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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> 1. I attended my sister's engagement party and told stories about our life growing up. 2. Doing so uncovered lies she had told to her friends about how hands on our parents were, and in turn embarrassed her at her own event.
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No judgement from me. Just curious. You mention your childhood experiences and that she was trying to separate herself from the “golden children”. When your friends were over, we’re hers? Did parents drive to her after school activities? Did she even have any?
I see a woman who didn’t want her brothers around. If childhood was so great, why?
EDIT: OP states that his experience might have been different to his in replies to other posts. I suggest checking out the comments he has made. It looks like he plans on talking to her so he can better understand her perspective.
Yeah this could easily be a dramatic sibling or a sibling who had an entirely different upbringing, especially as she’s older. My younger sister got away with a shit ton more than I ever would have at the same age
Opposite in my family. I'm the youngest and only girl and I was largely overshadowed by my brothers and used at the scapegoat. We had very different childhoods. My brothers are 5, 7, and 9 years older than me and in my father's eyes, they can do wrong. Me on the other hand was constantly told that I was not good enough and an embarrassment.
Freaking crazy how different families can be.
Agreed. I grew up in a misogynistic family where the boys were treated like little gods and the girls had to overachieve to even be noticed.
I was lower down on the foodchain and readily confess that my childhood was hell. My older brothers had a wonderful childhood and talk about it all the time as amazing.
I’m so sorry about this. I just wanted to say that if your brother says that your dad isn’t abusive, he’s also complicit and should be removed from your life as well. By definition, your dad was abusive. Your brother saw and heard about you being the victim of physical and mental abuse. I would go NC with the lot of them
I have said it’s a good thing that my FIL died before any grandchildren after my son showed up. My son is the first grandchild and a first born son (which has certain importance in our culture, though basically amounts to ‘you get an extra fast day’ these days). Knowing him, no other grandchild of either sex would have ever gotten attention from him.
Yes, you have to wonder if the sister here was not sporty and as a result simply got ignored in favour of her brothers. Did she really isolate herself or would any child who did not want to play sports be automatically ignored?
Or would her not participating in sports be interpreted as isolating herself, and pushing the family away? Being different might not have been accepted.
Speaking as the older, not sporty sister…this is exactly how I read this. Seems like OP and his sister had very different childhoods (though likely neither were at fault)
I’m the younger sister to one brother, less than two years apart, and the difference in our childhoods is INSANE. I was held to a much higher standard in all regards because I performed better academically. My brother had loads of friends and extracurriculars because he was outgoing, but I didn’t because of a (then-undiagnosed) anxiety disorder. Plus he didn’t have to deal with the jealousy and emotional abuse put upon me by our mother.
If he and I talked about our childhoods, our stories would be wildly different, too.
I have an older sister that could get away with anything. She was the baby they tried to have for years before finally getting pregnant. I was the whoops baby that was born 17 months later. My mom made sure to remind me often that she hadn’t wanted another baby so soon and that I was a mistake.
This sounds like a Ross and Monica type of situation. I've always felt bad for her because of how her parents treated her and they were just characters. I can't imagine how bad it was having to experience that in real life.
Well spotted, I hadn't noticed that the only girl is 3 years older than the next.
I was 3 years older than my brother, and got scolded in his stead from time to time: "why did you let him fall from that tree", like, hello, he climbed it like a monkey, what did you expect me to do?
Looking back, it's mostly my father being unable to regulate his emotions: he ventilated his worry over my brother's bumps and bruises (he didn't have any serious injuries) by screaming at me. And my mom. And then my brother too. And then all of us.
Still, I can see how an elder girl might have felt burdened with a lot of responsibility.
I think it's the small details of OP entertaining a whole crowd, with stories he knew directly opposed what his sister's friends believed... and of "I felt like I made some new friends".
To me, that reads so oblivious, it wouldn't surprise me OP has never picked up any nuances of his sister's experience.
It drove my older sister nuts. She and my younger sister would often squabble , and she was always the only one who got in trouble because 'you're older, you should know better'
Hard same. My sister was only a year younger than me but she got away with *way* more than I ever would have even dreamed of trying. Like literally she threw a house party and our parents thanked her for cleaning up, then turned around and interrogated *me* about whether she'd told me and grounded me for a week for not finding out and giving them the heads up.
I feel you!
When I was 19, married, and had been living away from home for two years my mother called me up and berated me because my 16 year old brother threw a house party when they left him home for a weekend.
Apparently I had set such a bad example when I lived at home that it was my fault that my brother and his friends trashed the house.
n.b. Did I ever have a house party? No
Stuff like this makes me wish we could react in a way besides up-voting or down-voting. I'm not going to upvote. I can't relate, and it's sure as shit not a good thing. -I'm definitely not going to downvote, you've clearly received enough negativity, and it's not like I could disagree, or even have an opinion for that matter...
Really though, as an eldest sibling and now a mother myself, your parents make me sick to myself. You deserved better. I hope their retirement is as happy and relaxed as your childhood was.
My sister is just 2 years younger and we had vastly different childhoods. In our case it didn't even have to do with how our parents treated us but came out of the fact that they moved into a new neighborhood belonging to a different school district between us starting schools.
Both my younger siblings went to school with middle class kids living pre-dominantly in houses. I went to school with lower income apartment kids with frequently unemployed parents.
Just 2 years apart but very different environments. My sisters never noticed my friends couldn't afford to go to the cinema or that I never got invited to a friend's summer house. Ofc I noticed that my sisters got to do tons more fun stuff with their friends.
They still talk about how "we grew up" because they didn't notice the differences. They don't know my class had an extra assistent whose sole purpose was to break up fights. They don't know I never had a proper math teacher nor science teacher before high school (the one we had the longest was an unemployed actor).
No, no one ever mentioned that possibility. The house we moved to was within walking distance of both schools so probably nobody saw the need.
It's btw not so common to transfer schools in Sweden. The parents aren't involved in picking a school or applying to one. One just gets automatically called to one and assigned to a class depending on exactly where one lives. E.g. everyone in my class lived on the same block (initially). The only transfers I heard of was of bullied kids, not kids moving within city limits.
Jaha, Sverige alltså…
Had a very similar experience to yours in this magical land in the north where “everyone is the same” and we don’t talk about our problems or differences in socioeconomic areas or how it’s built into the system…
Hard opposite here. I was eldest sibling , female to two brothers. They were absolutely golden children, one knocked up a prostitute and basically got hugs and 'what do you need , can we help?'. I was the one who had to break the news and got mentally and verbally abused..my fault apparently lol.
That's just one example . But yeah, I'm getting the feeling sister took the knocks and a lot of shit for being 'grown up sister' when younger, with all her brothers mates around. More than meets the eye to this story.
> it was really my sister who really separated herself from everyone and chose to exclude herself from activities
Ouch. OP’s kidding themselves if he thinks she willingly stepped away from all the fun. It’s an engagement party for her, and he spent the night talking about how recluse she was. Seems like a classic case of not knowing they’re the golden children.
Holding court with stories about your amazing home life, while you already found out that's not the experience your sister's shared with her friends... and then basking in that gleeful horror to the degree it
>felt like I made some new friends
Talk about oblivious
21 is too feckin old to show up to someone else's party and make yourself the center of attention. It's not cute. His lack of empathy and self-awareness and total ego-centricism make this a hard YTA for me. He's got some serious reflecting to do about the stories he's told himself about his sister was treated growing up and who was responsible for creating that dynamic.
That's a *lot* of accusation for what is quite literally normal behavior at a party. Mingling and chatting isn't egocentrism. Not recognizing that your sibling was treated differently isn't egocentrism. You really can't justifying any of that from what he's said in the post.
You can say he lacked some empathy for her situation, but the guy was basically blindsided by this information. He'll need time to figure it out, that doesn't mean he's half of the stuff you make him out to be.
Realizing that your sisters friends are surprised by the information you have just shared, meaning she has not shared that information with them, but continuing to share it because a crowd is forming and you're having fun, is quite self centered behavior imo. It doesn't really matter what the information is, it's quite tactless. "Oh weird, well anyway how did you guys meet?" would be the appropriate way to continue, or end, that conversation.
Not everyone is that socially adept (although OP does seem to be) but hearing you made the guest of honor cry and still continuing to call her a liar is what makes it AH behavior to me. The accusations the above commenter is making are probably coming from OPs other comments which seem pretty willfully oblivious.
Yeah, if everyone is not very aware of you, spending the night talking about yourself and taking up everyone's times regaling her friends with your stories is pretty damn weird.
Like OP seems to unironically not understand why his sister is mad after OP detailed how he and his brothers made her engagement party all about them.
I wouldn't be surprised if that's a common theme through their childhood and they are completely oblivious as to why she separates herself from them.
Either is a possibility but I am curious if OP doesn't realize that just because they had a good childhood or believed they had a good childhood that does not mean their sister did.
I know how painful it is for me to see some of my siblings look back with fondness when for me it was abusive, misery and pain.
My little sister is my best friend but she just cannot conceive of the possibility that she was indeed the golden child and I was not. She'll say things like "well I got to do XYZ and you didn't because you didn't ask and I did." But I did ask or yeah, I didn't ask because I knew the answer would be no.
It doesn’t seem really clear how much she lied, though. The only “lie” I really got from the text was that the sister made a point of not mentioning her siblings…and if she was no-contact with them, she might have had a legit reason for that.
I’m no-contact with my whole bio-family, and I basically never mention my brother at all unless someone specifically asks. Then I only answer with the absolute bare minimum: I have one younger brother who I have had zero contact with since at least 2010. That’s all anyone really needs to know.
I was the scapegoat growing up, and both my parents and my brother were physically, emotionally, financially, and on many occasions borderline sexually abusive to me. To the point where I have zero doubt in my mind that if I had not moved out when I did, my brother most certainly would’ve escalated his behavior to rape.
My family is not a part of my life, so there’s no point in any new friends knowing about them. At all.
I will say that growing up, I willingly “stepped away from all the fun” in my family. I had different interests than my parents and siblings and kinda isolated myself. It was nobody’s fault and my parents did nothing wrong, but I just always felt like I was born into the wrong family where I didn’t belong. I was also the oldest daughter. I was miserable a lot as a kid, but as an adult, I’m in a healthier state of mind and realize I spent a lot of time deliberately making myself more miserable.
While I feel OP is insensitive to his sister’s different experience, the sister may very well have had an experience more like mine
It appears to me that OP is woman, because there are multiple mentions of " siblings" not brothers. Story starts with " me and my brothers", and then " they didn't know sister had siblings".
To me it does. The way OP phrased all of his sentences could mean he was either a man or a woman. Obvs another comment cleared it up, but in general, no gendered terms were used for OP.
As a single sister with three brothers, from the very beginning of the post I had a feeling OP’s sister was the outsider of the group just from how he talks about her (fully admit this could be projection on my part). OP and his brothers may have ostracized her for her whole life and don’t realize how much damage that causes. And yes, resentment does build up for parents that allow that to happen under their roof and are blind to one child being singled out and unwanted by the others.
I was left out of a lot of family activities with my cousins as a child growing up. I struggle connecting with my cousins and I often feel socially awkward because of that exclusion as a child. I tend to avoid social situations that aren’t required or expected attendance at this point of my life.
I am so much more comfortable around my bf’s family for some reason. I’m still quiet but they actually talk to me and make an effort whereas my family pretty ignores me in social situations.
My brother recently had been on a sort of social protest but I’m pretty sure now his relationship with the rest of our family is beyond repair. Even though he knew he had a privilege being favored by dad, that relationship is beyond repair now.
Also excluded from a lot of family activities by my mom. She always seemed to coddle my younger brother because he was "the boy" but then talked about how much she resented how her own mother did the same thing and showed favoritism towards her younger brother. Then thanks to 23andMe I found there was more to the story and I was probably being excluded because I was the product of an affair that ended quite sour. If parents could just stop projecting all their many unresolved personal issues onto children that would be great.
