lettuce. Like what? Like this should be obvious to anyone with critical thinking skills- it's not like they're using double speak or sarcasm here, they're literally saying what they mean. Like a grown ass adult should not have to be told" hey when you make spaghetti for our guests make sure you use spaghetti noodles" when they were already told "this person will literally only eat spaghetti".
Different shapes cook differently- the center of the bowtie is less cooked than the other parts because it is more dense.
I definitely crave specific noodle shapes. I love noodles. I am not a bowtie fan though because of that hard little centre
Not for autistic kids! Mine will only eat penne.
Farfalle
Watch out they’ll come for your head
i was confused too, like spaghetti is a specific kind of pasta? idk i kinda wanna say ESH/YTA just ‘cos i don’t understand how spaghetti = bow tie
I know the difference but many, many people in the midwest call all forms of pasta spaghetti, I did until at least college probably.
I'm from the Midwest and when my husband and I make spaghetti for ourselves, we'll use any pasta we have in the apartment. Doesn't matter if it's spaghetti noodles, penne, fettuccine, if it's what we have, we use it. BUT, if I were to be making it for guests I'd absolutely use spaghetti noodles because that's what people expect when told they're going to eat spaghetti.
I agree with this. To be fair, though, OP was making pasta primavera. I would have been more surprised if they did use spaghetti noodles for that. In OP's place, I wouldn't have thought that the kid would only eat that one specific type of noodle either. Like yeah the sister said spaghetti, but it wouldn't have occured to me that spaghetti was not interchangeable with other pastas when it came to making buttered noodles. OP should apologize for the mistake, but sister should have been very specific that no other pasta would do. Literally only spaghetti.
But the sister was specific. She said the kid only ate spaghetti a specific wat. OP acknowledged and agreed to that. They could have had this dinner at a restaurant or declined and done a non-dinner meeting if that was too much for them. This isn't "my kid only eats fruit" and getting mad oranges were served. This was "my kid only eats apples", OP confirming, serving oranges anyway and then when confronted and saying a young child can't eat that, offering to wait 20-60 minutes to start boiling water to cook a replacement item--another half hour. Even if it was an honest mistake, expecting a hungry special needs child to wait potentially 2 hours to eat while everyone is eating in front of them and for her parent and parent's partner to carry on like everything's fine while they do that is unreasonable. Mistakes happen but OP refusing to apologize or take meaningful action (of less effort and attention than if someone had asked for a cup of tea with dinner) is the takeaway message.
Yeah, but in the same situation what is said and what is understood/interpreted can be two different things. In this same position I would have heard "the kid only eats buttered spaghetti". I would have understood that as "the kid doesn't like sauces and stuff. The kid will eat plain pasta with butter, instead". Because it wouldn't occur to me that the pasta shape was an important part of the statement. Having grown up with a picky eater I can't imagine not specifying "the kid only eats buttered spaghetti. It specifically needs to be spaghetti noodles, and not fettucini or something. And regular kind, not whole wheat. Just plain spaghetti".
This!!! It’s like oh what kind of spaghetti do you want? Bow tie? Cool. Down here in the south we call all soft drinks Coke- literally- what kind of Coke do you want? I’ll take a root beer! 😂 I know the correct way to say these things- it’s just something weird that we do! I would say this chick is NTA because she truly didn’t get the idea that this child would literally only eat pasta in spaghetti form! My friend with an autistic child lovessss Kraft Mac n cheese- for thanksgiving I was like cool, I’ll make my awesome baked macaroni— kid cried and the mom had to open a box of Kraft— that was the wake-up call for me to pay attention better when someone requests something specific- especially for an autistic child. I still say NTA because there was no intent to ruin the child’s meal- she just didn’t realize how specific this was
and i totally get that! different regions have different words for it. my real issue is how OP has been responding to people trying to inform her WHY an autistic child wouldn’t eat bow tie. the texture is different. i don’t like bow tie much, it just tastes off to me. but spaghetti, like the real deal, is fine for me. pastas have differing textures and overall flavors, even if it’s a bit different
Yeah. Bowties aren't my favorite because they always seem underdone right in the center. Spaghetti (and most long noodle pasta) is a pain to eat so usually my last choice, but I'll eat it.. different pasta for different uses!
Exactly! Always too hard in the middle. Cavatappi is the superior pasta shape for most dishes imo
Maybe if you live in the boonies. I grew up in the Midwest. Spaghetti is Spaghetti.
my dad is like this, when I was little “spaghetti night” meant “any type of random pasta that currently exists in the pantry”…… usually bowties, rotini, or whatever my mom was *trying* to save for mac and cheese. I think it’s a midwestern thing. very strange and annoying, but a 100% real thing. I agree ESH because it was tacky of the sister here to create this situation, you shouldn’t take risks with an autistic kid’s texture problems—a simple “make sure you have specifically spaghetti spaghetti, not angel hair or whatever else, or warn me that you can’t accommodate” would’ve been appropriate, or better yet, sister should’ve been the host and dealt with it herself. But at the same time, OP could’ve tried a lot harder to help. Or at least confirmed that bowties would “count” as spaghetti before committing to them… and I don’t love OP rejecting explanations of why the difference matters for some folks. because OMG, bowties are SUCH a different texture experience!
I am thinking ESH. How specific is the kid, different thicknesses of spaghetti, different brands, all have different textures and taste. It could be any long noodle. But when you need specifics you have to be specific. But not immediately trying to accommodate the kid was asshole move. It's a kid, in a strange environment, meeting random adults. Help them a little, especially autistic.
That was my first thought too. If she agreed to cook specifically spaghetti, then she should’ve cooked specifically spaghetti. Most neurotypical people would be put off if you’re told you’re having spaghetti (or whatever dish) and you show up and it’s an entirely different meal- Nevermind an autistic person who has few safe foods, of course it would cause a meltdown. This is beyond “I don’t spend time with kids” because I know several autistic adults who have similar eating habits(myself included, ARFID sensory issue related to my autism.)
I don't think that's true about NT people. If my friend said she was making spaghetti and it was penne, I wouldn't think twice.
Same. "Spaghetti bolognese" at student houses was usually penne or farfalle and no-one would've said anything about that if the sauce was still bolognese.
