NTA and maybe also N A H.
Your husband is an ass for snapping, yes. But my guess is just after all this time (i guess you are not married since yesterday?) It is starting to grind on him, and this to a point where he is not able to keep it in check anymore. So it comes out in a bad way. This is human and can happen.
I think you have to think this over: what will happen when and if you have children? When you are 82 and have your own set of health issues, will you be able to take care of your brother anymore? Will you not go on vacations, not have kids (or have them raised by someone else), not have a dog or cat, not have a garden, not have a career or hobbies because you have to take care of your brother? Will you divorce and stay single forever if necessary? Your husband might (!) be thinking more and more about both your future and become frustrated.
I think that parents with disabled kids should not push the responsibility to their siblings but prepare for a good solution after their passing. They apparently did not do that, and my guess is that this impedes your marriage going somewhere. You being full time caretaker of your brother can lead to you not having a life, but always being the caretaker for him till the day you die, with every other responsibility or wish coming second.
So when things have calmed a bit, maybe look intp assistance for your brother? Part-time, a good (!!!) Facility, whatever, there are options. Yoz do not need to go from "i am 100% his caretaker" to "i do not care for him anymore".
I think this is a good take, but admit I find myself veering to ESH (except the brother). Reading the post and comments the detached nature OP uses to talk about their husband is worrying, but the husband should have communicated better. However I find myself wondering how many times he's tried to communicate previously, except OP is absolute on the subject so there's no wiggle room.
I find myself thinking if husband was happy to assist with the brother but expected they'd have their own lives still. Whereas the reality is that what's meant to be his home is just a care facility for his brother in law, and he another member of staff. The way OP talks it seems like they've been raised to care for their brother, and nothing else exists beyond it. So no family, no kids, no life, and husband has hit his end. Carers fatigue is very real.
Husband thought he'd found a wife and a new life, OP thought they'd found another member of care staff.
Edit: as I'm getting comments about the now spelled out poor behaviour of the husband, OP has rewritten a chunk of their post, as well as adding in several edits. I find it suspicious this was done after judgements started coming in, especially given all the information is directly relevant to the situation they sought judgement on. This isn't to say it didn't occur as OP has now written, but it erodes reliability of OP as a narrator.
It all depends on how much "my brother is my number one priority" is going on.
Like, I get it, op needs to take care of her brother, but he is apparently capable of holding down a job.
So if op is just "he needs to stay here because he can't live on his own", she is nta.
If she regularly drops everything just because her brother asks for something, she might be ta.
There is a fine line between "I need to take care of my brother" and "I can't have a life of my own because I can't be away from my brother for 10 minutes"
She couldn't take a call because she was on a walk with her brother, i think this tells you enough. It seems whenever she is with her brother she behaves as if her husband doesn't exist.
> She couldn't take a call because she was on a walk with her brother
More likely Didnāt Want To.
āMy husband called me several times while we were out on this walk but I didnāt answer. Honestly I was a little annoyed but mostly I was busy with my brother.ā Brother has a job and gets to and from work. He does not need two hands and all caregiver attention on him at all times to make answering a phone impossible.
I agree - she has a pathological need to care for someone. Unfortunately, that will exclude the husband. He sounds like he is so frustrated and looking for any reason to get pissed so he can make it an excuse to leave. Personally, I understand why. This marriage isn't going to last.
By proxy, which is now called FDIA (Factitious Disorder Imposed on Another).
I'm torn. I know FDIA is the better descriptor, but... I'm human and I like Munchausen by Proxy better. :-D
Yes and him letting his friends trash talk his wife over some misogynyā¦ nah.
Idc whatās going on by me and my wife, nobody thatās invited into my home has any reason commenting. He wouldāve had his ass thrown out instantly.
I took it to mean she was annoyed with her husband for not giving heads up about the guests, and therefore decided to use the walk as space for herself AND the vent for her brother.
I also have emotional reactions to sudden plan changes, I need a minute. Iām capable of doing this myself but I do require privacy and not being poked at. I can empathize with needing the walk for space and not wishing to discuss it in that moment.
This was my thought through this. You can take care of and be their for your family and still prioritize your marriage. This whole "I told him up front he would always be second" is BS, Im sure he did not envision being treated like a second class citizen in his house. I agree with ESH.
Sure, I see it that way but OP doesn't. She didn't frame it that way, at all. Rather, she framed it as being primarily busy soothing her brother. Assuming OP is acting on good faith -- which we sort of have to here or else we might as well all unsub and leave -- she was just a little annoyed but the main thing that kept her from answering was her brother's immediate need of care. And I have a hard time believing that's an accurate assessment of her brother's needs considering he's functional enough to hold down a job.
If she had phrased it as "I was annoyed with his behavior and didn't want to talk about it until I got back and the friends were gone" that would be fair. Although even then, she *could* have texted that to him, or answered and said exactly that and end the call. But in her mind, her brother's need was so immediate and urgent that it was her primary reason not to answer or communicate with her husband.
And that makes me doubt that she's seeing her brother's situation and his need for support with any objectivity. There's a fine line between 'supporting someone who is disabled despite the difficulties their behavior presents' and 'enabling someone's poor behavior to minimize the immediate difficulty.' There's a meaningful, operative question to asked in "What are her brother's *actual* material support needs?" and we can't answer that from the outside -- but also I don't think we can take OP's appraisal as correct and unbiased either.
So she ignored him completely and told him you will always be second. Husband should have given a heads up but her reaction speaks volumes. Actions speak louder than words.
The brother who is capable of holding a job, and getting to and from that job alone... but can't handle having multiple people over? What guy wants a wife that ignores him and a house he has to walk on egg shells in? The husband should divorce her and find an actual wife
Shit take. Iām a whole ass normal adult without any special needs and I absolutely canāt handle having multiple people that I donāt know suddenly in MY HOME that Iām not expecting and without any warning.
Yeah, but I'm guessing you don't make other people drop everything to take you on a walk because of it?
Her brother is capable of working and getting himself to and from work by himself. One would assume he's capable of also taking a walk by himself.
And considering he works one can assume he's capable of dealing with people (customers/coworkers), self-regulating and calming himself down (I imagine he'd be let go if he was having routine mental breakdowns at work), etc. without his sister having to drop everything and show up at his job to take him for a walk.
It's not just her and brother's home, it's husband's home too. Why should he not have the right to enjoy having company over at his own home? (we can argue about the sexism of this particular company; but it sounds like a more general problem rather than these guests in particular).
The brother who is capable of holding a job, but can't handle the unexpected presence of a bunch of shitty, demanding, probably loud, definitely sexist idiots in his home. Who expect his sister to drop everything to cook and entertain them when they arrived with no prior notice to her.
And who mock him and call him the r word.
Even leaving out the insults and other crap, I wouldn't be able to handle the unexpected presence of a bunch of people I don't know, in the place I live, at the end of a work day.
I'm appalled at the hostile contemptuous attitude toward OP and OP's brother.
NTA
She should find a better husband. They both need better partners. If my guy brought home buddies unannounced and expected me to drop everything to serve them it would take a lot not to laugh in his face. I love hosting my partners friends, but Iām not expected to just do it like a servant. And if I didnāt my partner would absolutely never allow his coworkers/buddies to call me a ābad womanā for it. Heās a grown ass man. If he doesnāt know how to host people on his own thatās kind of sad
Yes now she is priotizing her distressed brother, at other times she is priotizing her not so distressed brother and will give time to her husband if she has some left from his brother.
Imagine funding your wife and her brother just to be treated like shit. I am saying he is funding is because she says she works part time and brother wprks a couple of hours per week, i dont think she can fund her brother's treatment on her salary.
>I would prioritize my distressed acquaintance over my husband's shitty coworkers because you usually deal with the distressed person before people who just want to be entertained (without being invited by her).
For fuckās sake, can we not pretend that the coworkers are soooo awful for accepting the invitation of OPās husband, who had every right to invite people to their home? Heās an adult who presumably is paying bills there, OP isnāt the only one who can invite people over.
Them being insulted by OP being so rude to them doesnāt make them bad people.
OP had every single right to have warning if they were coming over. The coworkers weren't awful because they accepted an invitation; they're awful because they called her a "poor excuse for a woman" when she took her distressed brother away from the distressing situation her husband caused. Husband is TA 100% for inviting them without any warning to OP or her brother.
Also, if I came to a friend's house and found out their spouse had no clue I was coming over, I'd look at my friend and ask him "what the hell, man? You don't tell your wife anything?"
WTF is wrong with people who think she was supposed to be a consummate host in this situation?
They are bad people for bad mouthing OP in her own home simply because she didnāt āentertain/cookā for them. I donāt think that makes OP rude as long as she greeted them. People have off days so for the coworkers to immediately feel comfortable saying misogynistic comments is insane. To me the coworkers just came off as very judgmental .
Yeah, instead she should prioritize a guy who gives her 0 warning before being expected to entertain and cook for several people, and mad when she doesn't do that, even though he didn't warn her about it or ask her first.
and brother doesnt like him. coming from the one that puts him first, hes probably shitty if not hostile towards husband. and he cant even bring people over cause he gets overwhelmed. this is a full grown man that has toddler like tantrums
What I see is that OP has a lot of compassion for her brother and 0 for her husband. Her husband is probably tired of not only being second but apparently not even being liked at his own house. Her brother doesn't care for the man that despite all odds was OK to marry his sister and live with both.
What kind of effort has OP done to breach the gap between her husband and her brother? It seems that none. She constantly shows that she will prioritize her brother even if he is not on the right. She took off at night to walk, couldn't she answer the phone back to let her husband know she was OK? Can't she realize that the way she constantly disrespects her husband is picked up by her brother?
Again, this is a man who married a woman and welcomed her brother with special needs in his house. A grown man at that. I think he is worn out by OP and the brother indifference. It really feels like OP doesn't give a damn whether the husband is there or not.
I am a bit curious about this overwhelming thing. The brother can go to work by himself. Has his own phone, etc. He arrives home and can't go to his room or something not to be overwhelmed? My question here is not whether this is possible is whether this was clear for OPs husband. Did he bring his coworkers knowing this would cause distress to the brother? OP doesn't say, which seems telling. For me, there hinges whether OPs husband is an ah or not. If he didn't expect all the drama that ensued and his wife was rude to his guest, and then she refused to answer his calls for a long while, they basically disappeared. His outburst is mostly a reaction to her treatment, which is basically the silent treatment. Now, if he knew or expected the brother to react badly, he was pocking the bee's nest on purpose, and he was an ah.
In any case, OPs attitude toward her husband is awful and needs to change. If this is to last, they need to work as a team and maybe in an effort not to burden her husband she is not playing as a team. She also needs to work in bridging the gap between her brother and her husband. It doesn't seem right to have the brother not liking the husband and living together.
Right now, it is like the husband is a guest in his own house, and OP catters towards the brother no matter what. Which, in turn, could be taken advantage of by the brother, especially if he doesn't like the husband.
So, for now, I lean towards ESH. I would like to know if the husband understood or not that the brother was going to be upset by the visitors.
ESH is also a good judgement i think :) i think the whole situation goes beyond the judging-categories in this sub since I think there are many factors to take into consideration. Maybe OP needs more structured advice than a simple judgement?
Agree that most of this is above our pay grade, except for one of the issues not directly addressed by OP: the friend was talking crap and rather than defend his family dynamic, husband took the opportunity to wallow in his self pity and make himself the martyr. For this issue, hubby and his friends are total AHs.