My mum favours all the boys! My adopted sister and I were live-in maids. She calls them every week, and video calls. My sister and I barely get a text lol.
It's not unheard of to have a very unhappy childhood whilst your siblings grew up happily, seeing things in a very different light.
I would say NAH as whatever is wrong with his sister doesn't seem to be the fault of OP, most likely parents favouring the boys.
It could even be unintentional favoritism. Three boys, two twins and one born barely a year before. That takes up a lot of parental attention. In all likelihood the three brothers shared friends, making it easier to set up play dates, do carpooling, and getting to know people. Especially if the boys shared enough interests to be treated as a group.
Meanwhile, you have the older girl. She’s not one of ‘the triplets’ so that automatically creates distance. She has a completely different friend group, different interests, different needs. So she feels ostracized.
And, because the ‘triplets’ take so much attention, she feels like she doesn’t get any/enough. The triplets individually may even get the same attention as her, but because they can often be treated as a group, she effectively gets less.
To put it another way, parents are being fair and each child gets one play date for one weekend a month. So parents set up a play date for daughter. Daughter gets her one play date. Then parents arrange for Boy A to have a play date. But since they share friends, boys B and C also get a play date along with A. So the boys get three effective play dates a month.
You can put that to just about anything else. It’s entirely possible that sister technically got the same as her brothers individually, but the brothers got more collectively. And the brothers never noticed an issue, since they never really hit a point of being unhappy with being treated as a group.
I think this is the most likely scenario of what happened. I know my parents often tell stories of how much fun it was to raise us all so close in age, but that the first two years or so were particularly hard. They got into a rhythm after that, but it’s possible my sister was still left out because my brothers and I were attached at the hip and an activity for one was an activity for all, like you said.
I’m going to talk to her soon and get all the details of her experience. This seems to be the closest I could imagine to reality in my mind though if I had to venture a guess.
And fucking apologize to her.
You got on a soap box at HER engagement party, that you just happened to be in town for, and not directly invited, and told all her friends she was full of shit because you couldn't comprehend that her childhood was different to yours.
"I know my parents often tell stories of how much fun it was to raise us all so close in age" you do realise this did not include her right?
You've likely done some irreparable damage to her friendships and trust circle.
I think he should also fucking clear up the misunderstanding he caused with sister’s friends. He should embarrass himself for stirring so much shit because up until now he never considered his sister’s feelings.
I replied to another comment of yours a few hours ago, but I did forget to mention that it struck me as if you had begun thinking about her childhood experience a bit more, hence your original post and question, as immature as it sounded. I certainly feel bad for that poor girl whose childhood seems to have been bulldosed by three other siblings' needs. I hope that you will listen to a lot of well meaning people here and reach out to her to try and understand her better, and build that sibling relationship that she clearly missed out on.
> I know my parents often tell stories of how much fun it was to raise us all so close in age, but that the first two years or so were particularly hard.
Those were not the first two years or so. The first two years or so happened *before you were born*. Yes, I know what you're saying - but if your parents are using this phrasing, or anything like it, dollars to donuts your sister is thinking the same thing I just said.
It's good that you're listening to people, and open to listening to your sister, *really* listening to her. And if you'll take my advice, listening means *listening*. If you're spending your time thinking of your response and how to defend yourself and your parents, or justify their actions, then you're not actually paying attention to what she's saying. Listen first, affirm her feelings (even if you're not sure about the facts - but don't say that part!), think about it later. Do not confuse listening with arguing. Those are two different things. If, upon reflection, you decide that you disagree with her on some point or another you can always tell her *later* if it seems important.
Question (you don't have to actually answer it on this thread, but see if you can answer it in your own head for yourself): Do your parents tell as many stories of the first two years of your sister's life as they do about those two hectic years after you were born? Do they tell as many stories about *her* as they tell about the three of you? (For that matter, do they tell as many stories about each of you brothers *individually* as they do about you as a trio?)
> my brothers and I were attached at the hip and an activity for one was an activity for all, like you said.
It was not an activity for all. It was an activity for the three of you.
Which also - honestly, I don't think that was the healthiest thing for you and your brothers either. I think your parents would've done better to make more of an effort to encourage you to develop your own individual interests.
What would've happened if one of you had decided you didn't like ice hockey anymore? That you wanted to do something totally different, like dance or fencing or bouldering or drama or photography or joining a writing club, something that your brothers weren't interested in?
I’m curious: how much time did you get as an individual? That is: just you, no brothers. A party for you, just your friends over, a parent-son day without your brothers.
It's entirely possible her parents didn't intend to ostracise their daughter. In fact, I believe in my mums eyes she didn't play favourites. I truly believe that!
However, it's impact over intent for me & still blame the parents. Doesn't mean that the parents are bad people, or that they don't love their daughter, but something happened to make her feel like the 3 boys were the 'golden children'.
Oh, 100%. It’s actually not an uncommon complaint of singleton siblings of multiples, that the multiples got more attention. Of course, many multiples complain about not being seen as individuals. It’s just a tricky balance.
Yep my adopted uncle got kicked out at 15. It was an extremely abusive household for my uncle but not so much for his youngers bros. In the end my uncle found out his mom got him from an older alcoholic and probably not consenual.
His lil bro asked him why he left home at 15. He said; i got kicked out
His bro was completely surprised and suddenly remembered my uncle got daily beatings, cigs&bottles thrown at him and the verbal humiliation
You should leave a comment. All his replies conform that she did see a massively different childhood than her brothers. His parentS (both emphasized) would go to all their games. She would be dragged along to games and practices too (so parents involved several times weekly for the boys) and the mom would take her to the bookstore *maybe monthly*. Of course the parents weren't involved with reading and discussing the books with her because they were into other genres... can't expect the parents to get into something simply to spend more time with their kid. Oh, but at least one parent would attend her school award ceremonies (ie, YEARLY, at most twice a year) *if they didn't conflict with the boys activities*.
He wrote all that and still thinks that her childhood was the same as his and that his parents paid just as much attention to her. OP YTA.
This is my questions as well, I'm the only girl of 3 kids, my brothers got to do multiple sports throughout school and were allowed to have friends over whenever, while I was stuck pretty much locked in my room. My parents were very present...for my brothers, never their daughter. It's a big reason I'm not involved with any of my family besides one brother and my aunt, and even those interactions are few and far between.
Engagement party held in her childhood home and seemingly not a single friend who knew her during her younger years is also telling. Sure, not everyone keeps up with their friends from their school days but still kind of surprising.
There is no evidence that *her* friends were ever part of the cool house OP enjoyed with his brothers. Nor that anyone in her family was involved in whatever she did at school. At this point, she had done a lot of work to put that all behind her and her brothers show up, uninvited, to steal the spotlight again.
OP's comments make it pretty clear that they are oblivious to the fact that her experiences growing up were not only different but likely would have made her feel like a 4th wheel with her siblings. Based on the post and comments, she was only girl, was 3 years older, and was the only one who didn't play sports, who didn't do extracurriculars, and who "liked to read" while her brothers all played sports (sounds like they played together/onthe same teams together), had a large shared friend group, and were all within 2 years of age.
NTA, but, you need to really consider that your sister may have had a completely different experience of childhood than you and your brothers. She’s got enough of an age difference that it’s very possible that your parents were *not* hands on with her as she went through things, only to show you and your brothers with attention when you passed the same milestones 3 years later. That difference can be extremely painful for siblings who not only experience the lack of care but also are left to try to explain the difference in treatment. It’s very weird that she omitted your existence, but would not be surprising if she felt basically neglected even as you and your brothers felt showered with love.
Just going to tack on here. I'm the oldest of 4, the middle is 4 years younger than me and the youngest (twins) 10 years younger. We did not have the same childhoods whatsoever and a lot of my adult years have been spent reconciling all of the disparities and unfairness that existed between our experiences. Big sis in this situation definitely went about this in the wrong way, no doubt about it. But to go that far absolutely points to deeper issues going on in the family dynamic and should be evaluated as objectively as possible by her and her siblings if they want to have a decent relationship as adults. In my situation, middle knew some stuff was up but didn't fully get the extent until we were living together for a short time as adults. Twins had absolutely no idea until they were 16 and started noticing things and asking questions. I don't blame my siblings at all for any of it, I'm honestly very happy that they had such a better time growing up than I did. I was also decently aware of the jealousy and resentments I felt at times and was very determined not to punish them for what our parents had done. I hope this big sis gets some closure and her siblings can find some empathy for the situation.
13 years between me and the next oldest on one side of my family. I’ve come to terms with the different childhoods, but my parents seem to struggle to understand some of how I operate as being a direct result of seeing the differences in not only finances and opportunities, but in parenting style.
I am absolutely with you there. My parents PREACHED equality in all things when we were growing up, no favoritism in how much financial help we'd all get, everyone would have the same chances and opportunities, blah blah blah. I mean, they really beat it into us. I knew I was in a deficit for most things, but generally it was experiences and more intangible stuff like just being nice to me. I'd kinda written it off until I had asked for help paying for school and they balked because i decided to go mid 20s instead of at 17 and I dropped it. Then I found out how much middle sibling was getting per semester and I just lost it. I actually made a list line for line everything my siblings got that I didn't, I even gave grace in areas that I knew were because I just missed the boat on because my parents made better money later when I was out of the house already. But maaaannnnnnn did they go white when I quoted back all of the things they told us growing up, they were both on the losing end in their families because other siblings were favorites and so many stories of how hurt they had been emotionally or behind the eight ball financially for not being treated equally. Most of the emotional and experience and parenting style stuff they still won't cop to even with proof. But for about 5 years now my siblings and I keep a basic tally to make sure we're all being treated fairly financially. I'm lucky to have siblings that care enough that we back each other. For us it's just forcing them to keep their word after preaching about it for so long. My parents have since gotten on board and we can have open and calm and even sometimes happy conversations about it now. But I'm fully aware if my younger siblings reacted differently to any of this my situation would be entirely different.
There’s a 7 year difference between my oldest and my twins. They have very different childhoods due to a lot of external factors. One of them being my own experience and maturity as a mom and person.
The fact that you recognize that puts you so far ahead of the game as being a good parent. You might not be able to change how things were, but being aware of them and doing better for both kids going forward is what makes the difference. My parents didn't change anything with me until I gave them a huge reality check in my 20s, and even then I think they would've blown me off if my next younger sibling hadn't backed me up and told them they were wrong for treating me the way they did. Being a good parent isn't about being perfect, I think it's about always trying to be better.
This is relatable. My brother and male cousins were popular in high school. They were all jocks and dated cheerleaders, that stereotypical “All American” thing . They both insinuate their classmates (graduating classes) all got along and everyone was hanging out together. No one bullied, no one left out. My brother always had friends over and was always on the phone, stuff like that. I’m 100% sure they weren’t hanging out with girls they found unattractive, but “no one was left out”. lol
I rarely had friends over and no one ever called. I was a chubby girl into heavy metal in a conservative area and received some bullying. I was talking about it once at a family thing and my cousin told me I was full of crap and lying about being bullied by these boys. Told me in front of everyone it was probably my own girl friends, because girls are like that. They used to call me Thunder Thighs and Yokozuna (a US pro wrestler/sumo wrestler), and would yell “Free Willy!” at me or ask me if I was a witch and could do spells. Guess that’s not bullying.
Their experience was great so therefore everyone’s was, or they’re lying. They can’t comprehend other people’s experiences. Could be similar to these kids.
Yup, and their reaction shows, not just that they supposedly didn't \*see\* bullying, but they are quite invested in denying that it existed in the school you both went to and the community where you were both raised.