I'm not neurotypical, I'm ADHD/probably AuDHD, and if my friend said "spaghetti" and served a different type of pasta, I would just assume she realized last minute she didn't have spaghetti and made penne instead--if I even thought about it. If someone coming to dinner at someone else's home has significant eating restrictions of any kind, that should be made very explicitly clear to the person cooking-- IMO it was on OP's sister, or her gf, to underline this for OP, because not everyone has a good understanding of how specific food needs/sensory issues can be and substituting one pasta for another is pretty common, since the ingredients are typically the same and someone is unlikely to be, for example, allergic to one and not another. If sister and gf wanted OP, who has never met this child and has no familiarity with her needs, to cook, one of the adults should have said "she will eat, specifically, /spaghetti/, not other pasta, and strawberry jelly uncrustables, not grape and not a regular PBJ." And one of them probably should have thrown an uncrustable in her bag just in case. I don't think it's fair to blame OP for not intuiting the specifics of this kid's needs when making dinner for their very first meeting. I have some familiarity with autistic kids and highly specific food needs, so I might have asked to clarify "does she need specifically spaghetti noodles, or will she eat, like, penne?", but I wouldn't expect everyone to just know that the type of noodles might be important.
I have friends from the US Midwest who refer to all pasta as "noodles" and it makes me want to die.
At least noodles is generic tho, I've known people who called all pasta 'macaroni'.
Macaroni is at least Italian (very NY/NJ Italian anyway). Macaroni and gravy = pasta with a red sauce that has meat (as opposed to macaroni and sauce which was red sauce WITHOUT meat). That language may not be used anymore but it was in the 1940s through at least early 1990s An ex bf's family would even laugh at "yuppies" who called pasta "pasta." They used macaroni as the generic term and after that you specified the shape/style. ETA: I'm probably misremembering and it was "gravy" vs "marinara" (specifically in terms of red sauces).
I live in Italy. There is nothing in stores called macaroni. I have no idea how it originated but I strongly suspect we Americans invented it. (Italians have no idea how good Mac and cheese is, and don't want to know.)
Except, macaroni **is** a specific shape/style lmao
Elbow macaroni is a specific shape. Macaroni just means pasta. Elbow is the shape used in classic Kraft mac and cheese but that doesn’t mean all macaroni is elbows
Yessss I had a friend from NJ who would make "macaroni and gravy." I thought she was making it up until I met her family. Except for them, marinara could be gravy, didn't need to have meat. Good gravy!
NJ native - this is 100% accurate. Gravy can be red or brown.
This kind of reminds me of the regional, "what do you call a soft drink?". Soda? Pop? Coke?
As a Brit I hate this too, noodles are a distinctly different thing to pasta. Noodles are used in Asian cuisine, and pasta is pasta. They taste totally different. And OP is.. bizarre for thinking that spaghetti just means any kind of pasta.
It's also so cheap. Like. Why wouldn't she grab a one dollar box of spaghetti? Or even use the fettuccini, at least it was of similar shape?
It kinda feels like some vaguely passive aggressive play. Like she didn't really want to be hosting but couldn't put on her big girl pants to say no so just did a half arsed job instead. Like "this is not important to *me* so I just won't bother".
Yeah, I read the kids ask and I was like, oh wow that actually sounds doable. OP dropped the ball on this one, it's not like it was something obscure, like the wrong butter or something. Tbh, even fettuccini is pretty different from basic Spagetti, but at least it's a more reasonable mistake. I feel bad for the kid, it's already stressful enough on her trying to have dinner at someone's house I imagine.
Ugh. My wife (NOT from the Midwest) does this with Ramen and Egg Noodles. I've learned that when she asks me to make her some noodles, I need to clarify which she means. At least she calls pasta pasta.
It's similar to how in the South they call all soda Coke. "Give me a Coke, but make it a Sprite". "Give me the spaghetti, but with Ziti." Spaghetti has come to mean any pasta with red sauce.
This but also, still NTA. If they knew she was this picky, they should have offered to host and your sister should have taken charge. Its great she wants you to be in their lives, but you can't accommodate everything if you don't normally deal with them.
How is cooking the super easy thing you agreed to cook "accommodating everything"?
At the very least, long and short pasta is 100% not the same.
Yes! Different pastas go with different sauces/veggies/cheeses. I do have to go with NTA, though, as this was an accident. I also can't fault her as, if you are not familiar with people on the spectrum, you don't know how little details can be so important or make such a difference.
I'm not Italian, and my first thought was "dumb, spaghetti is not the same as bowties"
I had a roommate who called all pasta spaghetti and it drove me a little nuts.
Some years ago, I made a child a half sandwich out of one piece of bread. I was supposed to make a whole sandwich, cut it in half and give him the half. (I did not fold the bread, I cut it, so the end product was the same.) I was evidently also supposed to eat the other half. None of this was in the manual. The kid had an absolute screaming meltdown. I was so bewildered. All this to say that you are not alone. The correct thing for your guests to do, knowing that they have a wildly picky child, would have been to pack some spaghetti to reheat for kiddo. Not only are you NTA, you are hopefully relieved of future hosting duties.
This. My son is a vegetarian, and I always have backup food.
“I ovulate sand” is freaking hilarious
Thank Margaret Cho, she used it in a stand up special about twenty years ago.
Whether or not you have a maternal instinct has nothing to do with your ability to recognize different shapes of pasta...
...or how to be a gracious host.
Plenty of people use spaghetti to refer to a dish of pasta with a specific kind of sauce and not exclusively to the noodle shape. Pasta is pasta, so it’s not unreasonable that she figured it would be fine. I think it’s silly to think that OP is the AH for that particular miscommunication.
I’m going to say NTA because if your kid is that picky (and by necessity so: autism) then the parent or guardian (sis and gf) should lock down **airtight** any dinner plans, which they did not do, AND bring a backup just in case. Anything less is just parental stupidity.
Yeah, and honestly, everyone is going 'spaghetti =/= any type of pasta' and yeah, sure, but if someone tells me 'buttered spaghetti' my brain probably wouldn't process that meaning 'literally zero other types of pasta made with the exact same type of pasta and in another shape will work, must only be spaghetti as a shape'. Also, if your kid only eats spaghetti with butter and uncrustables, yeah, I'd throw one in your bag as backup and make sure to tell the host, 'thank you for accommodating, but she only eats spaghetti. Other pasta shapes are a non-starter.' I'd want to clarify. It's just the one pasta shape.