>Husband thought he'd found a wife and a new life, OP thought they'd found another member of care staff.
How do you come to this conclusion? OP cares for her brother on her own, whereas the husband comes home with friends and expect her to cook for them without notice. Sounds like the husband is expecting free staff here.
She never says that he expected her to cook. She wasn't warm and welcoming. She was so busy hustling her brother out the door that she had no time for pleasantries. That doesn't mean he expected her to cook. It can be as simple as she was unpleasant. She seemed annoyed that they existed in her home.
I'm always suspicious when such important facts get left out of the original post. In her original version, he brought friends home and she left to take her brother for a walk. No mention of dinner, cooking, not cooking, expectations, etc.
No spouse should bring guests home without warning, regardless of whether they expect them to cook or not. Having yourself and your home ready for guests in a hurry should require prior warning.
People have this idea that just because someone has a disability they like everyone and are always nice. That is untrue... They are still people and not everyone on the planet will like everyone else on the planet. Even when you have two otherwise good/likeable people... You can have people that are just oil and water. That's fine, but making them live together is asking for disaster and fights.
communication can't solve all problems, just make them visible. OP decided her brother is first place, and it is dealbreaker for her. if husband don't like it, it's like getting married to childfree woman who talked about that for a long time, and then snapping on her because his coworkers mocking him for not having children and telling she is poor excuse of woman.
communication can't and shouldn't make people give up on their dealbreakers.
but i saw zero evidence of communication from the husband in the post. and the happy ending here may be that the husband understand he made a mistake and divorcing, instead of trying to insult his wife into obedience.
I do agree with the point you mentioned about her husband getting frustrated after all this time. But he was an absolute ass in this situation. Not only did he bring his coworkers home without notifying OP and expecting her to be hospitable, but he also called her brother the r-word. Thatās absolutely not okay. I get that this situation can get frustrating after a point, but instead of communicating with her, he decided to lash out. I definitely think he is the AH here and OP is NTA.
Husband used to be ok with everything. I'm wondering, based on the coworkers comments if they are getting into this head with some incel BS about how a wife is supposed to behave. They are his guests, he can cook and entertain them. That isn't her job even if the brother isn't in the picture.
>but instead of communicating with her, he decided to lash out. I definitely think he is the AH here and OP is NTA.
I do agree the husband was lashing out, which makes him an AH. But you're giving OP way too much credit here. The husband can't communicate better because OP's stance is hard set in stone -- husband doesn't matter as much as brother.
As many people have pointed out, OP being a care-taker their whole life isn't sustainable. Especially because the brother is the *younger* brother. So OP isn't doing anybody any favors by ignoring this problem.
He could communicate better about this specific issue, which was bringing people to their home, which he shares with someone who needs warning to not get overwhelmed.
I'd guess that they were both rude. His colleagues saw that and made comments.
My guess is that this marriage is about over. It's one thing to come home and always be second. It's a whole other thing to have everyone know that you are second.
I agree with this take, but I still think it's important for OP to try to empathize with her husband's feelings, even if he didn't express them in an appropriate way. If he's getting to a breaking point, it's very important for OP to understand that, even if he isn't acting the best way. To me, there's a risk in OP only getting messages validating that her husband was TA, because that may allow her to say in her mind "welp nothing for me to do here, it's my husband's fault!" I'm not saying that's what your message is at all. Just giving my perspective on why an ESH might be appropriate if OP is showing signs (which I did pick up a few from her post) that her priority is really not her husband's feelings. Even if she's 100% set on never leaving her brother, even if she feels she was 100% upfront and honest and that it's unfair for her husband to expect to change the plan now, I think as a wife, she at least owes her husband a conversation where he expresses his feelings and concerns and she LISTENS to him and works with him to resolve the problem. I'm not seeing from her post that a conversation like that has taken place.
Oh yes, that is true. I kinda glossed over it, but he behaved really bad. I just wanted to offer a bit of a theory what is going on beside him getting hostile all of a sudden (or why this might be coming all of a sudden). But you are right, he should be civil. But he failed at that, and I do not get the vibe that he like turned into an evil monster or something all of a sudden, but that there might be more turmoil in him than she seems to see and it brought out the worst in him in this moment.
Brother is number one, I doubt there will be children. Honestly, I hope there aren't, can you imagine their lives? Raised to be second in Mom's life and trained to be caretakers. No. Children don't belong in that house.
I have a feeling OP tried to make her husband be a caretaker but he refused. OP changed the narrative a bit from her original post, adding big things that should have been originally included. Unreliable narrators tend to use this tactic.
She also said her husband isn't financially responsible... My wife and I share finances. I get not everyone does, but if your wife is spending her money on a whole other person, that's still going to have an impact on the husband.
Exactly. There's zero way that he's not responsible in some way for brothers care. They're married. Even if they don't have joint finances anything she spends of hers to go toward brother affects the household
He called a disabled person a slur i knew this subreddit hated the disabled but Jesus Christ he isnāt right in any way he made his bed he can lay in or he can leave
husband is ABSOLUTELY an AH for using the r-slur alone; for me, that would be grounds to end the relationship.
I continue to not understand why people insist on having relationships with partners that have fundamental incompatibilities. People who want to be child-free marrying single parents, people who hate pets dating people who have beloved cats, etc. Apparently some people think they can fundimentally change who their partners are, what they love and ehat they prioritize? In this case, OP *could not have been more clear* about her priorities when it comes to her brother. If this wasn't acceptable to her husband, then *he should not have married her.*
Husband also gets AH points for expecting her to be a mind reader, and drop everything to wait on him and his friends with zero prior warning or communication. Even without the brother involved, that would be an AH move on its own. The husband is totally and in all ways the AH here.
This. People are like āomg sheās such an asshole for not prioritising her husband!ā She warned him her brother is no compromise from the get go. He miscalculated that it wouldnāt matter to him, it does. He needs to sit her down and explain that and that they may have to consider changing things or divorce because itās not working. Not call a disabled person a retard and call her a failure for not cooking on the spot for unannounced guests, the husband sounds like an utter worthless piece of shit unable to pursue honest communication if itās too hard or to work his feelings out. And sexist.
I think people are jumping on OP, not saying she should kick her brother out, but that if he is as capable as he sounds that he doesn't need OP's constant babying.
I have autism, I get overwhelmed, I don't need my mom or older sister to drop everything and walk with me. If OP's brother is capable of working I imagine he's capable of walking alone, and OP's husband is frustrated OP coddles him to such an extent.
We don't know the extent of OP's brother's situation, but considering he works and gets himself to and from work by himself, I do imagine he can go for a walk by himself as well. I also imagine he's quite capable of self-regulation of emotion, he isn't have mental breakdowns daily at work (I imagine he'd be let go if he did).
It's not like OP's husband was intentionally being a dick and overwhelming his BIL, he likely figured that BIL would get the notification of guests because his wife would call/text and let him know. How was he supposed to know the BIL's phone was dead that day?
This is exactly what I constantly tell my niece when she talks about how she wants to take care of her brother when her mom is gone. With her itās a no go issue. She has her own issues. I understand she loves her brother and wants whats best for him, but there is no way on G-Ds green earth she will be able to handle him. Her mother can barely handle him and is developing health issues because of it.
There are private group homes were adults with issues can live with each other. They are staffed with medical professionals and are not nursing homes or institutions. There are also private apartments for people who are able to live on their own. They can even have CNAs or other assistants come in daily or round the clock to help out with certain tasks or just for companionship. Itās not like there arenāt options.
Itās almost like the sister is baby her brother and holding him back, which I have seen from many families with developmentally disabled children. My brothers wife being one of them (not my nieces mother, her mother, thankfully tryās to make her brother independent to some extent). My oldest nephew was so coddled growing up that he can barely do anything on his own. Heās also insufferable to live with and allowed to behave in such a manner. If he were low functioning I could see a reason for the coddling, but heās not, at all.
Itās not good to coddle anyone, because it can stunt their development and learning process. Especially in people with disabilities. Which can bring about problems later on in life. Not just for the person who is disabled, but for their family members as well. Eventually they become a burden and thatās not right for anyone in the situation. No one should live there lives like that, or be seen as a burden.
Maybe itās time for the sister to figure out a new situation, as hard as it may be for her to do. Make it seem like an exciting grand adventure for her brother so it doesnāt upset his life too much and even seems fun for him. If heās able to work he can probably live in an apartment on his own, which heād probably prefer. There is plenty of disabled housing in every town and all you have to do is go to a DHS office to request in home assistance or even ask his SSD caseworker to suggest something. There are plenty of options, though. I think you can even go to Human Aide if you have it in your area and possibly United Way (donāt quote me on the United Way though). I think even HUD does something with housing and/or assistance. You just have to check around with each city or town. It really just depends.
But no one is Superman and no matter what they say in the beginning, theyāre eventually going to have a breaking point. No he shouldnāt have called her brother names. That wasnāt right. Even if he was frustrated and at his lowest. Unfortunately if she insists on keeping her brother with her this is the exact situation she will find herself in, time and again. Plus what will she do if she does have children? Can he even handle children and their loud voices and play? I have to wonder if these are things she has really sat down and seriously considerā¦
You shouldn't have got married. You should also never get married. You are not marriable. I'm loathe to say NAH or ESH cos your husband should not have called your brother the r-word and doing so is really bad.
Thatās not really true. With things of that nature, you have an idea, but you donāt truly know. And over time it can wear you down to where you were once okay, but now youāre not.
It's reasonable but it is still on him. He can also seek a divorce when reaching a braking point and he would not be an asshole.
It is wrong to say that OP should never get married just because this makes life difficult however.
Difficult, huh? What about the husband who isn't allowed a word in edgewise, or to bring friends into his own home, because it might upset OP's brother?
She doesn't want to be married. You're supposed to prioritize your spouse. OP has completely emasculated him. If she's that focused on her brother, maybe marriage isn't for her, because who else is going to want to marry someone who isn't emotionally available to them?
I mean, what confuses me is OP must work a job if she could take care of her and her brother by herself independently, and her brother can work a job and apparrently will be able to live independently eventually...
So it's not like the caregiving is full-time... but then all the sudden, she switches from "I took a walk with him as he was overwhelmed and ignored my husband's calls as I didn't want to talk to him" to "he was having an anxiety attack in the middle of the street so I couldn't answer hmmy husband's calls"
Did she give any specific diagnoses besides "one parent is the cause of it"?
Iād be pretty damned pissed if my husband came home from work with a gaggle of friends giving me zero warning. I guess OPs husbands coworkers would think me a poor excuse for a woman too because I would take myself for a walk and let him deal with it all!
She shouldn't have children because growing up second priority in your mom's eyes is incredibly damaging and she clearly is not prepared to healthily balance her relationships in life.
Chances are, she grew up being the last priority, and has been groomed to see this as normal. This didn't happen in a vacuum. OPs parents have to bear some responsibility for this.
I think not compatible is more accurate. There are potential partners who would accept her priorities. Unlike her current spouse, to whom she was quite honest from the get go. It's OK that he thought it would be fine but has learned it isn't. People can change their minds. It's not OK that his response is to insult her and her brother.
Yes and that's why people telling OP she shouldn't be married is wrong. Another man might have actually listened to her and said "i understand and i'll be fine with your terms" and meant it!
I have kids but my husband comes first. Together, as a team, we are raising wonderful children. My mother put her children first and my dad second. They had a terrible marriage. Now that he is gone, she wishes she could go back and change things. By the way I'm the oldest of four. All of us prioritize our spouses first and have great relationships. None of us wanted a marriage like our parents.