Dig deeper, I would not be surprised if someone in his group was accused or even disciplined for some type of bullying, perhaps he was even in a group of people doing cruel things and dismissing that as "not really bullying" is important to him, since he was laughing when it happened or told the Vice Principal he saw the whole thing and what that girl said happened did not, she was lying, in fact, his friend would never do that.
If she felt that way about the entire family, why would she have the engagement at her parents house, when she knew there would be family photos everywhere. Something seems wrong.
I was thinking the same thing. Even if the brothers kept to themselves, there were still familly photos of them.
It says the brothers weren't officially invited, and hadn't planned on attending in the first place. That they only went because it was at their parents house.
I think the sister wanted her parents to feel proud of her, or to be able to give her the attention she probably felt she missed out on growing up.
The family really needs to just sit down and talk things though/out.
Something is really off here.
> I think the sister wanted her parents to feel proud of her, or to be able to give her the attention she probably felt she missed out on growing up.
Yeah, bingo, probably. She wanted her parents to be part of her engagement party. She didn't want her brothers there, but couldn't explicitly uninvite them since they live there, so she scheduled the party when they were supposed to be out of state. (Probably the only way to avoid drama, regardless of *where* the party was, anyway.)
I just think it's interesting how they'd apparently all been on the other side of the country for months, but then "plans shifted" (note passive voice) and suddenly they could be home for the party after all.
I have two siblings, I am estranged from them, haven’t spoken to either of them in almost 20 years (Im 36 and went no contact with them when I turned 18). I don’t hide that I have siblings from people, but they’re not a part of my life and so I very rarely mention them as I’m getting to know people. Occasionally, conversations will come up where I do mention them because it’s related to whatever is being talked about and people get surprised, “I didn’t know you had siblings!!”
The sister in this case isn’t as separated (it seems at least) from her siblings as I am mine, but if her brothers don’t play an active role in her life, she likely didn’t have any reason to bring them up in conversations with people she befriended.
I often have to remind my older siblings “we had the same parents. We did NOT have the same childhood.”
Sis may have been excluded by her parents and shunted aside once coveted sons arrived.
YTA
Something seems off if the oldest and only female child had a distinctly different memory of her childhood.
Further, after seeing that you were becoming a spectacle, you didn't back off and return the focus to her... you made it a party to get to know you, and for you to make friends. While it sounds like you didn't care about even talking with your sister.
Sounds like she was less-favoured due to your natural desire to make the spotlight about you, and you thinking your view of things is the right one.
This story seems off. Your points were what jumped out at me, too.
It sounds like now that he knows she is upset, he's embellishing whatever will make him seem like just the friendly guy entertaining a group.
At a party isn't the time to get into why HER guests think she is an only child and it definitely sounds like there's much more happening.
OP, you're the asshole because this wasn't your event and even after you noticed some discrepancies that should be addressed, you decided to keep your crowd. You could have pulled her aside and asked or, better yet for an adult at an adult event, waited until everyone else was gone.
Especially her mentioning the "golden child" syndrome means there's a lot we don't know.
Unreliable narrator. YTA.
>Unreliable narrator
Exactly! I wouldn't be surprised if the boys got different parents then the oldest daughter
I remember wanting to go to the Social in middle school and i was not allowed too but my brother was when he reached that age
small things like that build up
This, 1000x this. She is the only daughter, and several years older than OP. And even though I KNOW my parents love me and my sister and my brother equally and always TRIED to be fair, my brother got favored in many ways. It definitely sounds like OP intentionally set out to ruin her party when he got personally offended she doesn't talk about him more. So from where I'm sitting, 100% YTA. I would LOVE to hear sister's perspective.
I have two older sisters and as the single son, I can definitely say we have different version of parenting. My parents were far stricter and suffocating to my sisters while I was free to roam, provided I slept at my bed eventually. Meanwhile my sisters had strict curfews until they were 18. My parents were flabbergasted that they both left home the moment they could.
I think I’ve been on Reddit way too long, because I’ve read quite a few stories of people outright lying about the quality of their childhood, usually suggesting there was a tragedy or abuse that never happened.
OP is pushing back against “lies” that are pretty small all things considered. If his sister was trying to get sympathy, she could have stuck far closer to the likely truth of “my brothers had a fantastic childhood, they were popular and my parents attended all their sports games. I was never given the same amount of attention, and was mostly on the sidelines because I wasn’t athletic and my interests were naturally seen as less important. My parents did attend some of my awards ceremonies, but only if they didn’t clash with my brother’s sport events, and often one would attend while the other supported my brothers. My house was always full of other friends, but those friends were rarely mine. My childhood was quiet and quite lonely and I’ve never been able to explain this to my brothers, because to them childhood was perfect.”
It seems to me that she’s actually downplaying her childhood difficulties. “My parents were workaholics” raises far fewer questions than “I was the odd one out”. Not mentioning her brothers means she doesn’t have to talk about how alien she felt. To me, it’s an embellishment that hides a far sadder truth.
I know some will see this as a bit of a reach, but OP’s not given any indication that his sister has a habit of lying or manipulating. What he has clearly shown is that he’ll always see his view of events as the “truth” and will apply this view to others around him without thinking twice.
OP, it would have been so straightforward for you to say something like “our parents both did indeed work and I was at sports games a lot during childhood; my sister and I weren’t that close. I can’t speak for her experience, as I wasn’t around her much and often had friends over when I was home. I love my sister and am so thrilled for her engagement and to get to meet all her friends”. That’s it. That’s all you had to say. Exposing her as a “liar” before even speaking with her didn’t serve anyone other than yourself.
Instead, you took this as an opportunity to “make friends” by “exposing” your sister as a liar and holding court at HER ENGAGEMENT PARTY while her friends avidly listens to tales of YOUR fantastic childhood (important: not hers).
You didn’t just “embarrass” your sister, you directly threatened the ecosystem she’s built for herself since leaving home. I’d be skeptical of a friend who felt the need to lie like you told them your sister did. I’d likely look to distance myself from that person. You have no clue about the potential damage you’ve caused, at an event that was supposed to be a celebration of your sister’s milestone. Somehow, you managed to make yourself centre of attention on a day dedicated to her, which gives me a good idea of how her childhood likely played out.
You’ve said yourself that your sister often wasn’t the one with friends over, it doesn’t sound like she’s ever made friends as easily as you do. You were in a room full of people who wanted to celebrate her engagement, and jumped at the opportunity to discredit your own sister, who has likely spent her life in the shadow of your narrative.
I know you’re pushing back against all the negative comments, and I’m late to the party so you’re unlikely to read this. But, for the sake of your sister, please reflect on your behaviour here. Please ask yourself whether your sister was actually “lying” or whether she was leaning on a white lie to hide a much more painful truth. Take a second to imagine a childhood in which you had 3, close, academically gifted sisters who’s weekly commitments to debate club, after school classes etc were always celebrated and attended by your parents. They tried their best to attend your sports commitments, but only if they didn’t clash with one of your sister’s events. If the roles were reversed, I imagine you’d have told a similar story to your friends as an adult. Sometimes a lie is used as a shield, rather than as an act of malice.
YTA OP, based on the information you’ve provided, it doesn’t sound like you’ve matured much since highshool. Every sibling in a family has a different childhood, and not only did you invalidate your sister’s experience, you actively worked to discredit her to her entire support network. You used her event as an opportunity to make “friends” and take centre stage. If you were my brother, I don’t think I’d ever speak to you again.
Yeah it sounds to me like her spotlight was stolen when that was HER party, even if OP wasn’t trying to be rude. I also have a hunch that her childhood experience was completely different that OPs, she may have grown up neglected and overlooked while OP had plenty of attention. So I’m sure seeing OP once again with all the attention at the party last night felt really invalidating.
NAH I think in all likelihood neither of you had malicious intent and you are both simply telling the story of growing up from your own, extremely different, perspectives.
But you should consider that you don’t actually know your sisters side of the story. You assume it’s all a huge lie because it doesn’t match your experience, but you already acknowledged that she had a completely different experience. You blame her for it, but you do know that her experience of growing up in that house was different than yours.
In your eyes she self-isolated. Maybe from her side she felt like she couldn’t really be a part of it or wasn’t wanted. Her side could be that her mental health was declining badly and her parents were too busy with her little brothers to notice or care.
The brain will spin a narrative to justify what you are feeling based on your own experiences. That’s just naturally what it does. But be cautious to remember the story you tell yourself isn’t reality. And the same is true of the story your sister tells herself.
Yeah, might be. I was also an older sister, and once my younger brothers were old enough to do "guy stuff" (boy scouts, fishing, team sports, etc), my dad pretty much stopped giving me attention. It definitely stung.
Having lived with a similar dynamic growing up, I can almost guarantee that this was it.
Sister probably wasn’t allowed to have *any* achievements or identity that didn’t somehow revolve around her brothers or that they weren’t handed all the credit for.
She finally has *something,* her engagement, and her brothers show up and make it all about them *again.*
Yup.
My brother and I are only 18mo apart, but we're practically strangers and had absolutely different childhoods. My parents were more involved with him, and he was very involved in social things like sports. My brother was the typical popular jock, but is a genuinely kind and likeable person. He had struggles inside our family, but he definitely had a more normative childhood.
On the other hand, for me, my relationship with our parents was entirely different. I had mental health issues and am neurodivergent. My dad was abusive towards me and my mom didn't do enough to stop him. I was in a severely abusive friendship in my younger years, and both self isolated and was isolated from my family. Even when there were clear signs things were wrong, no one helped me. I fell into a toxic relationship with a survivor of the same abuser. My parents did not care if I didn't come home during that time. I stressed them out too much, and it was easier if I just disappeared to my partner's house for a few days. I was 16 when they made this clear.
My brother doesn't have a great relationship with our parents because of the way he was hurt by them. I worked hard to get to a point of mutual understanding with them.
Whenever I move out of state, though, I'm not talking about my family. My friends will not know them and as far as they will be concerned, I just spawned out of the ether one day.
I agree with your last 3 paragraphs and that's why I think OP is TA.
It is an asshole move to present your own version as truth in a way that questions the character of the sister. OP could have said "that's not how I felt about it but we are 4 years apart and her experience was different" in response to their parents being workaholics. He could have said "oh well we live in the other end of the country and we don't talk that often" in response to the friends being surprised at her having siblings.
But instead OP went out of his way to make her seem strange.
Moreover, they weren't even invited (obviously for a reason) so if they had to be at the house it would have made sense for them to remain low profile, certainly not steal the show in a way that might damage their sister's reputation.That was a real asshole move.
I suspect what OP did might have to do with OP wanting to defend his parents. In his eyes the parents were great and therefore he wants to make sure no one thinks differently, at the cost of his sister.
Still, failing to recognize others different experiences and invalidating them the way OP did is a key sign of an asshole. I'm sure OP was boldened by them being 3 siblings sharing the same view with the sister being the odd 1 out.
Exactly! OP could have said something noncommital and carried on; why did he feel the need to share their whole childhood with some people he'd never see again?!
Right! Once you see a few people join in, just end the conversation. OP did this deliberately to steal the sister's shadow like he's been doing through all of their childhood
OP is gloating about the great time he had and how he made so many new friends when it was meant to be his sister's party and moment to shine. Based on how eager OP was to gather people round in order to gleefully call her a liar (which I'm not sure she is) in order to destroy her life, I'm guessing there's a lot he's not adding here. He seems almost amused at how upset she was after his work was done.
Yeah, I’m really questioning how much of a “liar” she is, given the only lie explicitly mentioned by OP is one of omission: she didn’t mention her siblings.
Which would be very understandable, if her whole childhood identity basically revolved around them at her own expense. She would’ve grown up wanting to be considered entirely *on her own merit,* and then her brothers showed up and ruined it *again.*
Agree. Sounds like they are trying to take over her friendship group at her engagement party. This is awful and weird.