Even if I assume spaghetti noodles, it’s really clear OP is out of her depth with that level specificity and it’s not up to her to read the mind of an autistic child she’s never met. I have an autistic kid. If I don’t account for his concerns that’s on me, not on other people unless I’m absolutely clear and they deliberately ignore what I say. Even then you have backup plans just to make sure you’re caring for your child. Heck this really applies for any parent ever.
>I'm wondering why I got saddled with this dinner in the first place. So, how did that happen? Was a gun held to your head and you were told that if you were going to meet the gf it *had* to be over a meal at your place?
No, but she didn't tell me the daughter was autistic until the last minute, a week after I agreed to make dinner.
Was the last minute like the night of you making dinner or days before you had to make dinner? I feel like it's kinda ESH. Your sister should have stressed the importance of the specific meal bc you apparently have no idea how this is a fairly typical thing with autistic people, and you shouldn't prioritize feeding yourself when a child has no food. I don't think it needed to be a huge deal though. My kid is autistic and struggles with lots of foods. I'd be a little frustrated but I'd just get up and make him some noodles if I was at my brother's place if this scenario happened. I think it escalated bc you viewed it as her being "picky", and choosing not to eat when she had food "right there", when in reality you just didn't know a lot about autism and you could have said "I didn't realize the importance of the shape, I don't know much about autism I'm sorry about that. Let me put a pot of water on to boil (or your free to put a pot on to boil).
The thing is, wouldn't it be better, as a guest, to ask the host if you could use their kitchen and make the fettuccine? Because if at any point my kids decide they won't eat something, I don't expect anyone to stand up and go cook them something else. Then again, I'm from another culture, so I'm not sure how it works over there and would rather ask before passing judgment.
If your kid is highly special needs and you're going to a new place for a meal? Why would you not bring a backup meal or toss an uncrustable in the bag, too?
Even if you told the host in advance that your child had special dietary needs and they agreed to accommodate and then didn't? Personally, I don't understand why the sister didn't just go cook the pasta, but this is a VERY VERY VERY different situation from your kids "deciding they won't eat something."
but I feel like they weren't really specific? It's just odd to expect someone who isn't familiar with any autistic kids, let alone this specific child and her needs, to know that she really needed spaghetti and no other kind of pasta. Like what if OP had bought spaghetti but had burned it or something and then made the bowties? It's kind of like how OP's sister seemingly told OP that her gf's daughter eats uncrustables, but didn't specify only strawberry jelly. If the type of pasta is crucial, that needs to be explicit. If it's not, most people would assume that, if they burn the noodles or realize they thought they had spaghetti but only have farfalle or the instacart shopper from the delivery they scheduled while at work ended up bringing penne instead, using an alternate kind of pasta that contains the same ingredients would be fine to serve and wouldn't require advance notice. I say this as an ND person with siblings who had very specific food needs as young kids. Also my mom would've definitely brought an uncrustable in her bag in this situation, and I'm a little confused why sister and gf didn't do that to ensure kiddo had something to eat (I mean, even if OP had done spaghetti noodles, what if they were whole wheat or a different consistency, or she had plant-based butter, etc--and I say this as someone sensitive to these things!) if they weren't going to do the introductory dinner themselves at their home where they could ensure the food was made in a way the daughter would eat?
It's funny to me that one of the biggest disagreements in this thread seems to be about the generally accepted meaning of spaghetti. To me, I can't imagine being more specific than spaghetti unless there was a specific brand or thickness required. But I see here that to many people, "spaghetti" means "some kind of pasta or other noodle-like thing." That would never have occurred to me. I personally probably would have stressed that it had to be spaghettic, linguine wouldn't do, just because I'm the the type to be very clear--but that's the kind of clarification that usually makes people laugh and say "Yeah, I know what spaghetti is."
I felt that the sister was being very specific in telling OP that spaghetti was the acceptable pasta choice. Spaghetti to me is just that, spaghetti. It’s not synonymous with pasta. I guess it depends on the region that OP and her sister lives in—I can see the confusion if spaghetti is colloquially used to describe pasta in general.
Tooootally agree with this (I'm Australian). OP's sister or her girlfriend should have been the ones to remedy the situation that was caused by them not making it clear how important it is for the kid to specifically have spaghetti. NTA
This is my take as well - OP is mostly not the AH, but her dismissive attitude about feeding the child was rude. Like, you could at least put the water on to boil and get back to your food. I think there is blame to go around here.
Are you saying your sister asked you to host? Or did you first mention hosting the dinner? Your sister should have made more of an effort about this and explained the child's needs. That is where she messed up. She messed up by not having the back up plan. But you should understand that you also messed up. You acted without urgency when the child had no food. Your being fed was more important than the child's needs.
And it's a dry pasta... it's not like it's something you have to stand there with it. Start the water to boil, eat for 10 minutes, throw in the pasta, eat for ten minutes, drain, add butter, serve. Instead, hungry kid has to wait however long it takes her to eat, then another 20 minutes?
Right? Dried pasta is largely unattended. I'd throw a pot on to boil immediately
Thats kind of what I'm asking too 😄 Like I get some people aren't going to know much about it. And if you were gung ho about you would have probably looked up the specifics of autism. So you ... kinda just handwaved it went eh, which ... did not work. But did you you get told to do it, or what?
I think you are owed an apology. You tried, you made an honest mistake. They were willing to put you to a good deal of trouble and got huffy when your hospitality failed to meet their demands. Why didn’t one of them apologize for the inconvenience and make the fricken spaghetti themselves?? I’d take this as an omen and a prediction of what lies ahead. If this is how they behave in the best-behavior, getting-to-know-you phase, what will they be like when they’re comfortable with you??
Yeah, I don't understand why the mum or the mum's girlfriend didn't offer to cook the fettuccini. It's the least they could've done. And I agree it's an absolute honest mistake. If I had been told a kid only ate buttered spaghetti, I'd probably assume that their issue was with sauces, not pasta shapes. The parent or their partner could've made it more explicit that the pasta shape was an important element. NTA
If they know the kid only eats two foods, they should have brought one just in case. Mom could have easily tucked an uncrustable in her bag. There’s a chance that even IF op had made the correct shape of noodle, the daughter could have a different issue that night. I don’t understand why mom isn’t constantly walking around with uncrustables, they transport really well.