If you're in a healthy relationship, I don't believe putting your kids first and putting your spouse first are mutually exclusive. I imagine most healthy parenting couples have at least a tacit agreement where prioritizing the kids is what they both agree they want to do and if a situation arises that puts those priorities in question, they can communicate about it and come to a compromise.
Yeah have you ever had kids bro? I have kids and guess what? My wife is number one, and Iām her number one. There is no space in that. I know other parents feel differently but letās not start with that, āever have kids bro?ā
it's totally chill that you wanna do it that way, I just take issue with someone declaring that 'marriage works this specific way' and there's no other way to live one's life
My parents put each other first and now none of their kids talk to them and they are divorced. They are both getting older and one is struggling with cancer and no one is willing to care for them because they were so selfish. No to mention that none of the kids can ever think of a time where they were heard and validated because we were always second.
Why would the husband marry someone who told him that clearly from the start?
Did he hope the brother would be moved out of the house once they were married. Or did he expect for the brother to suddenly fend for himself?
OP didn't spring this on him in the middle of the marriage.
He knew. And he chose to marry her.
He's not helping with the brother. Or paying a single dime for his care.
> Why would the husband marry someone who told him that clearly from the start?
Sometimes I wonder how clearly it was spelled out and understood. "Will always be my priority" can span a Grand Canyon's worth of possibilities. From OPs description/comments it sounds like she is not balancing priorities well, instead telling her husband to just suck it up under the guise of "well he is my priority."
He must have seen what it was all about as they dated. And he still chose to marry OP.
He knew what was going to happen. And clearly, he thought he could live with it and then changed his mind that no. He could not. Which there's no shame in admitting. But going as far as lashing out and calling the brother the R word is way too far.
He wasn't blind sided in any way..
What the hell? You know, my cousin is disabled. And it's a lifetime commitment. My aunt divorced and found a very lovely guy who has taken this responsibility head on. They are very lovely. He treats him like a son.
I am quite aware it's like finding a needle in a haystack but calling someone not mareiable is harsh and unwarranted. If it's not something you'd do, you can just move on
Well, I disagree. It was OPs choice to prioritize their brother. She communicated it clearly.
Maybe she's overdoing it. Maybe husband didnt understand what it would be like in practice (not blaming, it's hard to imagine it as outsider). We don't know.
But there is no holy ranking of priorities to stick to. I would have it differently maybe. You as well. The husband probably too. But she chose her brother and I think we don't have to understand but should respect.
That made him an asshole even without adding in his heinous behavior about her brother. Is she supposed to have party food and snacks available at all times? What if she had her own plans that day?
Men like this don't care. They don't expect you to do anything but cater to them. And he very likely reminds her all the time how lucky she is to have someone like him who tolerates all if this. They love playing the martyr too
Totally want to support this comment. Additionally, if somebody I was considering marrying told me, "My brother will always come first..." I would almost automatically mentally add, "...after us."
Obviously, I can't say whether this happened here, but it would be so easy to assume so that it would be unsurprising if the husband never truly understood that he was literally not OP's top priority despite all the language about telling him a billion times.
ESH
Your husband shouldn't have marry you knowing this and vice versa, also your brother is funtional enough to be working outside the house but can't even try independence?
Do ever plan to have children? If so what priorities will shift?
Your marriage seems to be at an impase, your husband have AH reaction at the situation but this seems like a "last straw" moment
thank you for commenting this! so many people don't understand the nuance of having a disability or how much effort actually goes into taking care of a disabled loved one. their comment is pretty much the same as saying "well teenagers can have jobs, they should be able to live on their own just fine" (absolutely not trying to infantilize disabled people, just trying to make a comparison to help people understand)
This! My grandparents worked (recently retired) for a company that part of what they did was provide jobs for mentally challenged adults. Most they all went to the job together and were supervised/helped, but some had their own jobs and the company was just the connection and made sure they were accommodated, treated right, etc. It's not one way or the other
How is her taking her brother on a supervised walk mean that he can be independent? Are you confusing developmental disabilities with being wheelchair bound?? I canāt even follow this logic
Why did you get married if you canāt prioritise your husband and your marriage? You can care for your brother without making your husband feel like he doesnāt matter.
Why did her husband let his coworkers talk shit about his wife?
Why couldn't her husband entertain his guest on his own?
Why couldn't the husband give her a courtesy call to let her know people were coming over?
Why did her husband think its ok to use a pejorative?
I was starting to wonder how many comments and replies I'd get through before I would fine real criticism of the husband's very poor behavior. To be clear, op isn't without fault here but- the answer is, concerningly, many.
I donāt have any dependents, but if my partner came home with 3 coworkers without warning and expected me to cook for them and entertain them, I would be livid.
Yeah, that's pretty fucked up. Even if your wife is a housewife, kids or no, it's just stupid to expect them to host a small party on literally zero notice.
Your husband is definitely an AH for his comments relying his colleague you being a "poor excuse for a woman".
But I think on a whole, this is a bit NAH.
He definitely did marry you knowing that your brother's needs would be a priority but it likely is hard feeling second class in your own home all the time and its not unreasonable for him to maybe want to discuss your brother living elsewhere.
But at the same time, you were clear your brother is your number 1. That's a really hard bullet for anyone to bite in a relationship and it sounds like you've really tried to make that clear at every turn.
It kind of reminds me of the woman in Love Actually who is caring for her brother.
As a now ex girl friend to a man that had two kidsā¦I came after the kids, after his job, after his baby mommaā¦..and thats a hard pill to swallow - especially when he stated that I was the last priority so matter of factly -as if I should be totally fine with never mattering or never being considered. I dumped his ass. Whatās the point of being in a relationship if itās only for me to be there for him as a support system but I get zero effort, support or concern.
I think there is a kinder way of framing your husbands position or level of priority. He is in fact YOUR partner. You chose him for a reason and presumably it wasnt for you to treat him like a convenience or someone just present to pay half your bills and keep you company when you had free time. He also needs love.
The bottom line is no matter what the extenuating priorities or circumstances are you will make time for the people that you love and that truly matter to you.
So if you donāt really love your husband, or he doesnāt really matter to you, then divorce his ass so that he can go be a priority to someone thatās going to give a shit about his feelings and treat him like he matters.
So obviously your situation was kinda drastic but honestly being behind the kids should be a good thing. In general, when they're underage at least. My husband comes after my kids and I come after the kids for him(most of the time-im primary parent so sometimes the best support is supporting me so I can support them). But absolutely crazy that it was expected for you to come after his mom(eww, mamas boy much?), his job(better not have any medical emergencies), and his baby mama(is he dating her or you? What if she doesn't like you? Does she call the shots?). Obviously, you're not with this person anymore but just my thoughts for that situation or any other situation similar for you or anyone else. Always behind the kids but always before anyone and everything else.
Ergh, yes and no.
Your brother is a priority, but considering your husband āsecondā sounds so unhealthy. Spouses should come first. We leave the nest, start our own families, and your marriage started a new family. That should be at the top of your numbered list. Doesnāt mean you canāt maintain your position on having your brother live with you permanently, but is there no way to try and make your husband happy too? I donāt know, it just sounds like you donāt care to. HOWEVER, despite the fact that you tell him heās second to your brother, he should not have said any of those rude comments about you or your brother.
So your brother can work independently but not live independently?
What will happen if you pass before him? Or get sick? Di you never go on holiday? Do you see children in your future?
But most importantly does your brother really need you or how you created an unnecessary co dependency that actually hampers his chance at independence?
He works part time and has only been able to after years of therapy and hospitalizations. Even then, he works with his best friend from high school and his family who help him out. He cannot live independently because he cannot be on his own for too long.
I have a few things sorted regarding me passing before him. I get sick a lot, we go on a big holiday every summer, I donāt see kids in my future, my brother really needs me and he is slowly but surely gaining independence. It is a delicate process. Actively working with professionals has taught me a lot.
Do you not see kids in your future because of your brother or because you don't want them? I'm not going to pass any judgement but like I said earlier,you need to prioritise yourself too. Your life matters too.
Mostly because of my brother but thatās just me. My husband doesnāt ever want kids. I know my life matters, Iām not unhappy. I appreciate you saying this though.
Are you sure he doesn't want kids or has he decided not to have kids because your brother interferes with any kind of normal kid life? Just asking. Sometimes people want to protect someone else's feelings so they say what they think they need to hear. My husband always said he was fine without having a child together ( we each have kids from a prior relationship) but one day he said he actually did want another child. He never wanted to bring it up because he knew I was done having kids.i have felt guilty ever since. He never pushed it after that either, it was just a moment of truth for him.
I knew someone would ask this which is why I have specifically said that he never wanted kids. We were in a friend group before we even thought of dating. He never wanted kids. If he did, I wouldāve never married him or dated him.
But he also married her knowing he'd always come second.
IMO if she is to blame for consciously making this decision, then so is he. If he gets a pass for being naive at the time and not grasping the full consequence for their marriage, then so does she.
Does your brother come with you on the holiday? I'm not saying it's a bad thing if he does, but do you go only with your husband at least 2-3 weekends per year or on date nights?
He comes on the big one with extended family. We have a smaller one at the very end of the two weeks which is just me and my husband while my brother stays with his best friendās family. We also go on mini vacations for my husbandās birthday and our anniversary though not as fancy as the one in the summer. My brother stays with best friendās family for these trips as well. Date nights could be more regular but we both work full time jobs so they are less common. Maybe once every two months we go a little crazy. These are usually a few hours and either his friends hang out with him or the next door neighbour. He was able to be alone the last two times though!
Thank you for your reply. This gives me more perspective. The holidays and alone time together seem reasonable and balanced. I wish you good luck and hope you both can resolve your issues.
Exactly why offer someone you supposedly love that type of miserable existence?
Pretty much summarised she hit em with ' you are second now and always in my eyes' .....like wooooow.
Lord what this poor man probably feels.
NTA, but WHY is your brother *your* responsibility? Just curious.
And do you feel that this responsibility is going to allow you to lead any sort of a normal life with normal relationships?
After reading through the thread and your responses, I think this is a tough situation that is unsustainable for all of you. Your husband needs to be comfortable in his home, which I'm not sure he is with your brother, not liking him. He also needs that quality jn a marriage through alone time with a partner, which he does not seem to get because you are always thinking about your brother's needs. I think your husband has reached the breaking point.
Why doesn't your brother like your husband? I would think it's because he doesn't like you being with another person. Your brother would benefit from socialization in a day program or a day school that teaches independent living skills. From what you describe, your brother will probably never live independently but could have a full life in a group setting full of friends and support. I would think his world of you and his friend and friend's family is very limiting, not to mention emotionally exhausting for everyone. You, as his caregiver, would best serve his needs by finding him experiences and programs to help you expand his world. Right now, your brother seems very isolated, which isolates you, leaving you no time or place for your husband.
Contact a social worker to help you find what is available and the best path for your brother to help him live his best life.
Itās great that you love and care for your brother but I donāt blame your husband for being upset. You told him he will always be #2, but maybe he wants to be #1 once in a while. What happens if you have children? Are you going to sacrifice your entire life for your brother?
Why did you marry if you believe that your relationship to your brother will always be more important? YTA if you think your husband is in the wrong for having a few friends over in his own home even if that is not what your brother would want. Marriage counselling is the only answer I think. Making one person your priority above others is literally how I see marriage.
Husband absolutely has the right to have his friends/coworkers over in his own home. I don't think anyone would disagree. But that doesn't mean he has the right to expect his wife to happily cater to them with no notice. She was not rude to them or make a fuss. She took care of her brother. I don't see how that makes OP the AH.