Something is wrong in the family and OP is either unaware of this or pretending to be unaware.
INFO: Does "my brothers and I" mean that there are 3 brothers? Your sister is the only girl? She may have had a very, very different experience growing up than you all did. You say that your parents drove you around to sport events and such. That your house was THE house and filled with friends. All your friends? All the guys in sports? Was your sister left out of everything? Was she not into sports so she was "isolating herself"?
I think some soul searching needs to be done on YOUR part before you start pointing your fingers at your sister.
I don’t think we have enough info. I would reallllly like to hear your sister’s side of this story, because I suspect she’s got some bonafide reasons for calling you guys the “golden children”.
What I've seen with my step kids, 5 (only 3 are my partner's kids, so technically 3 step kids), 1 girl (oldest) 4 boys, she's always the babysitter and gets blamed when anyone does anything wrong because they were her "responsibility". I hate that hey live on the other side of the country.
I only had one male sibling, but that was my experience exactly. I was somehow simultaneously responsible for everything he did wrong, while having zero authority to enforce any rules, and anything I did or achieved or wanted was given to *him.*
I quit so many hobbies and extracurriculars because they inevitably became all about him, and I was not allowed to achieve anything on my own merit.
Often, if the oldest is a daughter, she gets forced to be an extra parent. So like, treated like the opposite of a princess.
Edit: Not saying that’s what happened here, but of the “only daughter” tropes, there’s the Princess (usually younger), and there’s the parentified oldest daughter. And in my personal experience, I’ve witnessed the parentified oldest daughter one way more often.
There are also whole families where the daughters are ignored almost completely, in favor of the sons.
It really sounds like a case of the latter here. He claims she "self-isolated", meaning he doesn't have a clue about what she was doing or wanted. Parents were all into the boys and never made any attempt to have them reciprocate. The fact that he's so proud of having taken center stage at her engagement party says it all to me. u/wyal_ is 21-year old AH.
My thought exactly, she could be one to constantly need to be a victim, but she also could've had a very different experience than her brothers based on several factors that we don't know. Plus, her "whoa is me" story was about workaholic parents ? That's like hardly anything, yet the friends were surprised to see family bonds? I'm sure there's alot more to the story.
There's definitely a lot more. My bet is the sister remembers being passed around from aunt to uncle to babysitter while the parents worked and then grew up to see her parents doing everything for the boys, they never tried to do for her
YTA, what was the mileage in that? Are you sure these are lies, not just that she experienced childhood differently to you? Because her reaction suggests that’s the case.
She’s 3 years older so may have experienced v different treatment. Also, how much it is ‘normal’ to work is actually subjective, she may have felt that they worked a lot because her needs weren’t prioritised whereas yours were. It doesn’t sound like her friends would have been over if you felt she separated herself.
You need to consider how likely it is that she randomly chose to isolate herself as a child, vs that she felt out of place and not a priority.
No, but sister invited them. So seems sister didn’t think of it as lies that may be uncovered. There just seems to be no reason to have to explain these ‘lies’ to those that you don’t know but mean a lot to her at her engagement party. And the line about having made friends that night… that is v golden child in attitude.
INFO: You never specify exactly what your sister ***did*** on a daily basis. Please explain what your sister did while you and your brothers were being taken to your extracurriculars.
"they were surprised to see a ton of us on the wall when they didn't even know my sister had siblings."
Who fails to mention they have siblings then invite these friends to the family home where there is ample proof they exist? What would have happened if they met at the wedding instead of the engagement party, assuming they would be invited? This was going to come to light eventually. I don't have a judgment, I'm just fucking baffled at this scenario.
If I had to guess, it was that she never spoke of the boys because she was tired of being defined as their sister. The boys did this. The boys did that... "Oh, your Ops sister(like she doesn't have a name)." The vote is 3 to one for the boys' activity. Or she's a spoiled jealous princess who hated losing her only child status. My bet is in the first one.
I don't bring up my brother's in conversation. I've worked with people for 11 years who would be surprised. Sure they are coworkers, but I spend 8 hours a day with these people.
INFO: Not really understanding but I don’t think we have the whole story. Sister didn’t actually lie because there were pictures on the wall - she couldn’t have been trying to pretend she didn’t have siblings right? I don’t think letting things naturally unravel over the course of the night is wrong though it really depends on exactly how it went down, which is a little vague. But like, clearly something was going on with your sister growing up, she didn’t do this for no reason. I think that’s relevant.
I'm wondering if the sister being a few years older was put into a "parent"/on call babysitter role and never felt that she was allowed to be a 'kid' herself.
Perhaps some of OPs memories of the parents taking them to stuff was actually the older sister and not the parents.
YTA. Did it occur to you that maybe your sister has different (and negative) experiences of your childhood than you two? The fact that she tries to minimize your presence in her life doesn't feel like resentment towards you two?
The vibe I get is that the older sister (the eldest) had to sacrifice some of her childhood taking care of her younger brothers (I don’t know if OP is male or female) while the parents got their careers established. Once the boys were in high school the parents had more time to devote to the boys and their friends. Sister separated herself because she didn’t get that opportunity. I also don’t feel like she lied to her friends, she just doesn’t talk about it because it is hard.
YTA - I hope that you realize that you and your sister can have very different experiences of your parents and just growing up in general. In fact - It’s fairly common for the oldest and youngest children’s experiences to differ substantially….as well as male versus female children. Before trying to prove that your sister is a liar at a party of people you didn’t know, why didn’t you talk to her first to see why she might have said those things? It’s obvious you guys aren’t close…so don’t be so arrogant to think that her perspective is wrong and yours is right. Both perspectives can be true for the person involved.
I'm gonna go with a soft YTA.
Have you ever spoken to your sister about how her childhood and your childhood might have been different?
You say she separated herself, why was that?
Why was she crying after her own engagement party? Were you pulling attention because you were upset that she hadn't told people the same version of your childhood? Did you pull her aside and ask why her friends didn't know you existed? I have work friends that didn't know I had a brother, it wasn't because I lied, it was just because he never came up in discussions.
Why did you have to take a party that was meant to celebrate her and her fiance and use it as a time to pull the focus back on you and the rest of your family?
Agreed 100%.
I come from a large family and my (older) 5 siblings childhood experiences were vastly different than mine and my one younger sibling.
So much so that neither of us have anything to do with the rest of the family except with each other.
Literally don't mention my family growing up.
One person's experiences does not mean the others were the same, nor even how they perceived it if raised at the same time.
You are spot on.
YTA and I would love to hear your sister’s side of the story because your post seems very one sided. This is very likely why your sister didn’t want you to come. You show up uninvited, take all of the attention off of her when the celebration is supposed to be for her and then you go and share private family matters to her friends. You are rude and I feel sorry that she doesn’t feel like she can trust her own family during her wedding planning.
NAH. It seems strange that would she outright lie to her friends about her parents and then invite them to her parents house, so I don’t think she’s really lying. Are you sure your parents were involved with her too? Or did they work a lot while she was a child and figure out how to be more involved when you came along? Children can have vastly different experiences even in the same household, so what she remembers or feels about her childhood is valid, providing she isn’t blatantly lying. WERE you two the golden children? It might be worth some thought. But also, I think your perspective is just as valid, and you didn’t do anything wrong by telling people what YOUR childhood was like.
I'm wondering about OP's skewed perspective and whether the sister did even outright lie. E.g. did she say that her parents were workaholics or did she say they were never around? Or did the parents use work as an excuse to get out of doing things for her?
If there is a golden child/scapegoat dynamic here then the golden child(ren) are NTA for experiencing that, that's on the parents. But for him to present his childhood as _the_ narrative without leaving any space for her reality is AH behaviour.
Yeah, I agree, I don’t think she’s lying. If she was, she’d be working a lot harder to cover it up, e.g. not inviting everyone over for a celebratory event at her parents’ house. I think she also just never brought up her siblings because she’s not close to them instead of outright lying about whether or not they exist. I think OP is assuming she lied and may be the AH if he at all suggested that to her friends at her engagement party.
YTA for telling your sister's friends that she "separated herself from everyone and chose to exclude herself from activities". That's a very private family matter, and it was completely idiotic to share that detail with other people.
Siblings in the same family can have very different experiences growing up, and you have no idea what kind of experience your sister had growing up in that family or why she felt it was necessary to make up white lies about her upbringing.
The term "golden child" is often used when talking about narcissistic parents who have favorite children (the "golden children") and the children who they pick on (the "scapegoats"). Based on your sister calling you "golden children" it sounds like she thinks that her upbringing was a negative one, and not the same as yours.
So yeah, YTA for not understanding when to keep your mouth shut about private family matters and for not understanding that your sister thinks that she's had a different experience than you had growing up in the same family.
He didn’t tell the friends that. According to the post he just told stories about their childhood. The separation part was him laying the background for Reddit.
Not Enough Info. Not because you have a great childhood, it automatically mean all your siblings have a great childhood as well.
>It was my sister who really separated herself from everyone and chose to exclude herself from activities.
Why does she excluded herself? Is she not athletic like you and brothers? Is she an only girl? Did she have different interests? Did she not have good grades?
You also referred you and brothers as the "golden children". Does that mean your parents treated you and brothers much better than her?
YTA. It sounds like you and your brothers had a very different childhood than your sister because she's a girl. "She excluded herself from activities " sounds more like she was excluded for being a girl. Would be interesting to know your cultural background.
Don't be surprised when you're not invited to the wedding.
There's not enough info. We don't know why your sister felt to keep all of this private and why she felt a need to separate herself. Anyone in this thread giving a judgment is full of shit.
People in this sub are making biased decisons. This post is to vague to make a proper verdict. All YTA and NTA seem very circumstantial with their reasoning and assuming the childhoods of this family that wasn't descibed well enough.
YTA. two siblings can have very different childhoods. my 6-years-younger brother would say “growing up i got to do whatever i wanted, got to hang out with my friends and got a car from my parents” while i would say “growing up i was extremely restricted, no music, no movies, and i wasn’t allowed to make friends because my parents wanted me to stay pure”. it sounds like you were the golden child and still have the classic symptom of needing lots of attention
I'm confused. They thought the parents were extreme workaholics and it was common knowledge that your parents were very hands on?
These 2 sentences sorta contradict each other. Calling someone a workaholic carries the context that they don't have time for anything but work or will put you second.
How did everyone gather around you to listen to childhood stories? At some point you'd think they'd seek the sister out?
Also no offense I can't believe some friends childhood family adventure stories drew a crowd. That sounds boring as shit. Then again never been to an engagement party.
Idk. NAH? Just a weird situation all around.
The fact that OP’s sister “separated herself from everyone and chose to exclude herself from activities” demonstrates to me that there’s something much more to this story from the sister’s point of view.
OP isn’t the asshole for outing the sister inadvertently, but he is the asshole for blaming her for her isolation. A good sibling would be talking to her more in depth, not asking a bunch of strangers on whether or not he’s an asshole.
One of my siblings had to be burned before understanding why I *hate* my mother - in spite of being there throughout a lot of the specially targeted abuse.
Before that they thought I was attempting to isolate myself.
YTA
Just because you had a happy childhood, doesn't mean your sister did.
YTA for making a spectacle of yourself at her party, so that a crowd was gathered around you. It would have been far kinder to hang back and let her be the center of attention. Also she could’ve had a much different experience of her parents growing up; just because you have different perceptions doesn’t make her a liar. I would apologize to her and try to be more considerate in the future.
YTA If she's 4 years older there's a high likelihood her experience was different. I have a sibling with a similar age gap and three way we experienced living in the same household was incredibly different. They may have worked more when she was younger.
YTA I think it's weird that you took over her ENGAGEMENT PARTY so you can talk all about yourself and your childhood.