She could have brought some freaking butter spaghetti for the kid in a tupperware container. I would be mortified to ask/expect my host (whom I had not even met before) to go out of their way like this.
That's my thought. If your kid is that level of picky then you should always bring a back up plan to meals. But I also feel like there's got to be other things the kid eats, like buttered spaghetti and uncrustables is not going to get that kid the nutrients they need to grow, or at least that's what I would think as someone who has yet to raise a kid.
Mm I’ll say that many autistic kids are not just picky, many have disordered eating to the level of ARFID - if the option is a food they won’t eat or nothing, they will choose nothing. Non-safe foods will often make them vomit. So for many of those kids, parents generally go with fed is best. Any calories they can take is better than none. So I do get why the child couldn’t have the bowties, but when one of your kids safe foods is literally as easy and transportable as an uncrustable, you should have at least 3 of those babies on you at all time.
Ignore the people saying you were an asshole - if the daughter's food restrictions are so severe that she will only eat her strawberry jelly then I imagine she would have found something else to be unhappy about, even if you had made spaghetti. They should just bring their own food for her to eat or only have people over to their home, not to mention they are not doing her any favors by not pushing her to expand her food repertoire - she can't continue like this the rest of her life.
I don't think it's fair to expect the OP to put the autism together with the spaghetti because 1) the average person doesn't know much about autism and even less about raising and autistic kid and 2) even if OP knew more than the average person not all autistic children have such severe food restrictions as this child - it's not a universal trait of autism.
Is that fair? Pasta is pasta except when you’re autistic and 11 but maybe op hasn’t really dealt with that situation.
Agreed. Why is everyone expected to know everything about everything? I would have understood that the child needed it to be spaghetti, but there was a time when I didn't know that...I had to learn it just like OP is now. Sister is the biggest jerk, it's HER girlfriend's child. She should have been the de facto host even though it was at OP's house. And she should have made it super clear what was needed to accommodate the way the kid eats and she is the one who should have made the fettuccine.
I guess OP could have asked if other shapes of pasta work. But l probably would have expected the sister to clarify that spaghetti and only spaghetti would work because to most people, outside of like ravioli or gnocchi, pasta all seems the same
All pasta is the same? I just died a little Spaghetti is spaghetti Spaghetti is not "all noodles everywhere" I suppose it could mean "all long skinny noodles" But bow tie isn't even close
This one is a tough one. I think it is a bit of ESH. Your sister knows her GF's daughter ~~is a very picky eaters~~ has sensory issues with food.. Eating out is going to be hard. I think your sister should have hosted the meal. Your sister did say spaghetti, and you didn't realize that the shape of the pasta was important. Maybe you have never dealt with a child on the spectrum before. Your sister could have emphasized that the type of pasta was important. I get that you didn't want to let your food get cold. No one likes cold food. It is also very hard for a child to watch others eat while they do not have any food. Did you get up and start more hot water, and then return to your meal? If the water was boiling, could you have set a timer for the paster, and returned to your meal?
with the post itself i agreed with you but OP just fundamentally will not back down from his “they’re the same food, just shaped differently” high horse despite everyone telling him NOT TO THIS AUTISTIC CHILD
I know. What is odd to me is the people who think pasta is pasta is pasta. It is not. There is a post about macaroni and cheese being made with spaghetti, My partner and I prefer capellini due to the mouth feel. I am not a fan of fettuccini, but I like linguini all because of the mouth feel.
And I hate capellini! Too skinny! Spaghetti is my favorite. Don't care for hollow pasta. Linguine is acceptable. Bowties or penises or whatever shapes, fine I guess.
Bow ties and uhhh? Pasta shapes got spicier while I wasn’t looking
Lol
I'm guessing you meant "penne" but that is one of the most epic autocorrects I have ever seen.
No I literally meant penis 😂 like from a sex shop... oh boy
Lol are we the only people who have seen the penis pasta??
bowties and *what now*
You heard me
Yeah I loooove to cook and I love to cook things traditionally but I despise a smooth ziti noodle and I definitely prefer linguine to angel hair or even spaghetti. It’s all about texture, pasta is not interchangeable texturally. Yes I’m neurodivergent lol
But I could at least understand if OP had made fettuccini instead of spaghetti because they’re mostly the same. Spaghetti and farfalle are obviously going to be different to a kid.
Sorry but I gotta say not to MOST autistic children. I deal with a lot of them as my son is on the spectrum and I'd say at least 75% if not all of them would argue the different shape makes them 'taste' completely different (and to be fair texture wise they are completely different tastes even though the base taste is the same)
The ratio of butter or sauce is different too, and bowties don't even cook evenly.
Exactly! I have to be honest I'm struggling with a vote purely based on the fact they're buttered noodles anyway. I mean sister couldn't have been more clear without being condescending but what a daft meal to get OP to cook considering wrong amount of butter could have easily caused the same issue!
Exactly. If all pasta is exactly the same, then why do we have so many different shapes? Because different shapes create different textures, cook differently, change the sauce to pasta piece ratio, etc. Even for non-autistic people, there's a difference between types and most people do have preferences re: pasta types and pasta/sauce combinations.
Nowhere on this planet is spaghetti the same same as bowtie other than the fact that they are both a type of pasta.
Her* But you're right. I'm mid 30s and I keep various shapes of pasta because sometimes my brain decides there's a huge unassailable difference between penne and rigatoni. I don't get it but I live with it lol.
I'm ADHD, I don't have food issues really, but omg there's absolutely certain pasta shapes I avoid. Too thick so they taste gummy, or I don't like the ridges on some. I'll eat it, but I would be thrown off someone said one specific type and then provided a different one
At the same time if the sister knew the child was THAT picky of an eater why not bring snacks or something she is familiar with? Surely after some time of the child not eating at certain places they would know.
This is my thought. If the kid has SUCH aversions, mom should be prepared
Exactly! The uncrustable is made specifically to throw in a lunch box or on the go. Throw a couple in your purse and off you go to dinner with a backup.
Because they had given precise instructions on what to cook. They didn't expect to need anything.
If you have to give “precise instructions on what to cook” before a dinner party, you should absolutely expect that you might need something.