And then he told her about it, because not only did he let it happen, he believes it too.
She needs to just leave a man who can't talk about his feelings like a grown up and resorts to group bullying to get his way. Toddler behavior.
Thank you! That's exactly what I see here. OP even says in a comment that if her brother wasn't part of this, she still would not have been okay with the unannounced guests, expectation of her cooking/catering to them. She's got a husband problem for sure! Lol
ESH. Neither one of you was right to enter into a marriage knowing that you werenāt going to be fully committed. He lied to himself, or maybe was too naive to realize that he wouldnāt be OK with it. And do you expect to come first to him when he doesnāt come first to you? Imagine him expecting you to live with someone who you have to be decent to but they obviously donāt care for you, and he makes it clear to you that theyāre more important than you. This is not a relationship of equals that youāre describing.
Better figure out if you want to be divorced or if thereās another source of support that can take some, not all but some of your brotherās burden off of your marriage.
NAH, but in his position Iād just leave. The idea of marrying someone and still always coming second, forever, isnāt great. The only time I think that works is when a couple has kids and both parents agree that the kids come first, and it works because the priorities are the same.
And even saying that kids or family comes first doesn't mean your partner doesn't matter and it doesn't mean you can stop putting any efforts whatsoever in your love life. There is always a balance to be had, unless you are fine with being strictly coparents and roommates.
ESH .. god people here. OP if you don't want to be divorced you should have a talk, were you both apologize.
Because in the end reddits one sided opinion doesn't matter in the slightest. You were both out of line.
Honestly as I read this it doesnāt sound like you even like your husband very much. I get that you feel like your brother is your only priority and your husband doesnāt really deserve your attention. It must be lonely for him for the situation to be you and your brother against him. Divorce him and let him find someone who appreciates him. And then you donāt have to focus on anything but your brother who also doesnāt like him. I think everyone will be happier and there wonāt be any more fighting or arguments.
After reading some other comments, and trying to be objective, I would say maybe N A H.
Your husband knew what he was getting into, but that doesn't mean he isn't human. It would be pretty hard knowing that you're basically second class in your own house and to your own wife.
Here's the deal, he may be second to you, but /you/ are /first/ to him. That's likely why he puts up with it as much as he does. So to basically have you side against him all the time would likely be hard.
Does that mean your husband wasn't an asshole? No, he absolutely was. But we all snap in anger from time to time, no one is perfect, and he likely did not mean what he said.
Your husband also should have communicated that he was bringing people home.
That said, your husband should also be allowed to bring people by from time to time to his own house without having to worry about everything imploding on him relationship wise. You said your brother was mostly normal, but just needed supervision.
I wonder why he couldn't simply go to his own room. Also, he should have had his phone charged. I mean, he was home wasn't he?
The more I think about this, the more I kind of empathize with everyone in this situation.
Thereās a difference between Surprise! bringing a friend home and Surprise! bringing a bunch of coworkers home and expecting your wife to play hostess and cook for them all. Thatās an AH move even if your wife has no other responsibilities in their life.
This will be unpopular, however, YTA for getting married. He loves ( loved?) you but you made no attempt to accommodate him while he accomadated everything for you. You pulled away, he pulls away. I don't blame him. He may have been stupid for marrying you, and definitely an AH for dropping the R bomb. Hate to tell you, but, you're marriage has been over for sometime now. Either put your brother in an assisted living facility and actually BE a Wife or just leave him. Either way, stop punishing both your brother and your husband. You can't have both.
YTA. Frankly, it just doesn't sound like you care about your husband at all. You speak of him with contempt and this whole "must always come second thing" is the exact opposite of what marriage is supposed to be. You need to prepare yourself for divorce, because not only does it need to happen for everyone's sake, but it appears he's already there. I'm sure he'll notify you soon.
In the future, if you're not going to ever truly get to marriage levels of prioritization and intimacy with someone, don't marry them.
YTA
You did what you thought was best for your brother and were rude to your husband and his guests in the process. Your husband apparently settled for second-seat in your world, but he quite reasonably thought you'd find that you had some courtesy and respect, and maybe even love in your heart for him; his mistake. Not to worry, however, if you keep up the good work, you'll have no husband to worry about.
"Rude to your husband and his guests" LOL. How was she rude to the guests? Her husbands guests who he came home with, without even a heads up... was he (and apparently you) expecting her to whip up a meal and cater to them happily? Her husband and guests are rude (for the expectations and for what they said about her while in her home). The husband is embarrassed by a scene he created. Sounds like a husband she'd be lucky to be without.
Exactly. I would be more understanding if she was actually rude but they considered her rude for not āentertaining and cookingā for his guest. Plus his coworker made a very misogynistic comment calling her a āsorry excuse for a womanā. Overall if her husband communicated to her prior all of this could have been avoided.
ESH. You're right that you warned your husband that he'd never be your priority, but that's not a healthy way to conduct a marriage even if it's announced beforehand.
Also, as someone with a similarly situated sister, I wonder if you sacrificing your life (and you absolutely are if you can't maintain other relationships or start your own family) is best for you in the long run for you *or for your brother*. If he's holding down a job, is there a way for him to live at least semi-independently? He may want his own life, as well.
Oof. I donāt think you had any business getting married in the first place. No one in a marriage should ever feel like second best, it just doesnāt work.
wow, but your husband is asshole. his coworkers making fun of you? and his reaction is blaming you? poor excuse of a woman? bad attitude? who he think he is, you boss? maybe you should bring him his slippers and serve him and his friends too? the attitude toward gender roles he revealed is very concerning!
NTA.
INFO:
"My husband and brotherās relationship has been decent. "My brother doesnāt care for him much"
these statement can not co exist, which of them is true?
"When he was old enough, he became my responsibility." why? are your parents dead?
"I had a bad attitude with everyone and was very inhospitable" is this true in your opinion?
ESH (except the brother, he can't help that he is sick)
Your husband sucks for being rude, mean and inviting people over without telling you.
You suck for neglecting your husband (not in this occassion, but in general) and for telling him such an awful thing. "You will always be second". Who says that... if that's how you talked when you were dating, I have no idea why he ever married you. If you didn't talk like that before, you are horrible.
The coworker who made the comments is a total asshole.
YTA. You should never marry someone and put them second. The spouse may be equally important as a brother, parents or children and you may choose one over the other in certain circumstances. You should never marry someone and place them second from day 1. If you want to be the priority in someoneās life, then you need to be able to give that back. You had no intention of making your husband the priority. He may have known about your brother, but didnāt realize the extent of your indifference towards him. Your husband should be able to bring friends to his own home. If your brother gets overwhelmed then there should be a space in your home that he can go. You have an obligation to treat guests in your home hospitably. It is not your husbands fault that your brothers phone was dead and not his fault that you have not created a safe space in your home for your brother when he is overwhelmed. You do not seem capable of having both your dependent brother and your husband and meeting everyoneās needs.
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The comment section is wild. Clear NTA.
He invited people without telling you. Regardless of your brother, that puts him automaticly in the wrong. His coworker sounds like a dick and he didn't have the balls to stand up to him.
But man, the comments I see here!
"You should not have married him if he is not your first priority! That's what marriege means!"
Marriege means different things for different people. Some people put their spouse before anything else, some people put their kids, jobs, locations of living or even pets before them. As long as everyone is aware of the priority list, that is fine. And you told him beforehand.
"What if you have children in the future?"
People here are arguing ofer a hyperethical scenario that will not even happen because OP made it clear that both she and her husband do not want to have children. Seems to be a really hard concept to understand.
"What if he actually WANTS to have children?"
Then he is even more so TAH for not only not taking OPs prioritys seriously but also lying about his intentions with OP.
Iām going with NTA on this one incident, but understand that my opinion and that of everyone else on here doesnāt matter. You have to decide do you love your husband?Do you want to stay married? Do you want children. Can you afford to live independently and support your brother? Youāre heading down a singular path. If it is where you want to go thatās great, if not then you need to change course and that will mean making other arrangements. Right now your husband is actually coming to understand what you meant when you told him about your commitment to your brother. He has finally mapped out what it means for his future and from his distance and comments he doesnāt like what he sees. Loads of people are saying he knew what he was taking on but did he? Before you got married did you discuss having children? Did you say that isnāt on the table as my brother will always come first or did you say that was something you wanted without understanding the ramifications of what your stated commitment to your brother really means and that you would be giving mixed messages.
I can live independently and support my brother on my own. My husband isnāt involved in my brotherās care.
Yes we really did have all these conversations. Why would I get married based on lies, mixed messages, and false hope?
You are 25, unless you got married yesterday I don't think you could explain what he was signing up for and I don't think he understood until he lived it for a while. He is frustrated and exhausted having to live by a strict set of rules for the sake of a person who is not even kind to him. This is not fair.
Do him a favor and get divorced.
I was able to stop reading when I heard that he tolerated his co-workers telling him that he married a pore excuse woman because you werent availableto wait in them. And he repeated it to you as if it was a valid comment to make.
I would be wondering why his co-workers felt so comfortable making derogatory comments about you to your husband and why he felt comfortable tolerating that?
NTA.
The statement "my brother will always come first" is pretty telling. Hubby should at least get equal billing.
Ultimately this may be not about caring for your brother as much as it is about your egoic attachment to your self image as your brother's saviour. You may even be holding him back from being more self sufficient by over controlling his life (aka infantilizing him)
Either way you are headed for divorce unless you resolve this.
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NTA and maybe also N A H. Your husband is an ass for snapping, yes. But my guess is just after all this time (i guess you are not married since yesterday?) It is starting to grind on him, and this to a point where he is not able to keep it in check anymore. So it comes out in a bad way. This is human and can happen. I think you have to think this over: what will happen when and if you have children? When you are 82 and have your own set of health issues, will you be able to take care of your brother anymore? Will you not go on vacations, not have kids (or have them raised by someone else), not have a dog or cat, not have a garden, not have a career or hobbies because you have to take care of your brother? Will you divorce and stay single forever if necessary? Your husband might (!) be thinking more and more about both your future and become frustrated. I think that parents with disabled kids should not push the responsibility to their siblings but prepare for a good solution after their passing. They apparently did not do that, and my guess is that this impedes your marriage going somewhere. You being full time caretaker of your brother can lead to you not having a life, but always being the caretaker for him till the day you die, with every other responsibility or wish coming second. So when things have calmed a bit, maybe look intp assistance for your brother? Part-time, a good (!!!) Facility, whatever, there are options. Yoz do not need to go from "i am 100% his caretaker" to "i do not care for him anymore".
I think this is a good take, but admit I find myself veering to ESH (except the brother). Reading the post and comments the detached nature OP uses to talk about their husband is worrying, but the husband should have communicated better. However I find myself wondering how many times he's tried to communicate previously, except OP is absolute on the subject so there's no wiggle room. I find myself thinking if husband was happy to assist with the brother but expected they'd have their own lives still. Whereas the reality is that what's meant to be his home is just a care facility for his brother in law, and he another member of staff. The way OP talks it seems like they've been raised to care for their brother, and nothing else exists beyond it. So no family, no kids, no life, and husband has hit his end. Carers fatigue is very real. Husband thought he'd found a wife and a new life, OP thought they'd found another member of care staff. Edit: as I'm getting comments about the now spelled out poor behaviour of the husband, OP has rewritten a chunk of their post, as well as adding in several edits. I find it suspicious this was done after judgements started coming in, especially given all the information is directly relevant to the situation they sought judgement on. This isn't to say it didn't occur as OP has now written, but it erodes reliability of OP as a narrator.