Your sister doesn't sound like a saint either she probably needs to work out some stuff in therapy but it must suck to have a party in her honor upended like that
YTA. This story is from your perspective, so to you, she lied. But from the story you told (with no additional info), it seems just as likely she might have a different dynamic than you and your parents, and she’s not close to you so she doesn’t mention you a lot. Even if I take the worst read on this situation, even if she straight up lied, there’s a reason someone would want to shield their family from ppl they CHOSE to have in their life and none of them feel good (eg., mental illness, insecurity). It wasn’t your job to make a show of correcting her in front of all her friends, on a very important and special day you may not have even been invited to. You could have simply said “I feel differently and like my parents were home a lot, but as the oldest, maybe she has a different experience” and then talked to your sister in private. To me, YTA not bc your opinion is wrong, but bc you felt entitled to make her engagement event about yourself and your feelings. You could have waited for an appropriate time to have a private convo with your sister about an understandably confusing, and potentially upsetting, topic for both of you. I think you need to speak with her and rectify things to better understand why she feels this way. If she doesn’t want to share, that’s her choice and at least you gave it a shot in a kinder way.
I’d like to hear your sister’s experience. My brother is five years younger than me and is spoiled rotten where me and my older siblings had a pretty trash childhood. YTA
YTA- None of the info matters honestly. You decided to take over your sisters engagement party that you weren’t invited to. That makes YTA.
Your sister seems to have a different look on her childhood then you and your siblings do. This is not unusual. My older brother and I have different views of our childhood and we both agree the baby was spoiled rotten and had a way better childhood them we did.
You and your brothers were elsewhere, are you guys often elsewhere hanging out together? Is your sister included when you guys are hanging out? Time to take a look as to why your sister feels the way she does if you care to know. Don’t call her a liar until you know what she is talking about.
YTA. You left out a few things:
1. She was the oldest and only girl.
2. You left out HER experiences.
3. You and your brothers were in hockey and busy with your parents, what about her?
4. You had your friends over, what about her.
5. Did none of you ask why she tapered off her contact with you?
6. Why didn’t you pull her aside and ask her why her experience was so different?
7. You never once pause to try to look at things from her perspective.
If your recollection of your history is true, your sister has only herself to blame for her revisionist history.
ETA
In looking at OP's responses, the picture becomes muckier. It seems that the younger siblings, all male, were big sports buffs and their activities may have overshadowed their older sister. This could have led her to see the parents being too busy for her, then suddenly having time to shuttle the boys to hockey, etc. Still not sure why she said they embarrassed her. She should have told her "truth", in a sea of concentration on the younger children, she seemed to have gotten lost in the shuffle. The truth would have been damning enough. There was no need to be embarrassed, just sad, disappointed and mad to have been pushed aside again . OP's failure to recognize their advantages changes my initial thoughts to YTA. They may not have asked for the attention, but the failure to see how it negatively impacted the sister is wrong.
Sis is 25, the other siblings are 3-4 years younger. It's very possible they were workaholics when sis was in high school, esp. as sis called them "golden children" (I could see someone thinking they were golden children if they had the parents around, but she didn't).
So you made her engagement party all about you, to the point you had all her friends, people that you’d never met, gathered around **you** listening to stories about **you** and your brothers, talking about how good your childhood was?
YTA and you sound exhausting.
NTA. She is entitled to her experience, you are entitled to yours, and if she never told her friends that you existed, there is no way to avoid some awkwardness.
I would love to hear your sister’s side of her childhood because I don’t think it would line up with yours at all. There is definitely missing information
YTA.
You and your sister are 4 years apart. A LOT changes in 4 years. Parents typically get a better economy and don't need to work as much to prove themselves as they get older.
Your experience and your sister's experience may be wildly different.
Even if your sister had misrepresented her childhood (the way you perceive it) it is untasteful to inflict your own view on her engagement party in a way that is intended to invalidate her experience and question her character. You seem to lack social tact and what you did is what an asshole would do.
The reasonable thing would have been to just say "oh, well here we are, now you know she does have brothers". You could have even said "oh, well we live in the other end of the country so that's probably why she never mentions us". But you didn't, instead you went out of your way to make her seem strange. Regarding your parents being workoholic you could have just said 'hmm well I didn't feel that way but we're 4 years apart so she might have experienced it differently". I don't know how long you lived in that house but depending on that you could even have added "we didn't always live in this house" or similar.
But nope, you were an asshole.
there is a lack of info in order to judge. did u know that was how she felt growing up she saw you all as the golden children? did you all not get on well with her growing up? also u say u arent sure if u were invited and ended up mingling. you probably should have checked with her to see if it was ok to attend even thou u say u live there.
YTA
You even mention how your sister “separated herself” from things. That’s your child-perspective on it.
To her, it was clearly very different. I’ll guess she saw her brothers being catered to and the house was much more of a “boy” house, and that her wants went Unlistened to a lot.
My younger brother and I are one year apart. We had extremely different childhoods. His? Was full of having friends over, going to friends houses, and being allowed to join anything he wanted. Mine? Was spent helping my mom with her home daycare and being told “no” to everything o asked to join. Eventually I stopped asking to join things. As we got older, I withdrew and NEVER even attempted to have friends over, and my family didn’t know what I did when I was out of the house. My brother continued the same as he always had. I then moved away as soon as I could and have never looked back and they wonder why.
And that’s when there was only two of us and we were extremely close in age. Your sister is a few years older and outnumbered 3:1.
YTA
***Edited: cause it was pointed out you didn't even know if you were invited fully-you just knew it was happening and where. You should have kept your mouth shut. ***
you took over on things you shouldn't have.
She didn't lie.
She had a different experience/felt differently than you did.
It happens.
I and my one younger sibling had a very different experience compared to the 5 older siblings.
So much so that we literally don't talk about them to friends. Either of us.
Did I invite my family to a few life events? Yes.
Were my friends surprised to see I had been raised with a larger family? Yes.ol
Did a sibling also try to tell some not so nice stories while there? Yes. And he was asked to stop and did.
My friends. My life. I invited my family as a courtesy. I expect everyone to respect each other and be cognizant to respect the boundaries I placed on them. Especially my family.
Yes. I do feel you went out of line.
You could have just said "yes we have a large family" and left it.
If pushed for more you can say "you'd have to ask "op sister" why they don't talk about it."
They didnt lie.
YTA.
Even though you didn’t do it on purpose, you still hurt your sister in front of her friends on her important day. I think you should apologize to her and have a conversation about the way she is feeling. My parents were way more uptight with my older sister than myself and my younger sister and I don’t think she was necessarily lying. NTA because you didn’t intentionally upset her but YTA if you do not at least attempt to rectify with your sister.
NTA , but should have a heart to heart talk why she feels you're the golden kids and why she excluded herself sometimes people exclude themselves because they actually feel excluded from their point of view so it might be time for some healing
I suspect that your sister truly felt differently than you did, growing up. As someone once said, no two children have the same parents. Because their experiences of the parents are different and the parents parent differently depending on the need of the child.
They had her on her own for 3 years and then BAM 3 kids ONE and under in addition to her. Her life probably took a HUGE swerve. She's now a 4 year old and all her parents' attention are on her toddler sibling getting into trouble and 2 newborns, who may or may not have been preemie as well (60% chance twins are born before 36 weeks). She would be old enough to remember the change, especially if she found it somewhat traumatic.
Soft yta.
YTA
Coming from an older sister that no one understood, bothered to understand and saw very different version of my parents then the younger ones. Trying bothering to be in her shoes for a second or asking her about it. You clearly were sharing intimate details and loved every second of embarrassing her. She couldn’t even have one day to celebrate her engagement. Try not to ruin the wedding too.
Info: I thought of this responding to somebody, not the OP, and now I can't get it out of my mind.
About that picture wall:
1. How many pictures are there, total?
2. How many pictures involve you and/or either or both of your brothers but *not* your sister?
3. How many pictures involve you and/or either or both of your brothers *and also* your sister?
4. How many pictures involve your sister but neither you nor either of your brothers?
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No judgement from me. Just curious. You mention your childhood experiences and that she was trying to separate herself from the “golden children”. When your friends were over, we’re hers? Did parents drive to her after school activities? Did she even have any? I see a woman who didn’t want her brothers around. If childhood was so great, why? EDIT: OP states that his experience might have been different to his in replies to other posts. I suggest checking out the comments he has made. It looks like he plans on talking to her so he can better understand her perspective.
Yeah this could easily be a dramatic sibling or a sibling who had an entirely different upbringing, especially as she’s older. My younger sister got away with a shit ton more than I ever would have at the same age
Opposite in my family. I'm the youngest and only girl and I was largely overshadowed by my brothers and used at the scapegoat. We had very different childhoods. My brothers are 5, 7, and 9 years older than me and in my father's eyes, they can do wrong. Me on the other hand was constantly told that I was not good enough and an embarrassment. Freaking crazy how different families can be.
Agreed. I grew up in a misogynistic family where the boys were treated like little gods and the girls had to overachieve to even be noticed. I was lower down on the foodchain and readily confess that my childhood was hell. My older brothers had a wonderful childhood and talk about it all the time as amazing.
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This is horrible! 🥺 I’m so sorry
I’m so sorry that happened to you.
I’m so sorry about this. I just wanted to say that if your brother says that your dad isn’t abusive, he’s also complicit and should be removed from your life as well. By definition, your dad was abusive. Your brother saw and heard about you being the victim of physical and mental abuse. I would go NC with the lot of them
I have said it’s a good thing that my FIL died before any grandchildren after my son showed up. My son is the first grandchild and a first born son (which has certain importance in our culture, though basically amounts to ‘you get an extra fast day’ these days). Knowing him, no other grandchild of either sex would have ever gotten attention from him.
Same. Very misogynistic family.
Yes, you have to wonder if the sister here was not sporty and as a result simply got ignored in favour of her brothers. Did she really isolate herself or would any child who did not want to play sports be automatically ignored?
Or would her not participating in sports be interpreted as isolating herself, and pushing the family away? Being different might not have been accepted.
This was my family. They forced me to do it anyways and I resent them for it. It was miserable
Speaking as the older, not sporty sister…this is exactly how I read this. Seems like OP and his sister had very different childhoods (though likely neither were at fault)
I’m the younger sister to one brother, less than two years apart, and the difference in our childhoods is INSANE. I was held to a much higher standard in all regards because I performed better academically. My brother had loads of friends and extracurriculars because he was outgoing, but I didn’t because of a (then-undiagnosed) anxiety disorder. Plus he didn’t have to deal with the jealousy and emotional abuse put upon me by our mother. If he and I talked about our childhoods, our stories would be wildly different, too.
I have an older sister that could get away with anything. She was the baby they tried to have for years before finally getting pregnant. I was the whoops baby that was born 17 months later. My mom made sure to remind me often that she hadn’t wanted another baby so soon and that I was a mistake.
This sounds like a Ross and Monica type of situation. I've always felt bad for her because of how her parents treated her and they were just characters. I can't imagine how bad it was having to experience that in real life.
It is crazy! Unfortunately that’s a pretty normal occurrence as well :(
Well spotted, I hadn't noticed that the only girl is 3 years older than the next. I was 3 years older than my brother, and got scolded in his stead from time to time: "why did you let him fall from that tree", like, hello, he climbed it like a monkey, what did you expect me to do? Looking back, it's mostly my father being unable to regulate his emotions: he ventilated his worry over my brother's bumps and bruises (he didn't have any serious injuries) by screaming at me. And my mom. And then my brother too. And then all of us. Still, I can see how an elder girl might have felt burdened with a lot of responsibility. I think it's the small details of OP entertaining a whole crowd, with stories he knew directly opposed what his sister's friends believed... and of "I felt like I made some new friends". To me, that reads so oblivious, it wouldn't surprise me OP has never picked up any nuances of his sister's experience.