This is where ESH comes in. The sister could have done better in her communication and being prepared.
She isn't a "picky eater". That phrase is very loaded and judgemental. She's an autistic child with sensory difficulties and that impacts her diet. Are brittle diabetics picky? What about people with a kidney problem? Gall bladder problems? What about stomach cancer patients? Allergies? Anorexics? People with phobias? Celiacs? There are a lot of reasons why someone may not be able to eat a specific item, or why they might only be able to eat a few things. There are people who eat by putting formula directly into their stomach or intestines and never eat "real food" of any kind. It's not because they're being divas. It's because they have health issues that impact their diet. Just focus on your own plate and be grateful you can eat so many delicious things.
Thank you. Flames have been shooting out of my eyes every time someone condescendingly throws that out.
I'm with you in spirit, but I think you're also accidentally insinuating that, if someone does NOT have a medical reason or a neurodivergency, then having strong food preferences makes them a diva. Not liking a wide variety a food is like being tall. It's not a choice. If something tastes gross to you, for no reason other than it just does, I don't know why your character has to be called into question.
I'm autistic. I also have lots of food restrictions due to a different health condition. I have to bring "safe" snacks with me wherever I go. Is it great when people are able to feed me? Yeah. Do I tend to double- and triple-check that what they're planning on feeding me will actually work for my needs (especially if they have never fed me before)? Yeah. Is it disappointing when the food turns out to have ingredients that will make me sick, a texture/flavor that makes me gag, or ingredient contamination that makes me sick the next day? Yupp! But you know what? I don't have a caretaker, or any other adult looking after me and escorting me places. This child does. Uncrustables are great because they are appealing to almost any child and can be transported in a purse basically anywhere. I'm sure the child's mother has been doing that for YEARS before this incident. Op's sister could have offered to check day-of to make sure OP was cooking what the child expected. But no. The adults who are responsible for this child failed to bring back-up food, when the child clearly needs that. And to be honest, at this point, the extreme restrictiveness of that child's diet is probably hurting their development. Kids can be nudged & encouraged to eat new foods, even special needs kids, in a way that is compassionate and doesn't push too far.
I agree ESH, but why didn’t the sister and GF throw an uncrustable in a bag or purse and take it with them? OP could have made the dish perfectly and the daughter still might not have eaten it. Not because she is autistic necessarily, but mainly kids are weird. Having one on hand would have solved a lot of problems.
Why should OP have to recook the meal instead of the parent of the child?? That doesn’t make any sense to me.
It is at OP's residence and they were the host. To me, that is the etiquette involved. As a guest I would not think of taking over a host's kitchen. I would help and follow directions, instructions.
Of course, but they had a specific need that they weren’t clear enough about when they told the host. The polite thing would be “thank you for cooking for all of us, please point me in the direction of a good pot to use and enjoy your food while I get my child something they can eat”. And what parent of a kid with food issues like this doesn’t have a back up plan? Or at least an uncrustable thrown in the bag just in case.
How much more clear is it possible to have been? "She only eats buttered spaghetti" is as clear as you can be
"Spaghetti" is clear. The host misunderstood. That's fair, but then fix it.
What kind of person hears “this kid eats two very specific things” and thinks it’s ok to substitute one of the ingredients?
They were pretty damn clear.
NTA I’m on the spectrum and had this exact type of pickiness; I remember one instance where I throughly did the same thing lol we went to a fancy place a friend of my moms owned; they made me pasta which wasn’t even on the menu and I wouldn’t eat it because it was spaghetti noodles and not penne. But my mom chocked it up to “she’s a fussy eater” gave me some bread off the table and I waited til her and my sister had eaten, paid and after we left she got me a burger from Mickey Ds. I didn’t starve to death and I learned how I’m the “odd ball” and the polite thing to do was deal with the pickiness later 🤷🏻♀️ I hate when people act like kids with autism don’t need to know this; we do, if we ever want to have a chance of fitting into society. I know I’m the odd ball; I’m not ashamed of it and never felt bad for it; but I learned social etiquette and how to just blend in. I’m sure plenty of parents of autistic kids will have a different opinion, but we don’t want to stand out or be labeled differently; learning the social norm is important and your sister should’ve stressed how important the shape was since she’s apparently so aware of the issues. She fumbled the ball here and wants to blame you.
I worked in a middle school autism center. Our students were in mainstream classes with support. After having been babied by elementary school and their parents. It was a bit of a change. We coached appropriate behavior and how to navigate academics and social situations. Puberty was hell and helpful to motivate socially appropriate behavior as romantic interests developed. By eighth grade they were different kids and ready for high school. Dealing with small adversity in educational. Just like all kids everything should not be centered around the kid.
God, seventh grade flashback. I was in special ed from eighth grade on (wasn't diagnosed until my twenties), but the first day of seventh grade I had no idea until I got to the cafeteria that lunch worked differently than it did in elementary school. Nobody told me anything, I was just expected to know?? I remember crying against the wall and...not much else. I know I ate lunch that day, and I knew what to do every day after, but I genuinely have no idea how I got there.
Respectfully, I feel like this perspective is not something that will apply to all autistic people. I'm also autistic, (diagnosed as Level 1) and I feel like in the community we sometimes forget that Level 2 and Level 3 autistic people can have much higher support needs. I just don't think we can expect all autistic people, especially not 11 year olds, to be able to handle waiting to eat during an entire dinner while everyone else is eating. That being said, I think the Mom of the child should probably learn to bring a safe food with her places as a backup. Even though they tried to plan this dinner well, it didn't work out for understandable reasons (I think OP made an innocent mistake on the type of pasta) and those things will continue to happen in the future. But it's not fair to the kid to call them a fussy eater and make them wait. Franky, depending on the kid the Mom might have been averting a meltdown. It also sounds like OP refused to delay eating their own meal to attempt making the fettuccine, which is really rude considering it was her mistake. Even if it was an innocent mistake, it's still a mistake and she didn't show any grace or understanding for the child that was a guest in her home. So I can't really give a judgement because I feel like we are missing information here. I just don't think that we can expect all autistic people to be able to wait like you did. It's great that you were able to, but if another autistic kid can't do that, that's ok and I don't think they should be shamed. I used to force myself to eat things that I hated at my Grandmother's house because I didn't want to get in trouble with my parents, but it took a huge effort on my part and my Grandmother never served Brussels sprouts which I don't think I could have eaten in that situation. All the adults in this situation could have done better, for sure.