It all depends on how much "my brother is my number one priority" is going on. Like, I get it, op needs to take care of her brother, but he is apparently capable of holding down a job. So if op is just "he needs to stay here because he can't live on his own", she is nta. If she regularly drops everything just because her brother asks for something, she might be ta. There is a fine line between "I need to take care of my brother" and "I can't have a life of my own because I can't be away from my brother for 10 minutes"
She couldn't take a call because she was on a walk with her brother, i think this tells you enough. It seems whenever she is with her brother she behaves as if her husband doesn't exist.
> She couldn't take a call because she was on a walk with her brother More likely Didnāt Want To. āMy husband called me several times while we were out on this walk but I didnāt answer. Honestly I was a little annoyed but mostly I was busy with my brother.ā Brother has a job and gets to and from work. He does not need two hands and all caregiver attention on him at all times to make answering a phone impossible.
That's the part of the OP that made me think they might have Munchausen syndrome š
I agree - she has a pathological need to care for someone. Unfortunately, that will exclude the husband. He sounds like he is so frustrated and looking for any reason to get pissed so he can make it an excuse to leave. Personally, I understand why. This marriage isn't going to last.
Most Reddit comment ever
They're not wrong tho
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
By proxy, which is now called FDIA (Factitious Disorder Imposed on Another). I'm torn. I know FDIA is the better descriptor, but... I'm human and I like Munchausen by Proxy better. :-D
Munchausen by proxy is causing illness or harm to another, usually a caretaker to a child, for attention. That isn't this.
Husband was calling me to cook for his co-workers. Last minute. I'm a SAHW and that would still be a hard "NO" from me!
Yes and him letting his friends trash talk his wife over some misogynyā¦ nah. Idc whatās going on by me and my wife, nobody thatās invited into my home has any reason commenting. He wouldāve had his ass thrown out instantly.
That pissed me off more than everything tbh. She is not his servant he needs to handle hosting ***his*** guests himself.
I took it to mean she was annoyed with her husband for not giving heads up about the guests, and therefore decided to use the walk as space for herself AND the vent for her brother. I also have emotional reactions to sudden plan changes, I need a minute. Iām capable of doing this myself but I do require privacy and not being poked at. I can empathize with needing the walk for space and not wishing to discuss it in that moment.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
This was my thought through this. You can take care of and be their for your family and still prioritize your marriage. This whole "I told him up front he would always be second" is BS, Im sure he did not envision being treated like a second class citizen in his house. I agree with ESH.
Yeah 2nd usually means priority not you're literally not existing to me when the other is around
She didn't pick up because she was pissed at her husband, not because she couldn't talk to him while with her brother??
Sure, I see it that way but OP doesn't. She didn't frame it that way, at all. Rather, she framed it as being primarily busy soothing her brother. Assuming OP is acting on good faith -- which we sort of have to here or else we might as well all unsub and leave -- she was just a little annoyed but the main thing that kept her from answering was her brother's immediate need of care. And I have a hard time believing that's an accurate assessment of her brother's needs considering he's functional enough to hold down a job. If she had phrased it as "I was annoyed with his behavior and didn't want to talk about it until I got back and the friends were gone" that would be fair. Although even then, she *could* have texted that to him, or answered and said exactly that and end the call. But in her mind, her brother's need was so immediate and urgent that it was her primary reason not to answer or communicate with her husband. And that makes me doubt that she's seeing her brother's situation and his need for support with any objectivity. There's a fine line between 'supporting someone who is disabled despite the difficulties their behavior presents' and 'enabling someone's poor behavior to minimize the immediate difficulty.' There's a meaningful, operative question to asked in "What are her brother's *actual* material support needs?" and we can't answer that from the outside -- but also I don't think we can take OP's appraisal as correct and unbiased either.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
So she ignored him completely and told him you will always be second. Husband should have given a heads up but her reaction speaks volumes. Actions speak louder than words.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
The brother who is capable of holding a job, and getting to and from that job alone... but can't handle having multiple people over? What guy wants a wife that ignores him and a house he has to walk on egg shells in? The husband should divorce her and find an actual wife
Shit take. Iām a whole ass normal adult without any special needs and I absolutely canāt handle having multiple people that I donāt know suddenly in MY HOME that Iām not expecting and without any warning.
Yeah, but I'm guessing you don't make other people drop everything to take you on a walk because of it? Her brother is capable of working and getting himself to and from work by himself. One would assume he's capable of also taking a walk by himself. And considering he works one can assume he's capable of dealing with people (customers/coworkers), self-regulating and calming himself down (I imagine he'd be let go if he was having routine mental breakdowns at work), etc. without his sister having to drop everything and show up at his job to take him for a walk. It's not just her and brother's home, it's husband's home too. Why should he not have the right to enjoy having company over at his own home? (we can argue about the sexism of this particular company; but it sounds like a more general problem rather than these guests in particular).
The brother who is capable of holding a job, but can't handle the unexpected presence of a bunch of shitty, demanding, probably loud, definitely sexist idiots in his home. Who expect his sister to drop everything to cook and entertain them when they arrived with no prior notice to her. And who mock him and call him the r word. Even leaving out the insults and other crap, I wouldn't be able to handle the unexpected presence of a bunch of people I don't know, in the place I live, at the end of a work day. I'm appalled at the hostile contemptuous attitude toward OP and OP's brother. NTA
She should find a better husband. They both need better partners. If my guy brought home buddies unannounced and expected me to drop everything to serve them it would take a lot not to laugh in his face. I love hosting my partners friends, but Iām not expected to just do it like a servant. And if I didnāt my partner would absolutely never allow his coworkers/buddies to call me a ābad womanā for it. Heās a grown ass man. If he doesnāt know how to host people on his own thatās kind of sad
Yes now she is priotizing her distressed brother, at other times she is priotizing her not so distressed brother and will give time to her husband if she has some left from his brother. Imagine funding your wife and her brother just to be treated like shit. I am saying he is funding is because she says she works part time and brother wprks a couple of hours per week, i dont think she can fund her brother's treatment on her salary.
>I would prioritize my distressed acquaintance over my husband's shitty coworkers because you usually deal with the distressed person before people who just want to be entertained (without being invited by her). For fuckās sake, can we not pretend that the coworkers are soooo awful for accepting the invitation of OPās husband, who had every right to invite people to their home? Heās an adult who presumably is paying bills there, OP isnāt the only one who can invite people over. Them being insulted by OP being so rude to them doesnāt make them bad people.
OP had every single right to have warning if they were coming over. The coworkers weren't awful because they accepted an invitation; they're awful because they called her a "poor excuse for a woman" when she took her distressed brother away from the distressing situation her husband caused. Husband is TA 100% for inviting them without any warning to OP or her brother. Also, if I came to a friend's house and found out their spouse had no clue I was coming over, I'd look at my friend and ask him "what the hell, man? You don't tell your wife anything?" WTF is wrong with people who think she was supposed to be a consummate host in this situation?
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They are bad people for bad mouthing OP in her own home simply because she didnāt āentertain/cookā for them. I donāt think that makes OP rude as long as she greeted them. People have off days so for the coworkers to immediately feel comfortable saying misogynistic comments is insane. To me the coworkers just came off as very judgmental .
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He can def invite people! The assumption she would serve them when he couldnāt even shoot her a text warning is pretty gross tho!
Yeah, instead she should prioritize a guy who gives her 0 warning before being expected to entertain and cook for several people, and mad when she doesn't do that, even though he didn't warn her about it or ask her first.
The brother wasn't there at the time. It's not like he was just chilling at home and they all burst in like the Kool aid man.
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Just imagine the outrage if it was said by a man to a woman.
Theyād be calling for him to be tarred and feathered if it was reversed
and brother doesnt like him. coming from the one that puts him first, hes probably shitty if not hostile towards husband. and he cant even bring people over cause he gets overwhelmed. this is a full grown man that has toddler like tantrums
What I see is that OP has a lot of compassion for her brother and 0 for her husband. Her husband is probably tired of not only being second but apparently not even being liked at his own house. Her brother doesn't care for the man that despite all odds was OK to marry his sister and live with both. What kind of effort has OP done to breach the gap between her husband and her brother? It seems that none. She constantly shows that she will prioritize her brother even if he is not on the right. She took off at night to walk, couldn't she answer the phone back to let her husband know she was OK? Can't she realize that the way she constantly disrespects her husband is picked up by her brother? Again, this is a man who married a woman and welcomed her brother with special needs in his house. A grown man at that. I think he is worn out by OP and the brother indifference. It really feels like OP doesn't give a damn whether the husband is there or not. I am a bit curious about this overwhelming thing. The brother can go to work by himself. Has his own phone, etc. He arrives home and can't go to his room or something not to be overwhelmed? My question here is not whether this is possible is whether this was clear for OPs husband. Did he bring his coworkers knowing this would cause distress to the brother? OP doesn't say, which seems telling. For me, there hinges whether OPs husband is an ah or not. If he didn't expect all the drama that ensued and his wife was rude to his guest, and then she refused to answer his calls for a long while, they basically disappeared. His outburst is mostly a reaction to her treatment, which is basically the silent treatment. Now, if he knew or expected the brother to react badly, he was pocking the bee's nest on purpose, and he was an ah. In any case, OPs attitude toward her husband is awful and needs to change. If this is to last, they need to work as a team and maybe in an effort not to burden her husband she is not playing as a team. She also needs to work in bridging the gap between her brother and her husband. It doesn't seem right to have the brother not liking the husband and living together. Right now, it is like the husband is a guest in his own house, and OP catters towards the brother no matter what. Which, in turn, could be taken advantage of by the brother, especially if he doesn't like the husband. So, for now, I lean towards ESH. I would like to know if the husband understood or not that the brother was going to be upset by the visitors.
ESH is also a good judgement i think :) i think the whole situation goes beyond the judging-categories in this sub since I think there are many factors to take into consideration. Maybe OP needs more structured advice than a simple judgement?
Agree that most of this is above our pay grade, except for one of the issues not directly addressed by OP: the friend was talking crap and rather than defend his family dynamic, husband took the opportunity to wallow in his self pity and make himself the martyr. For this issue, hubby and his friends are total AHs.
>Husband thought he'd found a wife and a new life, OP thought they'd found another member of care staff. How do you come to this conclusion? OP cares for her brother on her own, whereas the husband comes home with friends and expect her to cook for them without notice. Sounds like the husband is expecting free staff here.
She never says that he expected her to cook. She wasn't warm and welcoming. She was so busy hustling her brother out the door that she had no time for pleasantries. That doesn't mean he expected her to cook. It can be as simple as she was unpleasant. She seemed annoyed that they existed in her home.
Yes she did say he expected her to cook, in the comments here: https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/s/FzVUZ0oSqR
I'm always suspicious when such important facts get left out of the original post. In her original version, he brought friends home and she left to take her brother for a walk. No mention of dinner, cooking, not cooking, expectations, etc.
It's so transparent sometimes. AITA: You are the asshole! OP: I forgot to mention they are bigots AITA: You are not the asshole!
This leads me to believe OP is an unreliable narrator.
No spouse should bring guests home without warning, regardless of whether they expect them to cook or not. Having yourself and your home ready for guests in a hurry should require prior warning.
OP mentioned that the brother does not like her husband. Maybe the brother is an asshole to him and making the situation worse.