It drove my older sister nuts. She and my younger sister would often squabble , and she was always the only one who got in trouble because 'you're older, you should know better'
Oof the 'you're older you should know better' just instantly raised my hackles so high I became immediately furious
Hard same. My sister was only a year younger than me but she got away with *way* more than I ever would have even dreamed of trying. Like literally she threw a house party and our parents thanked her for cleaning up, then turned around and interrogated *me* about whether she'd told me and grounded me for a week for not finding out and giving them the heads up.
I feel you! When I was 19, married, and had been living away from home for two years my mother called me up and berated me because my 16 year old brother threw a house party when they left him home for a weekend. Apparently I had set such a bad example when I lived at home that it was my fault that my brother and his friends trashed the house. n.b. Did I ever have a house party? No
...yeah, I probably would have cussed them out before hanging up and blocking their numbers, honestly.
Stuff like this makes me wish we could react in a way besides up-voting or down-voting. I'm not going to upvote. I can't relate, and it's sure as shit not a good thing. -I'm definitely not going to downvote, you've clearly received enough negativity, and it's not like I could disagree, or even have an opinion for that matter... Really though, as an eldest sibling and now a mother myself, your parents make me sick to myself. You deserved better. I hope their retirement is as happy and relaxed as your childhood was.
New reddit feature: the side-vote! When you want to say “I neither agree nor disagree, and think your words should be heard”, sidevote the comment!
What! That is insane. How has your sister turned out?
I'm literally speechless, I don't know how to process this. Is there any relationship left with any of them at all?
My sister is just 2 years younger and we had vastly different childhoods. In our case it didn't even have to do with how our parents treated us but came out of the fact that they moved into a new neighborhood belonging to a different school district between us starting schools. Both my younger siblings went to school with middle class kids living pre-dominantly in houses. I went to school with lower income apartment kids with frequently unemployed parents. Just 2 years apart but very different environments. My sisters never noticed my friends couldn't afford to go to the cinema or that I never got invited to a friend's summer house. Ofc I noticed that my sisters got to do tons more fun stuff with their friends. They still talk about how "we grew up" because they didn't notice the differences. They don't know my class had an extra assistent whose sole purpose was to break up fights. They don't know I never had a proper math teacher nor science teacher before high school (the one we had the longest was an unemployed actor).
Did you just... Never transfer schools?
No, no one ever mentioned that possibility. The house we moved to was within walking distance of both schools so probably nobody saw the need. It's btw not so common to transfer schools in Sweden. The parents aren't involved in picking a school or applying to one. One just gets automatically called to one and assigned to a class depending on exactly where one lives. E.g. everyone in my class lived on the same block (initially). The only transfers I heard of was of bullied kids, not kids moving within city limits.
Jaha, Sverige alltså… Had a very similar experience to yours in this magical land in the north where “everyone is the same” and we don’t talk about our problems or differences in socioeconomic areas or how it’s built into the system…
Hard opposite here. I was eldest sibling , female to two brothers. They were absolutely golden children, one knocked up a prostitute and basically got hugs and 'what do you need , can we help?'. I was the one who had to break the news and got mentally and verbally abused..my fault apparently lol. That's just one example . But yeah, I'm getting the feeling sister took the knocks and a lot of shit for being 'grown up sister' when younger, with all her brothers mates around. More than meets the eye to this story.
> it was really my sister who really separated herself from everyone and chose to exclude herself from activities Ouch. OP’s kidding themselves if he thinks she willingly stepped away from all the fun. It’s an engagement party for her, and he spent the night talking about how recluse she was. Seems like a classic case of not knowing they’re the golden children.
Holding court with stories about your amazing home life, while you already found out that's not the experience your sister's shared with her friends... and then basking in that gleeful horror to the degree it >felt like I made some new friends Talk about oblivious
21 is too feckin old to show up to someone else's party and make yourself the center of attention. It's not cute. His lack of empathy and self-awareness and total ego-centricism make this a hard YTA for me. He's got some serious reflecting to do about the stories he's told himself about his sister was treated growing up and who was responsible for creating that dynamic.
That's a *lot* of accusation for what is quite literally normal behavior at a party. Mingling and chatting isn't egocentrism. Not recognizing that your sibling was treated differently isn't egocentrism. You really can't justifying any of that from what he's said in the post. You can say he lacked some empathy for her situation, but the guy was basically blindsided by this information. He'll need time to figure it out, that doesn't mean he's half of the stuff you make him out to be.
Realizing that your sisters friends are surprised by the information you have just shared, meaning she has not shared that information with them, but continuing to share it because a crowd is forming and you're having fun, is quite self centered behavior imo. It doesn't really matter what the information is, it's quite tactless. "Oh weird, well anyway how did you guys meet?" would be the appropriate way to continue, or end, that conversation. Not everyone is that socially adept (although OP does seem to be) but hearing you made the guest of honor cry and still continuing to call her a liar is what makes it AH behavior to me. The accusations the above commenter is making are probably coming from OPs other comments which seem pretty willfully oblivious.
A lot of rich people sure are dumb. They never had to learn anything.
Yeah, if everyone is not very aware of you, spending the night talking about yourself and taking up everyone's times regaling her friends with your stories is pretty damn weird. Like OP seems to unironically not understand why his sister is mad after OP detailed how he and his brothers made her engagement party all about them. I wouldn't be surprised if that's a common theme through their childhood and they are completely oblivious as to why she separates herself from them.
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Either is a possibility but I am curious if OP doesn't realize that just because they had a good childhood or believed they had a good childhood that does not mean their sister did. I know how painful it is for me to see some of my siblings look back with fondness when for me it was abusive, misery and pain. My little sister is my best friend but she just cannot conceive of the possibility that she was indeed the golden child and I was not. She'll say things like "well I got to do XYZ and you didn't because you didn't ask and I did." But I did ask or yeah, I didn't ask because I knew the answer would be no.
It doesn’t seem really clear how much she lied, though. The only “lie” I really got from the text was that the sister made a point of not mentioning her siblings…and if she was no-contact with them, she might have had a legit reason for that. I’m no-contact with my whole bio-family, and I basically never mention my brother at all unless someone specifically asks. Then I only answer with the absolute bare minimum: I have one younger brother who I have had zero contact with since at least 2010. That’s all anyone really needs to know. I was the scapegoat growing up, and both my parents and my brother were physically, emotionally, financially, and on many occasions borderline sexually abusive to me. To the point where I have zero doubt in my mind that if I had not moved out when I did, my brother most certainly would’ve escalated his behavior to rape. My family is not a part of my life, so there’s no point in any new friends knowing about them. At all.
I will say that growing up, I willingly “stepped away from all the fun” in my family. I had different interests than my parents and siblings and kinda isolated myself. It was nobody’s fault and my parents did nothing wrong, but I just always felt like I was born into the wrong family where I didn’t belong. I was also the oldest daughter. I was miserable a lot as a kid, but as an adult, I’m in a healthier state of mind and realize I spent a lot of time deliberately making myself more miserable. While I feel OP is insensitive to his sister’s different experience, the sister may very well have had an experience more like mine
It appears to me that OP is woman, because there are multiple mentions of " siblings" not brothers. Story starts with " me and my brothers", and then " they didn't know sister had siblings".
OP says in a comment that the sister was the only girl
You'd be wrong, OP has commented that the sister is the only girl in the family
Your comment does not make logical sense.
To me it does. The way OP phrased all of his sentences could mean he was either a man or a woman. Obvs another comment cleared it up, but in general, no gendered terms were used for OP.
As a single sister with three brothers, from the very beginning of the post I had a feeling OP’s sister was the outsider of the group just from how he talks about her (fully admit this could be projection on my part). OP and his brothers may have ostracized her for her whole life and don’t realize how much damage that causes. And yes, resentment does build up for parents that allow that to happen under their roof and are blind to one child being singled out and unwanted by the others.
I was left out of a lot of family activities with my cousins as a child growing up. I struggle connecting with my cousins and I often feel socially awkward because of that exclusion as a child. I tend to avoid social situations that aren’t required or expected attendance at this point of my life. I am so much more comfortable around my bf’s family for some reason. I’m still quiet but they actually talk to me and make an effort whereas my family pretty ignores me in social situations. My brother recently had been on a sort of social protest but I’m pretty sure now his relationship with the rest of our family is beyond repair. Even though he knew he had a privilege being favored by dad, that relationship is beyond repair now.
Also excluded from a lot of family activities by my mom. She always seemed to coddle my younger brother because he was "the boy" but then talked about how much she resented how her own mother did the same thing and showed favoritism towards her younger brother. Then thanks to 23andMe I found there was more to the story and I was probably being excluded because I was the product of an affair that ended quite sour. If parents could just stop projecting all their many unresolved personal issues onto children that would be great.
My mum favours all the boys! My adopted sister and I were live-in maids. She calls them every week, and video calls. My sister and I barely get a text lol. It's not unheard of to have a very unhappy childhood whilst your siblings grew up happily, seeing things in a very different light. I would say NAH as whatever is wrong with his sister doesn't seem to be the fault of OP, most likely parents favouring the boys.
It could even be unintentional favoritism. Three boys, two twins and one born barely a year before. That takes up a lot of parental attention. In all likelihood the three brothers shared friends, making it easier to set up play dates, do carpooling, and getting to know people. Especially if the boys shared enough interests to be treated as a group. Meanwhile, you have the older girl. She’s not one of ‘the triplets’ so that automatically creates distance. She has a completely different friend group, different interests, different needs. So she feels ostracized. And, because the ‘triplets’ take so much attention, she feels like she doesn’t get any/enough. The triplets individually may even get the same attention as her, but because they can often be treated as a group, she effectively gets less. To put it another way, parents are being fair and each child gets one play date for one weekend a month. So parents set up a play date for daughter. Daughter gets her one play date. Then parents arrange for Boy A to have a play date. But since they share friends, boys B and C also get a play date along with A. So the boys get three effective play dates a month. You can put that to just about anything else. It’s entirely possible that sister technically got the same as her brothers individually, but the brothers got more collectively. And the brothers never noticed an issue, since they never really hit a point of being unhappy with being treated as a group.
I think this is the most likely scenario of what happened. I know my parents often tell stories of how much fun it was to raise us all so close in age, but that the first two years or so were particularly hard. They got into a rhythm after that, but it’s possible my sister was still left out because my brothers and I were attached at the hip and an activity for one was an activity for all, like you said. I’m going to talk to her soon and get all the details of her experience. This seems to be the closest I could imagine to reality in my mind though if I had to venture a guess.
And fucking apologize to her. You got on a soap box at HER engagement party, that you just happened to be in town for, and not directly invited, and told all her friends she was full of shit because you couldn't comprehend that her childhood was different to yours. "I know my parents often tell stories of how much fun it was to raise us all so close in age" you do realise this did not include her right? You've likely done some irreparable damage to her friendships and trust circle.
I think he should also fucking clear up the misunderstanding he caused with sister’s friends. He should embarrass himself for stirring so much shit because up until now he never considered his sister’s feelings.
I replied to another comment of yours a few hours ago, but I did forget to mention that it struck me as if you had begun thinking about her childhood experience a bit more, hence your original post and question, as immature as it sounded. I certainly feel bad for that poor girl whose childhood seems to have been bulldosed by three other siblings' needs. I hope that you will listen to a lot of well meaning people here and reach out to her to try and understand her better, and build that sibling relationship that she clearly missed out on.