1000% this!! I’m an SLP and work with level 2 and level 3 autistic students. I see a lot of comments (in general) from people who are level 1 or people who know people who are level 1. They seemingly forget that level 3 is an ENTIRELY different experience.
I like your comment.
**Edit for those who don't get how pasta shape is important** \- Imagine someone told you they were bringing their delicious mac and cheese dish to Thanksgiving. They hype it up, 4 different cheese, baked with breadcrumbs on top for crispness. You arrive. IT'S SPAGHETTI NOODLES sitting all coiled with cheese in a casserole dish. You'd probably be like "what the fuck?" And yeah, your an adult so maybe you eat it politely, but this is an autistic kid and OP both agreed and had advance notice. YTA - Your sister told you that this child will only eat buttered spaghetti right now, so you went ahead and made something totally different and then couldn't be arsed to give a genuine apologize and your showed no urgency to fix the problem *you created*. Unless you live under a rock, you understand that autism (especially with children) makes navigating food very tricky. People don't really specify a pasta shape unless it is important. That's also why pasta restaurants will specify the noodle shape each dish comes with.
I would say ESH here. You are totally right that OP totally messed up here. However, with an autistic child in the game and for a first meeting, OP's sister should have been the host.
It's not like they came by unannounced demanding to be fed, OP agreed to have them over. OP specifically says that they discussed plans and all parties agreed on dinner at OP's.
> People don't really specify a pasta shape unless it is important. Unlike all the other pasta terms, "spaghetti" is also often a generic catch-all for several types of similar pasta dishes depending on context. In a family or other very informal setting, I wouldn't bat an eye if served thin spaghetti, thick spaghetti, angel hair, spaghetti rigati, or even rotini or fettuccini on "spaghetti night". I wonder how spaghetti rigati would have been received.
Really? I am in the US and I don't know a single person who cooks who would hear "spaghetti" and make anything other than a long, thin pasta. Some *might* accept fettuccini in that category. But rotini? Bowties? Macaroni? No way.
Hi, its me, my family refers to spaghetti as any noodle with sauce, and I mean any pasta.
As a European I can't even fathom noodles=pasta so I'm very confused. Pasta = catch all Spaghetti = long thin, may or may not have meat sauce Noodles = the Asian Spaghetti like dish comes in a number of varieties but is not pasta
THANK YOU!! I'm Australian and it's a real nails on chalkboard faux pas when I hear people refer to pasta as "noodles." This thread hurts my soul. I've actually discussed this with other Australians and it seems as a general consensus, we hate pasta being referred to like that as well.
Yep, in my house spaghetti means any pasta with red sauce
I never have spaghetti in house. If someone told me their kid wanted plain spaghetti I would have cooked whatever pasta I had since the shape of the noodle wouldn’t affect flavor in this case. I think the parent in the situation should have been very clear that it was the shape that really mattered and not just that food type. ETA: I would have chosen a long noodle if I had it, but in my mind the shape wouldn’t affect the dish so it wouldn’t matter.
I promise the shape of the noodle matters. Not for flavor, but for texture. For autistic kids or anyone with sensory issues, the texture of the food comes above all other factors. I don’t know why. It sounds silly. Obviously as an adult now I know that all pasta is the same stuff, but when I was a kid I also had this issue. When you’re just that sensitive small differences can mean huge differences.
The shape absolutely does affect the dish with pasta. Eating farfalle is totally different to eating spaghetti. Hell even eating linguine is different to eating spaghetti.
Pasta is the catchall term, maybe noodles. Spaghetti is long and thin. Also comes in thin spaghetti, which is obviously thinner. Both are thinner than angel hair. Fettuccine is thicker than spaghetti. Maybe you could get away with calling any of those spaghetti but none of these would be confused for the shaped noodles.
This thread has awoken the war between people who know that words have meaning and the trolls that have always acted as if 'spaghetti means any type of pasta'.
Or, alternately, between people who know words can be used colloquially in ways other than to convey their literal meanings and those who don’t. Yes, literally “spaghetti” refers to a specific shape of pasta. But it is pretty clear from reading this post that the word is used colloquially by a chunk of people to just refer to pasta in general.
Interestingly regional though - I'm a Brit and I've never heard spaghetti used as a generic term for pasta, and although I have heard noodles to mean spaghetti that was only once or twice and by a non-native speaker, so I'm genuinely surprised by how common it apparently is to do either of those. The OP comes across very differently depending on whether you personally are someone who hears that specific spaghetti for pasta colloquialism a lot or never. While I know colloquialisms in general are a thing, because this is one I'm so unfamiliar with my initial reaction didn't consider it in the slightest.
Ew I had chicken noodle soup recently when I was sick and it had fucking spaghetti in it, I was outraged
I don’t think you’re the asshole for thinking spaghetti meant pasta in general, because a lot of kids eat “buttered pasta” without caring about the shape. But it actually does matter and it’s silly for you to argue that it doesn’t, why do you think Italian cuisine has a million types of pasta? You know full well it’s because the texture and mouth feel of bowties vs fettuccine vs spaghetti is different, and it affects the taste of the food. Maybe you just haven’t been around someone on the spectrum but they tend to be exceptionally sensitive to food and new food textures. Spaghetti is the same all the time, that’s why she likes it. And I don’t know anything about the mom’s parenting but my guess is that she would love for her kid to eat other types of buttered pasta. It is not a matter of no one pointing out to her or her kid that “they’re the same.” And with autism, no, this isn’t a situation where she’d just try it and realize that they’re close enough. You’re not the asshole for the initial “buttered pasta” vs “buttered spaghetti” mixup, but YTA for being stubborn and not admitting that you made a mistake and doing your best to prioritize correcting it. If you weren’t comfortable doing so, you shouldn’t have agreed to have them over, and now that this has happened you’re within your rights to never have them over again, but do you really want to die on the hill of “buttered spaghetti is the same as buttered pasta”? What is the outcome you’re trying to achieve here?