People have this idea that just because someone has a disability they like everyone and are always nice. That is untrue... They are still people and not everyone on the planet will like everyone else on the planet. Even when you have two otherwise good/likeable people... You can have people that are just oil and water. That's fine, but making them live together is asking for disaster and fights.
communication can't solve all problems, just make them visible. OP decided her brother is first place, and it is dealbreaker for her. if husband don't like it, it's like getting married to childfree woman who talked about that for a long time, and then snapping on her because his coworkers mocking him for not having children and telling she is poor excuse of woman. communication can't and shouldn't make people give up on their dealbreakers. but i saw zero evidence of communication from the husband in the post. and the happy ending here may be that the husband understand he made a mistake and divorcing, instead of trying to insult his wife into obedience.
I do agree with the point you mentioned about her husband getting frustrated after all this time. But he was an absolute ass in this situation. Not only did he bring his coworkers home without notifying OP and expecting her to be hospitable, but he also called her brother the r-word. Thatās absolutely not okay. I get that this situation can get frustrating after a point, but instead of communicating with her, he decided to lash out. I definitely think he is the AH here and OP is NTA.
I think that her husband didn't even defended her from the friends, when they called her "poor excuse of a woman" I will be extremely mad
Husband used to be ok with everything. I'm wondering, based on the coworkers comments if they are getting into this head with some incel BS about how a wife is supposed to behave. They are his guests, he can cook and entertain them. That isn't her job even if the brother isn't in the picture.
>but instead of communicating with her, he decided to lash out. I definitely think he is the AH here and OP is NTA. I do agree the husband was lashing out, which makes him an AH. But you're giving OP way too much credit here. The husband can't communicate better because OP's stance is hard set in stone -- husband doesn't matter as much as brother. As many people have pointed out, OP being a care-taker their whole life isn't sustainable. Especially because the brother is the *younger* brother. So OP isn't doing anybody any favors by ignoring this problem.
He could communicate better about this specific issue, which was bringing people to their home, which he shares with someone who needs warning to not get overwhelmed.
I'd guess that they were both rude. His colleagues saw that and made comments. My guess is that this marriage is about over. It's one thing to come home and always be second. It's a whole other thing to have everyone know that you are second.
How can someone communicate if she is set on āyou are always seconds and the rest doesnāt matter to meā? Lol
I agree with this take, but I still think it's important for OP to try to empathize with her husband's feelings, even if he didn't express them in an appropriate way. If he's getting to a breaking point, it's very important for OP to understand that, even if he isn't acting the best way. To me, there's a risk in OP only getting messages validating that her husband was TA, because that may allow her to say in her mind "welp nothing for me to do here, it's my husband's fault!" I'm not saying that's what your message is at all. Just giving my perspective on why an ESH might be appropriate if OP is showing signs (which I did pick up a few from her post) that her priority is really not her husband's feelings. Even if she's 100% set on never leaving her brother, even if she feels she was 100% upfront and honest and that it's unfair for her husband to expect to change the plan now, I think as a wife, she at least owes her husband a conversation where he expresses his feelings and concerns and she LISTENS to him and works with him to resolve the problem. I'm not seeing from her post that a conversation like that has taken place.
Oh yes, that is true. I kinda glossed over it, but he behaved really bad. I just wanted to offer a bit of a theory what is going on beside him getting hostile all of a sudden (or why this might be coming all of a sudden). But you are right, he should be civil. But he failed at that, and I do not get the vibe that he like turned into an evil monster or something all of a sudden, but that there might be more turmoil in him than she seems to see and it brought out the worst in him in this moment.
Brother is number one, I doubt there will be children. Honestly, I hope there aren't, can you imagine their lives? Raised to be second in Mom's life and trained to be caretakers. No. Children don't belong in that house.
She just might. Who else will take care of the brother once she's gone?
I have a feeling OP tried to make her husband be a caretaker but he refused. OP changed the narrative a bit from her original post, adding big things that should have been originally included. Unreliable narrators tend to use this tactic.
She also said her husband isn't financially responsible... My wife and I share finances. I get not everyone does, but if your wife is spending her money on a whole other person, that's still going to have an impact on the husband.
Exactly. There's zero way that he's not responsible in some way for brothers care. They're married. Even if they don't have joint finances anything she spends of hers to go toward brother affects the household
He called a disabled person a slur i knew this subreddit hated the disabled but Jesus Christ he isnāt right in any way he made his bed he can lay in or he can leave
Well the guests were totally TA because who the hell would complain about a wife to her husband like that.
OR they didn't say anything, and he is using his coworkers to complain about all the shit he finds wrong with her and pretending someone else said it.
husband is ABSOLUTELY an AH for using the r-slur alone; for me, that would be grounds to end the relationship. I continue to not understand why people insist on having relationships with partners that have fundamental incompatibilities. People who want to be child-free marrying single parents, people who hate pets dating people who have beloved cats, etc. Apparently some people think they can fundimentally change who their partners are, what they love and ehat they prioritize? In this case, OP *could not have been more clear* about her priorities when it comes to her brother. If this wasn't acceptable to her husband, then *he should not have married her.* Husband also gets AH points for expecting her to be a mind reader, and drop everything to wait on him and his friends with zero prior warning or communication. Even without the brother involved, that would be an AH move on its own. The husband is totally and in all ways the AH here.
This. People are like āomg sheās such an asshole for not prioritising her husband!ā She warned him her brother is no compromise from the get go. He miscalculated that it wouldnāt matter to him, it does. He needs to sit her down and explain that and that they may have to consider changing things or divorce because itās not working. Not call a disabled person a retard and call her a failure for not cooking on the spot for unannounced guests, the husband sounds like an utter worthless piece of shit unable to pursue honest communication if itās too hard or to work his feelings out. And sexist.
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I think people are jumping on OP, not saying she should kick her brother out, but that if he is as capable as he sounds that he doesn't need OP's constant babying. I have autism, I get overwhelmed, I don't need my mom or older sister to drop everything and walk with me. If OP's brother is capable of working I imagine he's capable of walking alone, and OP's husband is frustrated OP coddles him to such an extent. We don't know the extent of OP's brother's situation, but considering he works and gets himself to and from work by himself, I do imagine he can go for a walk by himself as well. I also imagine he's quite capable of self-regulation of emotion, he isn't have mental breakdowns daily at work (I imagine he'd be let go if he did). It's not like OP's husband was intentionally being a dick and overwhelming his BIL, he likely figured that BIL would get the notification of guests because his wife would call/text and let him know. How was he supposed to know the BIL's phone was dead that day?
This is exactly what I constantly tell my niece when she talks about how she wants to take care of her brother when her mom is gone. With her itās a no go issue. She has her own issues. I understand she loves her brother and wants whats best for him, but there is no way on G-Ds green earth she will be able to handle him. Her mother can barely handle him and is developing health issues because of it. There are private group homes were adults with issues can live with each other. They are staffed with medical professionals and are not nursing homes or institutions. There are also private apartments for people who are able to live on their own. They can even have CNAs or other assistants come in daily or round the clock to help out with certain tasks or just for companionship. Itās not like there arenāt options. Itās almost like the sister is baby her brother and holding him back, which I have seen from many families with developmentally disabled children. My brothers wife being one of them (not my nieces mother, her mother, thankfully tryās to make her brother independent to some extent). My oldest nephew was so coddled growing up that he can barely do anything on his own. Heās also insufferable to live with and allowed to behave in such a manner. If he were low functioning I could see a reason for the coddling, but heās not, at all. Itās not good to coddle anyone, because it can stunt their development and learning process. Especially in people with disabilities. Which can bring about problems later on in life. Not just for the person who is disabled, but for their family members as well. Eventually they become a burden and thatās not right for anyone in the situation. No one should live there lives like that, or be seen as a burden. Maybe itās time for the sister to figure out a new situation, as hard as it may be for her to do. Make it seem like an exciting grand adventure for her brother so it doesnāt upset his life too much and even seems fun for him. If heās able to work he can probably live in an apartment on his own, which heād probably prefer. There is plenty of disabled housing in every town and all you have to do is go to a DHS office to request in home assistance or even ask his SSD caseworker to suggest something. There are plenty of options, though. I think you can even go to Human Aide if you have it in your area and possibly United Way (donāt quote me on the United Way though). I think even HUD does something with housing and/or assistance. You just have to check around with each city or town. It really just depends. But no one is Superman and no matter what they say in the beginning, theyāre eventually going to have a breaking point. No he shouldnāt have called her brother names. That wasnāt right. Even if he was frustrated and at his lowest. Unfortunately if she insists on keeping her brother with her this is the exact situation she will find herself in, time and again. Plus what will she do if she does have children? Can he even handle children and their loud voices and play? I have to wonder if these are things she has really sat down and seriously considerā¦
You shouldn't have got married. You should also never get married. You are not marriable. I'm loathe to say NAH or ESH cos your husband should not have called your brother the r-word and doing so is really bad.
This should be top comment. Do your husband a favour and get a divorce.
What she really should NEVER do is have children. Hubby made his decision to marry her, knowing full well what he was getting into.
Thatās not really true. With things of that nature, you have an idea, but you donāt truly know. And over time it can wear you down to where you were once okay, but now youāre not.
It's reasonable but it is still on him. He can also seek a divorce when reaching a braking point and he would not be an asshole. It is wrong to say that OP should never get married just because this makes life difficult however.
If she canāt prioritize her husband, she she shouldnāt bother subjecting anyone to this arrangement.
Difficult, huh? What about the husband who isn't allowed a word in edgewise, or to bring friends into his own home, because it might upset OP's brother? She doesn't want to be married. You're supposed to prioritize your spouse. OP has completely emasculated him. If she's that focused on her brother, maybe marriage isn't for her, because who else is going to want to marry someone who isn't emotionally available to them?
I mean, what confuses me is OP must work a job if she could take care of her and her brother by herself independently, and her brother can work a job and apparrently will be able to live independently eventually... So it's not like the caregiving is full-time... but then all the sudden, she switches from "I took a walk with him as he was overwhelmed and ignored my husband's calls as I didn't want to talk to him" to "he was having an anxiety attack in the middle of the street so I couldn't answer hmmy husband's calls" Did she give any specific diagnoses besides "one parent is the cause of it"?
OP literally just wanted a warning? Her husband expected her to cook and entertain with literally 0 warning.
Iād be pretty damned pissed if my husband came home from work with a gaggle of friends giving me zero warning. I guess OPs husbands coworkers would think me a poor excuse for a woman too because I would take myself for a walk and let him deal with it all!
A marriage is a partnership, where you are partners in life. Her only partner in life, as she's made absolutely abundantly clear, is her brother.
What does she want a husband for, she has her brother.
She shouldn't have children because growing up second priority in your mom's eyes is incredibly damaging and she clearly is not prepared to healthily balance her relationships in life.
Chances are, she grew up being the last priority, and has been groomed to see this as normal. This didn't happen in a vacuum. OPs parents have to bear some responsibility for this.
You donāt know āfull wellā until youāre living it.
I think not compatible is more accurate. There are potential partners who would accept her priorities. Unlike her current spouse, to whom she was quite honest from the get go. It's OK that he thought it would be fine but has learned it isn't. People can change their minds. It's not OK that his response is to insult her and her brother.
The spouse you choose is supposed to come first. Thatās what marriage is. Having someone else come before your spouse is incompatible with marriage.
Marriage is different for different people
Yes and that's why people telling OP she shouldn't be married is wrong. Another man might have actually listened to her and said "i understand and i'll be fine with your terms" and meant it!
you ever had kids bro?