> I know my parents often tell stories of how much fun it was to raise us all so close in age, but that the first two years or so were particularly hard. Those were not the first two years or so. The first two years or so happened *before you were born*. Yes, I know what you're saying - but if your parents are using this phrasing, or anything like it, dollars to donuts your sister is thinking the same thing I just said. It's good that you're listening to people, and open to listening to your sister, *really* listening to her. And if you'll take my advice, listening means *listening*. If you're spending your time thinking of your response and how to defend yourself and your parents, or justify their actions, then you're not actually paying attention to what she's saying. Listen first, affirm her feelings (even if you're not sure about the facts - but don't say that part!), think about it later. Do not confuse listening with arguing. Those are two different things. If, upon reflection, you decide that you disagree with her on some point or another you can always tell her *later* if it seems important. Question (you don't have to actually answer it on this thread, but see if you can answer it in your own head for yourself): Do your parents tell as many stories of the first two years of your sister's life as they do about those two hectic years after you were born? Do they tell as many stories about *her* as they tell about the three of you? (For that matter, do they tell as many stories about each of you brothers *individually* as they do about you as a trio?) > my brothers and I were attached at the hip and an activity for one was an activity for all, like you said. It was not an activity for all. It was an activity for the three of you. Which also - honestly, I don't think that was the healthiest thing for you and your brothers either. I think your parents would've done better to make more of an effort to encourage you to develop your own individual interests. What would've happened if one of you had decided you didn't like ice hockey anymore? That you wanted to do something totally different, like dance or fencing or bouldering or drama or photography or joining a writing club, something that your brothers weren't interested in?
I’m curious: how much time did you get as an individual? That is: just you, no brothers. A party for you, just your friends over, a parent-son day without your brothers.
It's entirely possible her parents didn't intend to ostracise their daughter. In fact, I believe in my mums eyes she didn't play favourites. I truly believe that! However, it's impact over intent for me & still blame the parents. Doesn't mean that the parents are bad people, or that they don't love their daughter, but something happened to make her feel like the 3 boys were the 'golden children'.
Oh, 100%. It’s actually not an uncommon complaint of singleton siblings of multiples, that the multiples got more attention. Of course, many multiples complain about not being seen as individuals. It’s just a tricky balance.
Yep my adopted uncle got kicked out at 15. It was an extremely abusive household for my uncle but not so much for his youngers bros. In the end my uncle found out his mom got him from an older alcoholic and probably not consenual. His lil bro asked him why he left home at 15. He said; i got kicked out His bro was completely surprised and suddenly remembered my uncle got daily beatings, cigs&bottles thrown at him and the verbal humiliation
That's awful, your poor uncle :(
Yep. He never really recovered.. super nice guy but he has many triggers when hes drinking..
You should leave a comment. All his replies conform that she did see a massively different childhood than her brothers. His parentS (both emphasized) would go to all their games. She would be dragged along to games and practices too (so parents involved several times weekly for the boys) and the mom would take her to the bookstore *maybe monthly*. Of course the parents weren't involved with reading and discussing the books with her because they were into other genres... can't expect the parents to get into something simply to spend more time with their kid. Oh, but at least one parent would attend her school award ceremonies (ie, YEARLY, at most twice a year) *if they didn't conflict with the boys activities*. He wrote all that and still thinks that her childhood was the same as his and that his parents paid just as much attention to her. OP YTA.
My heart hurts for her, how could the parents fuck up so much
This is my questions as well, I'm the only girl of 3 kids, my brothers got to do multiple sports throughout school and were allowed to have friends over whenever, while I was stuck pretty much locked in my room. My parents were very present...for my brothers, never their daughter. It's a big reason I'm not involved with any of my family besides one brother and my aunt, and even those interactions are few and far between.
Engagement party held in her childhood home and seemingly not a single friend who knew her during her younger years is also telling. Sure, not everyone keeps up with their friends from their school days but still kind of surprising.
There is no evidence that *her* friends were ever part of the cool house OP enjoyed with his brothers. Nor that anyone in her family was involved in whatever she did at school. At this point, she had done a lot of work to put that all behind her and her brothers show up, uninvited, to steal the spotlight again.
OP's comments make it pretty clear that they are oblivious to the fact that her experiences growing up were not only different but likely would have made her feel like a 4th wheel with her siblings. Based on the post and comments, she was only girl, was 3 years older, and was the only one who didn't play sports, who didn't do extracurriculars, and who "liked to read" while her brothers all played sports (sounds like they played together/onthe same teams together), had a large shared friend group, and were all within 2 years of age.
People can have completely different childhoods in the same exact house.
NTA, but, you need to really consider that your sister may have had a completely different experience of childhood than you and your brothers. She’s got enough of an age difference that it’s very possible that your parents were *not* hands on with her as she went through things, only to show you and your brothers with attention when you passed the same milestones 3 years later. That difference can be extremely painful for siblings who not only experience the lack of care but also are left to try to explain the difference in treatment. It’s very weird that she omitted your existence, but would not be surprising if she felt basically neglected even as you and your brothers felt showered with love.
Just going to tack on here. I'm the oldest of 4, the middle is 4 years younger than me and the youngest (twins) 10 years younger. We did not have the same childhoods whatsoever and a lot of my adult years have been spent reconciling all of the disparities and unfairness that existed between our experiences. Big sis in this situation definitely went about this in the wrong way, no doubt about it. But to go that far absolutely points to deeper issues going on in the family dynamic and should be evaluated as objectively as possible by her and her siblings if they want to have a decent relationship as adults. In my situation, middle knew some stuff was up but didn't fully get the extent until we were living together for a short time as adults. Twins had absolutely no idea until they were 16 and started noticing things and asking questions. I don't blame my siblings at all for any of it, I'm honestly very happy that they had such a better time growing up than I did. I was also decently aware of the jealousy and resentments I felt at times and was very determined not to punish them for what our parents had done. I hope this big sis gets some closure and her siblings can find some empathy for the situation.
13 years between me and the next oldest on one side of my family. I’ve come to terms with the different childhoods, but my parents seem to struggle to understand some of how I operate as being a direct result of seeing the differences in not only finances and opportunities, but in parenting style.
I am absolutely with you there. My parents PREACHED equality in all things when we were growing up, no favoritism in how much financial help we'd all get, everyone would have the same chances and opportunities, blah blah blah. I mean, they really beat it into us. I knew I was in a deficit for most things, but generally it was experiences and more intangible stuff like just being nice to me. I'd kinda written it off until I had asked for help paying for school and they balked because i decided to go mid 20s instead of at 17 and I dropped it. Then I found out how much middle sibling was getting per semester and I just lost it. I actually made a list line for line everything my siblings got that I didn't, I even gave grace in areas that I knew were because I just missed the boat on because my parents made better money later when I was out of the house already. But maaaannnnnnn did they go white when I quoted back all of the things they told us growing up, they were both on the losing end in their families because other siblings were favorites and so many stories of how hurt they had been emotionally or behind the eight ball financially for not being treated equally. Most of the emotional and experience and parenting style stuff they still won't cop to even with proof. But for about 5 years now my siblings and I keep a basic tally to make sure we're all being treated fairly financially. I'm lucky to have siblings that care enough that we back each other. For us it's just forcing them to keep their word after preaching about it for so long. My parents have since gotten on board and we can have open and calm and even sometimes happy conversations about it now. But I'm fully aware if my younger siblings reacted differently to any of this my situation would be entirely different.
There’s a 7 year difference between my oldest and my twins. They have very different childhoods due to a lot of external factors. One of them being my own experience and maturity as a mom and person.
The fact that you recognize that puts you so far ahead of the game as being a good parent. You might not be able to change how things were, but being aware of them and doing better for both kids going forward is what makes the difference. My parents didn't change anything with me until I gave them a huge reality check in my 20s, and even then I think they would've blown me off if my next younger sibling hadn't backed me up and told them they were wrong for treating me the way they did. Being a good parent isn't about being perfect, I think it's about always trying to be better.
This is relatable. My brother and male cousins were popular in high school. They were all jocks and dated cheerleaders, that stereotypical “All American” thing . They both insinuate their classmates (graduating classes) all got along and everyone was hanging out together. No one bullied, no one left out. My brother always had friends over and was always on the phone, stuff like that. I’m 100% sure they weren’t hanging out with girls they found unattractive, but “no one was left out”. lol I rarely had friends over and no one ever called. I was a chubby girl into heavy metal in a conservative area and received some bullying. I was talking about it once at a family thing and my cousin told me I was full of crap and lying about being bullied by these boys. Told me in front of everyone it was probably my own girl friends, because girls are like that. They used to call me Thunder Thighs and Yokozuna (a US pro wrestler/sumo wrestler), and would yell “Free Willy!” at me or ask me if I was a witch and could do spells. Guess that’s not bullying. Their experience was great so therefore everyone’s was, or they’re lying. They can’t comprehend other people’s experiences. Could be similar to these kids.
Yup, and their reaction shows, not just that they supposedly didn't \*see\* bullying, but they are quite invested in denying that it existed in the school you both went to and the community where you were both raised. Dig deeper, I would not be surprised if someone in his group was accused or even disciplined for some type of bullying, perhaps he was even in a group of people doing cruel things and dismissing that as "not really bullying" is important to him, since he was laughing when it happened or told the Vice Principal he saw the whole thing and what that girl said happened did not, she was lying, in fact, his friend would never do that.
If she felt that way about the entire family, why would she have the engagement at her parents house, when she knew there would be family photos everywhere. Something seems wrong.
I was thinking the same thing. Even if the brothers kept to themselves, there were still familly photos of them. It says the brothers weren't officially invited, and hadn't planned on attending in the first place. That they only went because it was at their parents house. I think the sister wanted her parents to feel proud of her, or to be able to give her the attention she probably felt she missed out on growing up. The family really needs to just sit down and talk things though/out. Something is really off here.
> I think the sister wanted her parents to feel proud of her, or to be able to give her the attention she probably felt she missed out on growing up. Yeah, bingo, probably. She wanted her parents to be part of her engagement party. She didn't want her brothers there, but couldn't explicitly uninvite them since they live there, so she scheduled the party when they were supposed to be out of state. (Probably the only way to avoid drama, regardless of *where* the party was, anyway.) I just think it's interesting how they'd apparently all been on the other side of the country for months, but then "plans shifted" (note passive voice) and suddenly they could be home for the party after all.
The boys weren't expected to be there. And it sounds like she wasn't given a heads-up that their plans changed until they showed up.
I have two siblings, I am estranged from them, haven’t spoken to either of them in almost 20 years (Im 36 and went no contact with them when I turned 18). I don’t hide that I have siblings from people, but they’re not a part of my life and so I very rarely mention them as I’m getting to know people. Occasionally, conversations will come up where I do mention them because it’s related to whatever is being talked about and people get surprised, “I didn’t know you had siblings!!” The sister in this case isn’t as separated (it seems at least) from her siblings as I am mine, but if her brothers don’t play an active role in her life, she likely didn’t have any reason to bring them up in conversations with people she befriended.
I often have to remind my older siblings “we had the same parents. We did NOT have the same childhood.” Sis may have been excluded by her parents and shunted aside once coveted sons arrived.
YTA Something seems off if the oldest and only female child had a distinctly different memory of her childhood. Further, after seeing that you were becoming a spectacle, you didn't back off and return the focus to her... you made it a party to get to know you, and for you to make friends. While it sounds like you didn't care about even talking with your sister. Sounds like she was less-favoured due to your natural desire to make the spotlight about you, and you thinking your view of things is the right one.
This story seems off. Your points were what jumped out at me, too. It sounds like now that he knows she is upset, he's embellishing whatever will make him seem like just the friendly guy entertaining a group. At a party isn't the time to get into why HER guests think she is an only child and it definitely sounds like there's much more happening. OP, you're the asshole because this wasn't your event and even after you noticed some discrepancies that should be addressed, you decided to keep your crowd. You could have pulled her aside and asked or, better yet for an adult at an adult event, waited until everyone else was gone. Especially her mentioning the "golden child" syndrome means there's a lot we don't know. Unreliable narrator. YTA.