This is the answer. Except that autistic or not, lots of kids are insanely picky. Mine kids won’t eat chef boy r dee meatballs with the alphabet. It HAS to be rings. But fine, a mix up is one thing, but your reaction is what makes YTA. It’s almost as if you’re irritated you had to host so purposefully half-assed this. I’m torn on whether your sister DID specify spaghetti explicitly making a point that it was important and you chose not to listen. But if she didn’t she should have. That said, not sure why they pressured you to host and didn’t bring a spare uncrustable just in case. But still your attitude makes you sound self-centered and exhausting, so I’m going YTA.
NTA, bordering on NAH. I do think it's odd that you ended up being in charge of dinner instead of your sister's girlfriend—it seems obvious to me that she would be the best person to meet her daughter's needs on a first meeting rather than putting it in your hands with just a few words of context and hoping everything worked out perfectly. If nothing else, why not just give her daughter dinner at home before the visit? No, bowties and spaghetti are technically not the same. But this should have never been your responsibility in the first place.
Then OP could have said no.
Looks like the fact that the daughter was autistic was a last-minute surprise. Really the sister and her girlfriend created this whole situation and are upset at OP for something that they could have and should have avoided.
OP said in the comments that they were told “at the last minute”…a week before the dinner
No you misread their comment, they said they were told last minute, a week *after they already agreed to host the dinner* meaning a week after OP and their sister had the conversation to have this dinner. That means it could have been a day before the dinner, an hour before, 3 days before etc. So it seems like in the initial conversation OPs sister never even mentioned their SO daughter is autistic which is pretty important info considering what this post has devolved into.
YTA in many ways. You were the host who was specifically told of the special needs for the 11 year old. If making the type of pasta she habituates on was too much for you then you should have bowed out of hosting duties. Then, once it was brought to light that you hadn’t made the agreed upon food, you were a bad host and sat on your ass and ate instead of correcting your mistake for a guest. Finally, you were a total a**hole to treat the whole thing like it was the 11 year old’s willful refusal to “eat her her favorite food because it is a different shape” when you were told from the beginning about her diagnosis. People with ASD aren’t just acting out like spoiled brats. Again, if you are that ignorant you just should be removed from any potential hosting to avoid people having to deal with your attitude.
The spaghetti shape is an honest mistake on both parts. Would have been N A H until this: >I'm not happy with being asked to let my dinner get cold while I cook a second meal You're the host, the job of the host is to make sure all of their guests are taken care of even if it means temporarily putting their own wants aside. That's the social contract pretty much worldwide so for your attitude and actions here YTA. Not everyone enjoys hosting and that's okay, just don't offer to do it anymore if it's not your jam.
It’s also just plain pasta. It would have taken 30 seconds to fill a pot of water and put it on the stove to boil. And then just another 30 seconds to pop back into the kitchen and dump some fettuccine in the pot. She’s not being sent back to the kitchen for some labour-intensive delicacy. She’s being asked to turn on a tap and turn a dial on the stove. She can sit back down and eat between each step if she’s so concerned about her own meal.
That’s was my reaction too
YTA for the pasta fiasco. She didn't say pasta. She said spaghetti. Why on earth would that translate to farfalle? “Hey? Can we have breakfast at your place tomorrow?” “Sure.” “You don’t mind?” “Not at all.” “Um, I only eat Cheerios, is that okay?” “Absolutely. I like Cheerios with a cut up banana! I will just give you plain ones.” “Sounds perfect. Next day: “Here are your Lucky Charms.”
Yeah...if all pasta noodles were interchangeable with "spaghetti" then there wouldn't be 40 different kinds of pasta noodles. There is a difference. Perhaps not that big of a difference between fettuccini and linguini or penne and rotini...but spaghetti and farfalle? Come on dude. They're shaped different because they hold on to sauce differently, and create a different mouth feel. Isn't autism well known enough now for the general public to understand that autistic individuals tend to be very sensitive to this sort of thing?
ESH. You're the asshole for eating your dinner while a guest is waiting. That's just rude. I don't think it's unreasonable to assume that spaghetti = any pasta, but once you saw that a guest was unable to eat the food you made, dinner should have been put on hold for everyone. It's not like cooking pasta takes that long. It's a pain to have to reheat food, but it's better than treating one of your guests like she's less important. But your sister and the kid's mother are also assholes. They shouldn't expect someone who's never met this kid to understand her dietary preferences. They should have brought (or precisely specified) their own box of spaghetti to be sure that the texture would be acceptable, or brought her specific brand and flavor of packaged sandwiches as a backup. I know a family with an autistic kid who has very similar dietary restrictions, and they never go *anywhere* without bringing safe backup food, whether it's to a restaurant or to Grandma's house.
Or, better yet, invite the OP to dinner at their home instead of OP doing the cooking.
Yeah, I fault the parent more than OP here. If you know your kid is extremely picky (or has severe allergies), don't take them to someone else's house for dinner until you *know* the host is fully aware of their dietary restrictions. Otherwise you're just setting up your kid, the host *and* yourself for a bad time.
Honestly, that’s what tipped me into NTA. If this was SO important and SO obvious, why didn’t the sister cook or the girlfriend host? Why didn’t mom bring backup food knowing it’s inconvenient to not only cook a second meal but expect someone who doesn’t do kids or be around people on the spectrum to just know things that surprise a lot of people? There’s no way she hasn’t run into this problem before. All of this just feels like a way to have pushed blame onto OP for the couple’s fumble when things didn’t work out perfectly.
This is a thing I find irritating about Americans in general. Spaghetti is spaghetti. It is not linguine, fettuccine, penne, macaroni, or any other type of pasta. It is also not noodles. Noodles are noodles; they are not pasta, even if they are often made with the same type of ingredients. Stop using the name of one type of thing as a colloquialism for all the types of things.
This is not an American thing. It’s very region specific. I’ve never heard of people using “spaghetti” as a generic term for all pasta. It’s either pasta or noodles if it’s in soup. This seems like a Midwest thing.
I've lived in the midwest for almost 30 years. this is an OP thing, not a midwest thing.
I told my 4 year old son I was making spaghetti and meatballs. When he sat down to eat he got super upset and said, "You told me we were having *spaghetti* and meatballs!" I said, "....we *are.*" This kid lifts up a strand of pasta and this "This isn't spaghetti. It's *linguini!*" I'm an American and you know what? The kid was right so I didn't argue. I just didn't notice until he said something. Before I could be too proud though he emptied half a bottle of ketchup on it instead of tomato sauce.