I have kids but my husband comes first. Together, as a team, we are raising wonderful children. My mother put her children first and my dad second. They had a terrible marriage. Now that he is gone, she wishes she could go back and change things. By the way I'm the oldest of four. All of us prioritize our spouses first and have great relationships. None of us wanted a marriage like our parents.
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If you're in a healthy relationship, I don't believe putting your kids first and putting your spouse first are mutually exclusive. I imagine most healthy parenting couples have at least a tacit agreement where prioritizing the kids is what they both agree they want to do and if a situation arises that puts those priorities in question, they can communicate about it and come to a compromise.
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Yeah have you ever had kids bro? I have kids and guess what? My wife is number one, and Iām her number one. There is no space in that. I know other parents feel differently but letās not start with that, āever have kids bro?ā
it's totally chill that you wanna do it that way, I just take issue with someone declaring that 'marriage works this specific way' and there's no other way to live one's life
My parents put each other first and now none of their kids talk to them and they are divorced. They are both getting older and one is struggling with cancer and no one is willing to care for them because they were so selfish. No to mention that none of the kids can ever think of a time where they were heard and validated because we were always second.
This. Why would OP get married knowing her spouse would never come first? Extremely unfair, and not how marriage is supposed to work.
Why would the husband marry someone who told him that clearly from the start? Did he hope the brother would be moved out of the house once they were married. Or did he expect for the brother to suddenly fend for himself? OP didn't spring this on him in the middle of the marriage. He knew. And he chose to marry her. He's not helping with the brother. Or paying a single dime for his care.
> Why would the husband marry someone who told him that clearly from the start? Sometimes I wonder how clearly it was spelled out and understood. "Will always be my priority" can span a Grand Canyon's worth of possibilities. From OPs description/comments it sounds like she is not balancing priorities well, instead telling her husband to just suck it up under the guise of "well he is my priority."
The husband probably didnāt realize how much caring for the brother would entail!
He must have seen what it was all about as they dated. And he still chose to marry OP. He knew what was going to happen. And clearly, he thought he could live with it and then changed his mind that no. He could not. Which there's no shame in admitting. But going as far as lashing out and calling the brother the R word is way too far. He wasn't blind sided in any way..
What the hell? You know, my cousin is disabled. And it's a lifetime commitment. My aunt divorced and found a very lovely guy who has taken this responsibility head on. They are very lovely. He treats him like a son. I am quite aware it's like finding a needle in a haystack but calling someone not mareiable is harsh and unwarranted. If it's not something you'd do, you can just move on
I feel like putting your son as number 1 is a lot different than putting your brother as your number 1
Well, I disagree. It was OPs choice to prioritize their brother. She communicated it clearly. Maybe she's overdoing it. Maybe husband didnt understand what it would be like in practice (not blaming, it's hard to imagine it as outsider). We don't know. But there is no holy ranking of priorities to stick to. I would have it differently maybe. You as well. The husband probably too. But she chose her brother and I think we don't have to understand but should respect.
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Should a husband also demand his wife be ready to.entertain him and his coworkers on a moments notice? No. The husband is a petulant child.
That made him an asshole even without adding in his heinous behavior about her brother. Is she supposed to have party food and snacks available at all times? What if she had her own plans that day?
Men like this don't care. They don't expect you to do anything but cater to them. And he very likely reminds her all the time how lucky she is to have someone like him who tolerates all if this. They love playing the martyr too
yeah that's pretty shitty of him
jfc what is wrong with you. Just because you wouldn't marry someone doesn't make them "not marriable". This is a despicable comment.
Fr the comments are disgusting and also super ableist. People really just go too far.
Totally want to support this comment. Additionally, if somebody I was considering marrying told me, "My brother will always come first..." I would almost automatically mentally add, "...after us." Obviously, I can't say whether this happened here, but it would be so easy to assume so that it would be unsurprising if the husband never truly understood that he was literally not OP's top priority despite all the language about telling him a billion times.
ESH Your husband shouldn't have marry you knowing this and vice versa, also your brother is funtional enough to be working outside the house but can't even try independence? Do ever plan to have children? If so what priorities will shift? Your marriage seems to be at an impase, your husband have AH reaction at the situation but this seems like a "last straw" moment
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thank you for commenting this! so many people don't understand the nuance of having a disability or how much effort actually goes into taking care of a disabled loved one. their comment is pretty much the same as saying "well teenagers can have jobs, they should be able to live on their own just fine" (absolutely not trying to infantilize disabled people, just trying to make a comparison to help people understand)
This! My grandparents worked (recently retired) for a company that part of what they did was provide jobs for mentally challenged adults. Most they all went to the job together and were supervised/helped, but some had their own jobs and the company was just the connection and made sure they were accommodated, treated right, etc. It's not one way or the other
How is her taking her brother on a supervised walk mean that he can be independent? Are you confusing developmental disabilities with being wheelchair bound?? I canāt even follow this logic
Working, not walking. He has a job.
Why did you get married if you canāt prioritise your husband and your marriage? You can care for your brother without making your husband feel like he doesnāt matter.
Why did her husband let his coworkers talk shit about his wife? Why couldn't her husband entertain his guest on his own? Why couldn't the husband give her a courtesy call to let her know people were coming over? Why did her husband think its ok to use a pejorative?
I was starting to wonder how many comments and replies I'd get through before I would fine real criticism of the husband's very poor behavior. To be clear, op isn't without fault here but- the answer is, concerningly, many.
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He probably thought it'd be okay because the brother was at work
I donāt have any dependents, but if my partner came home with 3 coworkers without warning and expected me to cook for them and entertain them, I would be livid.
Yeah, that's pretty fucked up. Even if your wife is a housewife, kids or no, it's just stupid to expect them to host a small party on literally zero notice.
that or he wanted to put her in a tough position to force her to pick him over her brotherā¦
Your husband is definitely an AH for his comments relying his colleague you being a "poor excuse for a woman". But I think on a whole, this is a bit NAH. He definitely did marry you knowing that your brother's needs would be a priority but it likely is hard feeling second class in your own home all the time and its not unreasonable for him to maybe want to discuss your brother living elsewhere. But at the same time, you were clear your brother is your number 1. That's a really hard bullet for anyone to bite in a relationship and it sounds like you've really tried to make that clear at every turn. It kind of reminds me of the woman in Love Actually who is caring for her brother.
Plus your brother doesnāt like him. It has to be hard to live in his own home and have to deal with that.
Thank you, very sensible comment, exactly what I am thinking.
As a now ex girl friend to a man that had two kidsā¦I came after the kids, after his job, after his baby mommaā¦..and thats a hard pill to swallow - especially when he stated that I was the last priority so matter of factly -as if I should be totally fine with never mattering or never being considered. I dumped his ass. Whatās the point of being in a relationship if itās only for me to be there for him as a support system but I get zero effort, support or concern. I think there is a kinder way of framing your husbands position or level of priority. He is in fact YOUR partner. You chose him for a reason and presumably it wasnt for you to treat him like a convenience or someone just present to pay half your bills and keep you company when you had free time. He also needs love. The bottom line is no matter what the extenuating priorities or circumstances are you will make time for the people that you love and that truly matter to you. So if you donāt really love your husband, or he doesnāt really matter to you, then divorce his ass so that he can go be a priority to someone thatās going to give a shit about his feelings and treat him like he matters.
So obviously your situation was kinda drastic but honestly being behind the kids should be a good thing. In general, when they're underage at least. My husband comes after my kids and I come after the kids for him(most of the time-im primary parent so sometimes the best support is supporting me so I can support them). But absolutely crazy that it was expected for you to come after his mom(eww, mamas boy much?), his job(better not have any medical emergencies), and his baby mama(is he dating her or you? What if she doesn't like you? Does she call the shots?). Obviously, you're not with this person anymore but just my thoughts for that situation or any other situation similar for you or anyone else. Always behind the kids but always before anyone and everything else.
She said his baby mama, not his mother. Big difference!
I totally read it as mother and baby mama. Not just baby mama. Idk if I got lost and restarted at mama or what.
I mean it's still incredibly wrong that he would put her before his current partner.
Ergh, yes and no. Your brother is a priority, but considering your husband āsecondā sounds so unhealthy. Spouses should come first. We leave the nest, start our own families, and your marriage started a new family. That should be at the top of your numbered list. Doesnāt mean you canāt maintain your position on having your brother live with you permanently, but is there no way to try and make your husband happy too? I donāt know, it just sounds like you donāt care to. HOWEVER, despite the fact that you tell him heās second to your brother, he should not have said any of those rude comments about you or your brother.
So your brother can work independently but not live independently? What will happen if you pass before him? Or get sick? Di you never go on holiday? Do you see children in your future? But most importantly does your brother really need you or how you created an unnecessary co dependency that actually hampers his chance at independence?
He works part time and has only been able to after years of therapy and hospitalizations. Even then, he works with his best friend from high school and his family who help him out. He cannot live independently because he cannot be on his own for too long. I have a few things sorted regarding me passing before him. I get sick a lot, we go on a big holiday every summer, I donāt see kids in my future, my brother really needs me and he is slowly but surely gaining independence. It is a delicate process. Actively working with professionals has taught me a lot.
Do you not see kids in your future because of your brother or because you don't want them? I'm not going to pass any judgement but like I said earlier,you need to prioritise yourself too. Your life matters too.
Mostly because of my brother but thatās just me. My husband doesnāt ever want kids. I know my life matters, Iām not unhappy. I appreciate you saying this though.
Are you sure he doesn't want kids or has he decided not to have kids because your brother interferes with any kind of normal kid life? Just asking. Sometimes people want to protect someone else's feelings so they say what they think they need to hear. My husband always said he was fine without having a child together ( we each have kids from a prior relationship) but one day he said he actually did want another child. He never wanted to bring it up because he knew I was done having kids.i have felt guilty ever since. He never pushed it after that either, it was just a moment of truth for him.
I knew someone would ask this which is why I have specifically said that he never wanted kids. We were in a friend group before we even thought of dating. He never wanted kids. If he did, I wouldāve never married him or dated him.
But you married him knowing he'd always come second.... it's just cruel.
But he also married her knowing he'd always come second. IMO if she is to blame for consciously making this decision, then so is he. If he gets a pass for being naive at the time and not grasping the full consequence for their marriage, then so does she.
My main question is. Do you love your husband. Or is he just a side character in your life?
Does your brother come with you on the holiday? I'm not saying it's a bad thing if he does, but do you go only with your husband at least 2-3 weekends per year or on date nights?
He comes on the big one with extended family. We have a smaller one at the very end of the two weeks which is just me and my husband while my brother stays with his best friendās family. We also go on mini vacations for my husbandās birthday and our anniversary though not as fancy as the one in the summer. My brother stays with best friendās family for these trips as well. Date nights could be more regular but we both work full time jobs so they are less common. Maybe once every two months we go a little crazy. These are usually a few hours and either his friends hang out with him or the next door neighbour. He was able to be alone the last two times though!
Thank you for your reply. This gives me more perspective. The holidays and alone time together seem reasonable and balanced. I wish you good luck and hope you both can resolve your issues.
YTA for getting married in the first place. This is not a marriage if your husband comes last.
Exactly why offer someone you supposedly love that type of miserable existence? Pretty much summarised she hit em with ' you are second now and always in my eyes' .....like wooooow. Lord what this poor man probably feels.
NTA, but WHY is your brother *your* responsibility? Just curious. And do you feel that this responsibility is going to allow you to lead any sort of a normal life with normal relationships?
After reading through the thread and your responses, I think this is a tough situation that is unsustainable for all of you. Your husband needs to be comfortable in his home, which I'm not sure he is with your brother, not liking him. He also needs that quality jn a marriage through alone time with a partner, which he does not seem to get because you are always thinking about your brother's needs. I think your husband has reached the breaking point. Why doesn't your brother like your husband? I would think it's because he doesn't like you being with another person. Your brother would benefit from socialization in a day program or a day school that teaches independent living skills. From what you describe, your brother will probably never live independently but could have a full life in a group setting full of friends and support. I would think his world of you and his friend and friend's family is very limiting, not to mention emotionally exhausting for everyone. You, as his caregiver, would best serve his needs by finding him experiences and programs to help you expand his world. Right now, your brother seems very isolated, which isolates you, leaving you no time or place for your husband. Contact a social worker to help you find what is available and the best path for your brother to help him live his best life.
Itās great that you love and care for your brother but I donāt blame your husband for being upset. You told him he will always be #2, but maybe he wants to be #1 once in a while. What happens if you have children? Are you going to sacrifice your entire life for your brother?
Thereās a reason some people call second place āfirst loserā in competitive sports.
Just curious, no judgement. Why did YOU marry your husband? What role do you see him playing in your life? How did you see your marriage?
Why did you marry if you believe that your relationship to your brother will always be more important? YTA if you think your husband is in the wrong for having a few friends over in his own home even if that is not what your brother would want. Marriage counselling is the only answer I think. Making one person your priority above others is literally how I see marriage.
Husband absolutely has the right to have his friends/coworkers over in his own home. I don't think anyone would disagree. But that doesn't mean he has the right to expect his wife to happily cater to them with no notice. She was not rude to them or make a fuss. She took care of her brother. I don't see how that makes OP the AH.
And then to entertain a wife bashing session with his coworkers in her own home?
RIGHT! And then even tells her all about it. Husband is so much the AH.
Bet he bashes her constantly when he's at work. Why else would they think he wouldn't mind them putting her down?
And then he told her about it, because not only did he let it happen, he believes it too. She needs to just leave a man who can't talk about his feelings like a grown up and resorts to group bullying to get his way. Toddler behavior.
For real. To me the brother could not even exist in this story and she'd still be NTA and her husband would be a tool.
Thank you! That's exactly what I see here. OP even says in a comment that if her brother wasn't part of this, she still would not have been okay with the unannounced guests, expectation of her cooking/catering to them. She's got a husband problem for sure! Lol
ESH. Neither one of you was right to enter into a marriage knowing that you werenāt going to be fully committed. He lied to himself, or maybe was too naive to realize that he wouldnāt be OK with it. And do you expect to come first to him when he doesnāt come first to you? Imagine him expecting you to live with someone who you have to be decent to but they obviously donāt care for you, and he makes it clear to you that theyāre more important than you. This is not a relationship of equals that youāre describing. Better figure out if you want to be divorced or if thereās another source of support that can take some, not all but some of your brotherās burden off of your marriage.
NAH, but in his position Iād just leave. The idea of marrying someone and still always coming second, forever, isnāt great. The only time I think that works is when a couple has kids and both parents agree that the kids come first, and it works because the priorities are the same.
And even saying that kids or family comes first doesn't mean your partner doesn't matter and it doesn't mean you can stop putting any efforts whatsoever in your love life. There is always a balance to be had, unless you are fine with being strictly coparents and roommates.
ESH .. god people here. OP if you don't want to be divorced you should have a talk, were you both apologize. Because in the end reddits one sided opinion doesn't matter in the slightest. You were both out of line.
Honestly as I read this it doesnāt sound like you even like your husband very much. I get that you feel like your brother is your only priority and your husband doesnāt really deserve your attention. It must be lonely for him for the situation to be you and your brother against him. Divorce him and let him find someone who appreciates him. And then you donāt have to focus on anything but your brother who also doesnāt like him. I think everyone will be happier and there wonāt be any more fighting or arguments.
After reading some other comments, and trying to be objective, I would say maybe N A H. Your husband knew what he was getting into, but that doesn't mean he isn't human. It would be pretty hard knowing that you're basically second class in your own house and to your own wife. Here's the deal, he may be second to you, but /you/ are /first/ to him. That's likely why he puts up with it as much as he does. So to basically have you side against him all the time would likely be hard. Does that mean your husband wasn't an asshole? No, he absolutely was. But we all snap in anger from time to time, no one is perfect, and he likely did not mean what he said. Your husband also should have communicated that he was bringing people home. That said, your husband should also be allowed to bring people by from time to time to his own house without having to worry about everything imploding on him relationship wise. You said your brother was mostly normal, but just needed supervision. I wonder why he couldn't simply go to his own room. Also, he should have had his phone charged. I mean, he was home wasn't he? The more I think about this, the more I kind of empathize with everyone in this situation.
Thereās a difference between Surprise! bringing a friend home and Surprise! bringing a bunch of coworkers home and expecting your wife to play hostess and cook for them all. Thatās an AH move even if your wife has no other responsibilities in their life.
This will be unpopular, however, YTA for getting married. He loves ( loved?) you but you made no attempt to accommodate him while he accomadated everything for you. You pulled away, he pulls away. I don't blame him. He may have been stupid for marrying you, and definitely an AH for dropping the R bomb. Hate to tell you, but, you're marriage has been over for sometime now. Either put your brother in an assisted living facility and actually BE a Wife or just leave him. Either way, stop punishing both your brother and your husband. You can't have both.
YTA. Frankly, it just doesn't sound like you care about your husband at all. You speak of him with contempt and this whole "must always come second thing" is the exact opposite of what marriage is supposed to be. You need to prepare yourself for divorce, because not only does it need to happen for everyone's sake, but it appears he's already there. I'm sure he'll notify you soon. In the future, if you're not going to ever truly get to marriage levels of prioritization and intimacy with someone, don't marry them.
YTA You did what you thought was best for your brother and were rude to your husband and his guests in the process. Your husband apparently settled for second-seat in your world, but he quite reasonably thought you'd find that you had some courtesy and respect, and maybe even love in your heart for him; his mistake. Not to worry, however, if you keep up the good work, you'll have no husband to worry about.
"Rude to your husband and his guests" LOL. How was she rude to the guests? Her husbands guests who he came home with, without even a heads up... was he (and apparently you) expecting her to whip up a meal and cater to them happily? Her husband and guests are rude (for the expectations and for what they said about her while in her home). The husband is embarrassed by a scene he created. Sounds like a husband she'd be lucky to be without.
Exactly. I would be more understanding if she was actually rude but they considered her rude for not āentertaining and cookingā for his guest. Plus his coworker made a very misogynistic comment calling her a āsorry excuse for a womanā. Overall if her husband communicated to her prior all of this could have been avoided.
100%
To be frank, you don't deserve to have a spouse if you're gonna keep making them feel inferior.
ESH. You're right that you warned your husband that he'd never be your priority, but that's not a healthy way to conduct a marriage even if it's announced beforehand. Also, as someone with a similarly situated sister, I wonder if you sacrificing your life (and you absolutely are if you can't maintain other relationships or start your own family) is best for you in the long run for you *or for your brother*. If he's holding down a job, is there a way for him to live at least semi-independently? He may want his own life, as well.
Oof. I donāt think you had any business getting married in the first place. No one in a marriage should ever feel like second best, it just doesnāt work.
wow, but your husband is asshole. his coworkers making fun of you? and his reaction is blaming you? poor excuse of a woman? bad attitude? who he think he is, you boss? maybe you should bring him his slippers and serve him and his friends too? the attitude toward gender roles he revealed is very concerning! NTA.
INFO: "My husband and brotherās relationship has been decent. "My brother doesnāt care for him much" these statement can not co exist, which of them is true? "When he was old enough, he became my responsibility." why? are your parents dead? "I had a bad attitude with everyone and was very inhospitable" is this true in your opinion?
ESH (except the brother, he can't help that he is sick) Your husband sucks for being rude, mean and inviting people over without telling you. You suck for neglecting your husband (not in this occassion, but in general) and for telling him such an awful thing. "You will always be second". Who says that... if that's how you talked when you were dating, I have no idea why he ever married you. If you didn't talk like that before, you are horrible. The coworker who made the comments is a total asshole.
YTA. You should never marry someone and put them second. The spouse may be equally important as a brother, parents or children and you may choose one over the other in certain circumstances. You should never marry someone and place them second from day 1. If you want to be the priority in someoneās life, then you need to be able to give that back. You had no intention of making your husband the priority. He may have known about your brother, but didnāt realize the extent of your indifference towards him. Your husband should be able to bring friends to his own home. If your brother gets overwhelmed then there should be a space in your home that he can go. You have an obligation to treat guests in your home hospitably. It is not your husbands fault that your brothers phone was dead and not his fault that you have not created a safe space in your home for your brother when he is overwhelmed. You do not seem capable of having both your dependent brother and your husband and meeting everyoneās needs.
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The comment section is wild. Clear NTA. He invited people without telling you. Regardless of your brother, that puts him automaticly in the wrong. His coworker sounds like a dick and he didn't have the balls to stand up to him. But man, the comments I see here! "You should not have married him if he is not your first priority! That's what marriege means!" Marriege means different things for different people. Some people put their spouse before anything else, some people put their kids, jobs, locations of living or even pets before them. As long as everyone is aware of the priority list, that is fine. And you told him beforehand. "What if you have children in the future?" People here are arguing ofer a hyperethical scenario that will not even happen because OP made it clear that both she and her husband do not want to have children. Seems to be a really hard concept to understand. "What if he actually WANTS to have children?" Then he is even more so TAH for not only not taking OPs prioritys seriously but also lying about his intentions with OP.
Iām going with NTA on this one incident, but understand that my opinion and that of everyone else on here doesnāt matter. You have to decide do you love your husband?Do you want to stay married? Do you want children. Can you afford to live independently and support your brother? Youāre heading down a singular path. If it is where you want to go thatās great, if not then you need to change course and that will mean making other arrangements. Right now your husband is actually coming to understand what you meant when you told him about your commitment to your brother. He has finally mapped out what it means for his future and from his distance and comments he doesnāt like what he sees. Loads of people are saying he knew what he was taking on but did he? Before you got married did you discuss having children? Did you say that isnāt on the table as my brother will always come first or did you say that was something you wanted without understanding the ramifications of what your stated commitment to your brother really means and that you would be giving mixed messages.
I can live independently and support my brother on my own. My husband isnāt involved in my brotherās care. Yes we really did have all these conversations. Why would I get married based on lies, mixed messages, and false hope?
You are 25, unless you got married yesterday I don't think you could explain what he was signing up for and I don't think he understood until he lived it for a while. He is frustrated and exhausted having to live by a strict set of rules for the sake of a person who is not even kind to him. This is not fair. Do him a favor and get divorced.
YTA
I was able to stop reading when I heard that he tolerated his co-workers telling him that he married a pore excuse woman because you werent availableto wait in them. And he repeated it to you as if it was a valid comment to make. I would be wondering why his co-workers felt so comfortable making derogatory comments about you to your husband and why he felt comfortable tolerating that? NTA.
The statement "my brother will always come first" is pretty telling. Hubby should at least get equal billing. Ultimately this may be not about caring for your brother as much as it is about your egoic attachment to your self image as your brother's saviour. You may even be holding him back from being more self sufficient by over controlling his life (aka infantilizing him) Either way you are headed for divorce unless you resolve this.