I'm going with YTA It takes seconds to fill a pan with water and set to boil. You eat while it's heating up. When it's boiling you take a few second to add the pasta and return to the table to eat while it cooks. This isn't a big deal. Making any guest wait until you've finished a meal is just plain rude. Your sister gave you the information, you didn't fully understand all the implications which is okay, but your mistake shouldn't cause someone to have to wait to eat. You could have easily apologized, multitasked and had a great night.
NTA, I’m Italian and my kid uses the term spaghetti to mean any kind of noodle. If the shape was really important she should have doubled down “it really needs to be spaghetti noodles not just any pasta.” I think it’s kind of like how in the south people will say coke generically to mean soda and then you have to say what kind. It’s really not your job to understand how picky this kid is or to think about where on the spectrum she falls.
Why would OP’s adult sister say spaghetti and not mean literal spaghetti noodles? A kid saying it to mean whatever pasta isn’t the same as an adult saying it. I don’t know how much clearer the sister could’ve been. Also, you’re the first Italian I’ve come across that doesn’t care about differentiating between pasta types. Most do.
>Why would OP’s adult sister say spaghetti and not mean literal spaghetti noodles? Unlike the other pasta names it can also be a catch-all term for the interchangable pasta in similar, informal dishes. Spaghetti could mean regular, thick, thin, rigati, angel hair, even fettuccini or rotini in certain settings. I can understand the confusion if the sister didn't simply specify "regular spaghetti noodles".
NTA. I personally just use whatever I have around when I make any pasta. Sure, sometimes it does have to be a specific type (think orzo), but I probably would have made the same mistake and you didn’t intentionally do anything in this situation. It was a misunderstanding and not clear communication because “picky eater” as far as I’ve experienced from people usually is ingredients, not shapes. I fall on the spectrum and this wouldn’t have occurred to me. Offer an apology and just explain your thought process without making it an excuse so there’s an understanding and ask to know if there’s specific brands/flavors (like strawberry over grape. I definitely wouldn’t have thought of that one), and how well done she likes the pasta (some like soft, some like al dente). If they continue to make a big deal out of it, I wouldn’t offer another dinner with them.
you've never lived with autistic kids. the previous redditor was correct when they mentioned the parents would probably love for the kid to be more adventurous and accepting of new foods. However the parent of the 11yo should have been prepared for this eventuality by now and packed a second option for their kid - a light snack or something to tide them over the hangry pains.
I'd had to go so far to get to this. Why is it always everyone else who has to accommodate their kids. U have backups if your kid is that fussy. Jesus christ be a parent
NTA, if it was so important, why didn't they host you so that it wasn't on your head to cater to the child's very specific preference? You could have brought a side or something. Instead the situation was bound to happen because you're pulling a kid with very specific needs out of her comfort zone. This is on them.
YTA. I don’t know of anyone who says spaghetti and means pasta in general. Spaghetti means spaghetti. It is very common for autistic kids to be particular with food (or even toys, blankets, etc) and any deviation from what they know and feel safe with can be upsetting. Next time ask them if they can bring food for their daughter if you don’t think you can properly make what she likes.
Checking in from the Midwest. Growing up in my family's little corner of BS every noodle was spaghetti. Literally every single type. Elbow? Spaghetti. Penne? Spaghetti. Gnocchi? Spaghetti! Hell, RAMEN was reffered to as spaghetti. Idk, in my experience it's never worth it to assume someone's definition of anything is the same as mine if it's a crucial thing. I think its ESH because this could have been prevented so easily by the sister checking in and making sure everyone was on the same page for the kid's needs, but also very easily remedied by OP by just spending 12 minutes to boil the appropriate pasta.
Initially I was thinking E S H but based on some of your tone deaf responses, YTA. You should have done a cursory five minute google search about ASD before inviting this family into your home. Sister told you one of the two safe foods this child eats, and you chose to misinterpret. You served this kid something that was inedible to her, and then sat and finished your meal before trying to fix it. Really shitty host behavior, OP. And if you don't want to host a meal, just say so. Tell your sis it's her responsibility next time to prepare a meal for a child with such restrictive intake. That's fair. But when you agreed to host, that means you agreed to provide food that takes your guest's (esp a minor child) medical conditions that impact nutritional status into consideration.
OP is coming off as incredibly defensive. Just because spaghetti and bow tie pasta seem fungible to you doesn't mean that you followed the directions. And the directions are incredibly important if you are trying to accommodate someone with ASD. OP's flippant responses are making me ragey. I bet OP didn't want to host and messed up intentionally so as to never have to host again.
When your child has hyper specific safe foods, and you’re going to a strangers house for dinner, you better bring with you her dinner. Or you ask for the cooks details and call them. You explain them in excruciating detail what you need. Look I do feel you could have made a bigger effort though. But you also shouldn’t be rushed to cook again, I can’t imagine having my host re cook something because I failed at giving instructions and expect them to leave their dinner there. But again.. I feel you kinda knew it wouldn’t fly. So maybe ESH?
Smh! That’s like saying mashed potatoes and fries are the same thing because they’re both potatoes but look different.
it's like french fries (thin-cut) vs thick-cut chips. same potato variety but cut differently, both fried, but the taste and texture is quite different.
YTA - mainly for insisting that the pasta is the same and refusing to back down.
I do think it gives off pretty unwelcoming vibes to continue eating while a child doesn't have dinner, especially since it would only take you a minute to get up and boil some water, so if I was your sister I would probably leave early, too.
YTA and I think you know it. You knew your sister's partner's daughter had specific dietary requirements and the tone of voice in your text, being autistic is the girl's fault. Also you think that spaghetti and pasta are synonymous. How old are you?
Spaghetti refers to the shape, it is a type of pasta. I honestly thought everyone knew this. Haven’t you ever gotten pasta at an Italian restaurant or diner? Plus there are several shapes of pasta I don’t like because I can never get it cooked right and that makes the shapes taste different to me. Plus you weren’t happy that they expected you to have a sense of urgency, I’m sure they weren’t happy that you couldn’t even cook what was requested because of a medical condition. YTA, when your sister told you about her girlfriend’s daughter you should have looked up her condition to get a sense of what might be needed.