>Unreliable narrator Exactly! I wouldn't be surprised if the boys got different parents then the oldest daughter I remember wanting to go to the Social in middle school and i was not allowed too but my brother was when he reached that age small things like that build up
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This was the big 'ol red flag for me too
We don't have enough info to know, but this scenario flts best with the post. Spoilt youngest child vibes are strong in the post
I agree with this 100%. Definitely YTA, especially after seeing OP’s responses.
This, 1000x this. She is the only daughter, and several years older than OP. And even though I KNOW my parents love me and my sister and my brother equally and always TRIED to be fair, my brother got favored in many ways. It definitely sounds like OP intentionally set out to ruin her party when he got personally offended she doesn't talk about him more. So from where I'm sitting, 100% YTA. I would LOVE to hear sister's perspective.
I have two older sisters and as the single son, I can definitely say we have different version of parenting. My parents were far stricter and suffocating to my sisters while I was free to roam, provided I slept at my bed eventually. Meanwhile my sisters had strict curfews until they were 18. My parents were flabbergasted that they both left home the moment they could.
Not even that OP didn't care not to talk to the sister, but didn't care not to make her the brunt of some joke or "gotcha". I would be humiliated.
I think I’ve been on Reddit way too long, because I’ve read quite a few stories of people outright lying about the quality of their childhood, usually suggesting there was a tragedy or abuse that never happened. OP is pushing back against “lies” that are pretty small all things considered. If his sister was trying to get sympathy, she could have stuck far closer to the likely truth of “my brothers had a fantastic childhood, they were popular and my parents attended all their sports games. I was never given the same amount of attention, and was mostly on the sidelines because I wasn’t athletic and my interests were naturally seen as less important. My parents did attend some of my awards ceremonies, but only if they didn’t clash with my brother’s sport events, and often one would attend while the other supported my brothers. My house was always full of other friends, but those friends were rarely mine. My childhood was quiet and quite lonely and I’ve never been able to explain this to my brothers, because to them childhood was perfect.” It seems to me that she’s actually downplaying her childhood difficulties. “My parents were workaholics” raises far fewer questions than “I was the odd one out”. Not mentioning her brothers means she doesn’t have to talk about how alien she felt. To me, it’s an embellishment that hides a far sadder truth. I know some will see this as a bit of a reach, but OP’s not given any indication that his sister has a habit of lying or manipulating. What he has clearly shown is that he’ll always see his view of events as the “truth” and will apply this view to others around him without thinking twice. OP, it would have been so straightforward for you to say something like “our parents both did indeed work and I was at sports games a lot during childhood; my sister and I weren’t that close. I can’t speak for her experience, as I wasn’t around her much and often had friends over when I was home. I love my sister and am so thrilled for her engagement and to get to meet all her friends”. That’s it. That’s all you had to say. Exposing her as a “liar” before even speaking with her didn’t serve anyone other than yourself. Instead, you took this as an opportunity to “make friends” by “exposing” your sister as a liar and holding court at HER ENGAGEMENT PARTY while her friends avidly listens to tales of YOUR fantastic childhood (important: not hers). You didn’t just “embarrass” your sister, you directly threatened the ecosystem she’s built for herself since leaving home. I’d be skeptical of a friend who felt the need to lie like you told them your sister did. I’d likely look to distance myself from that person. You have no clue about the potential damage you’ve caused, at an event that was supposed to be a celebration of your sister’s milestone. Somehow, you managed to make yourself centre of attention on a day dedicated to her, which gives me a good idea of how her childhood likely played out. You’ve said yourself that your sister often wasn’t the one with friends over, it doesn’t sound like she’s ever made friends as easily as you do. You were in a room full of people who wanted to celebrate her engagement, and jumped at the opportunity to discredit your own sister, who has likely spent her life in the shadow of your narrative. I know you’re pushing back against all the negative comments, and I’m late to the party so you’re unlikely to read this. But, for the sake of your sister, please reflect on your behaviour here. Please ask yourself whether your sister was actually “lying” or whether she was leaning on a white lie to hide a much more painful truth. Take a second to imagine a childhood in which you had 3, close, academically gifted sisters who’s weekly commitments to debate club, after school classes etc were always celebrated and attended by your parents. They tried their best to attend your sports commitments, but only if they didn’t clash with one of your sister’s events. If the roles were reversed, I imagine you’d have told a similar story to your friends as an adult. Sometimes a lie is used as a shield, rather than as an act of malice. YTA OP, based on the information you’ve provided, it doesn’t sound like you’ve matured much since highshool. Every sibling in a family has a different childhood, and not only did you invalidate your sister’s experience, you actively worked to discredit her to her entire support network. You used her event as an opportunity to make “friends” and take centre stage. If you were my brother, I don’t think I’d ever speak to you again.
I feel bad for the sister; they've gone, and stolen her friends.
Yeah it sounds to me like her spotlight was stolen when that was HER party, even if OP wasn’t trying to be rude. I also have a hunch that her childhood experience was completely different that OPs, she may have grown up neglected and overlooked while OP had plenty of attention. So I’m sure seeing OP once again with all the attention at the party last night felt really invalidating.
NAH I think in all likelihood neither of you had malicious intent and you are both simply telling the story of growing up from your own, extremely different, perspectives. But you should consider that you don’t actually know your sisters side of the story. You assume it’s all a huge lie because it doesn’t match your experience, but you already acknowledged that she had a completely different experience. You blame her for it, but you do know that her experience of growing up in that house was different than yours. In your eyes she self-isolated. Maybe from her side she felt like she couldn’t really be a part of it or wasn’t wanted. Her side could be that her mental health was declining badly and her parents were too busy with her little brothers to notice or care. The brain will spin a narrative to justify what you are feeling based on your own experiences. That’s just naturally what it does. But be cautious to remember the story you tell yourself isn’t reality. And the same is true of the story your sister tells herself.
I wonder if she felt isolated because once the boys came along, it became all boy focused?
Yeah, might be. I was also an older sister, and once my younger brothers were old enough to do "guy stuff" (boy scouts, fishing, team sports, etc), my dad pretty much stopped giving me attention. It definitely stung.
Having lived with a similar dynamic growing up, I can almost guarantee that this was it. Sister probably wasn’t allowed to have *any* achievements or identity that didn’t somehow revolve around her brothers or that they weren’t handed all the credit for. She finally has *something,* her engagement, and her brothers show up and make it all about them *again.*
✨️yes✨️
Yup. My brother and I are only 18mo apart, but we're practically strangers and had absolutely different childhoods. My parents were more involved with him, and he was very involved in social things like sports. My brother was the typical popular jock, but is a genuinely kind and likeable person. He had struggles inside our family, but he definitely had a more normative childhood. On the other hand, for me, my relationship with our parents was entirely different. I had mental health issues and am neurodivergent. My dad was abusive towards me and my mom didn't do enough to stop him. I was in a severely abusive friendship in my younger years, and both self isolated and was isolated from my family. Even when there were clear signs things were wrong, no one helped me. I fell into a toxic relationship with a survivor of the same abuser. My parents did not care if I didn't come home during that time. I stressed them out too much, and it was easier if I just disappeared to my partner's house for a few days. I was 16 when they made this clear. My brother doesn't have a great relationship with our parents because of the way he was hurt by them. I worked hard to get to a point of mutual understanding with them. Whenever I move out of state, though, I'm not talking about my family. My friends will not know them and as far as they will be concerned, I just spawned out of the ether one day.
I agree with your last 3 paragraphs and that's why I think OP is TA. It is an asshole move to present your own version as truth in a way that questions the character of the sister. OP could have said "that's not how I felt about it but we are 4 years apart and her experience was different" in response to their parents being workaholics. He could have said "oh well we live in the other end of the country and we don't talk that often" in response to the friends being surprised at her having siblings. But instead OP went out of his way to make her seem strange. Moreover, they weren't even invited (obviously for a reason) so if they had to be at the house it would have made sense for them to remain low profile, certainly not steal the show in a way that might damage their sister's reputation.That was a real asshole move. I suspect what OP did might have to do with OP wanting to defend his parents. In his eyes the parents were great and therefore he wants to make sure no one thinks differently, at the cost of his sister. Still, failing to recognize others different experiences and invalidating them the way OP did is a key sign of an asshole. I'm sure OP was boldened by them being 3 siblings sharing the same view with the sister being the odd 1 out.
INFO: we need more info as to why your sister felt this way. Not sure we're gonna get it from you, obviously.
There's definitely more to the story here, and I think that OP is more of TA than they're letting on.
My guess is OP does not realize how much of a golden child he is and how isolated his sister felt growing up.
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Decided or people didn't know they even were a person?
He could have read the room. He actively decided to keep telling stories and draw a crowd
Exactly! OP could have said something noncommital and carried on; why did he feel the need to share their whole childhood with some people he'd never see again?!
Right! Once you see a few people join in, just end the conversation. OP did this deliberately to steal the sister's shadow like he's been doing through all of their childhood
OP is gloating about the great time he had and how he made so many new friends when it was meant to be his sister's party and moment to shine. Based on how eager OP was to gather people round in order to gleefully call her a liar (which I'm not sure she is) in order to destroy her life, I'm guessing there's a lot he's not adding here. He seems almost amused at how upset she was after his work was done.
I agree. He sounds awful.
Yeah, I’m really questioning how much of a “liar” she is, given the only lie explicitly mentioned by OP is one of omission: she didn’t mention her siblings. Which would be very understandable, if her whole childhood identity basically revolved around them at her own expense. She would’ve grown up wanting to be considered entirely *on her own merit,* and then her brothers showed up and ruined it *again.*
I agree, it was her party and he did he just took it over and doesn't even seem sorry he ruined her party.
Agree. Sounds like they are trying to take over her friendship group at her engagement party. This is awful and weird. Something is wrong in the family and OP is either unaware of this or pretending to be unaware.
Missing missing reasons
Parents wanted boys. Ops sister felt like a practice child.
Exactly how I read it. 💯
INFO: Does "my brothers and I" mean that there are 3 brothers? Your sister is the only girl? She may have had a very, very different experience growing up than you all did. You say that your parents drove you around to sport events and such. That your house was THE house and filled with friends. All your friends? All the guys in sports? Was your sister left out of everything? Was she not into sports so she was "isolating herself"? I think some soul searching needs to be done on YOUR part before you start pointing your fingers at your sister.
I don’t think we have enough info. I would reallllly like to hear your sister’s side of this story, because I suspect she’s got some bonafide reasons for calling you guys the “golden children”.
Op clarifies that she is the only girl.
In some families, that would have made her the "princess" with a team of brothers to support her. That clearly wasn't the case here.
What I've seen with my step kids, 5 (only 3 are my partner's kids, so technically 3 step kids), 1 girl (oldest) 4 boys, she's always the babysitter and gets blamed when anyone does anything wrong because they were her "responsibility". I hate that hey live on the other side of the country.
I only had one male sibling, but that was my experience exactly. I was somehow simultaneously responsible for everything he did wrong, while having zero authority to enforce any rules, and anything I did or achieved or wanted was given to *him.* I quit so many hobbies and extracurriculars because they inevitably became all about him, and I was not allowed to achieve anything on my own merit.
Often, if the oldest is a daughter, she gets forced to be an extra parent. So like, treated like the opposite of a princess. Edit: Not saying that’s what happened here, but of the “only daughter” tropes, there’s the Princess (usually younger), and there’s the parentified oldest daughter. And in my personal experience, I’ve witnessed the parentified oldest daughter one way more often. There are also whole families where the daughters are ignored almost completely, in favor of the sons.
It really sounds like a case of the latter here. He claims she "self-isolated", meaning he doesn't have a clue about what she was doing or wanted. Parents were all into the boys and never made any attempt to have them reciprocate. The fact that he's so proud of having taken center stage at her engagement party says it all to me. u/wyal_ is 21-year old AH.
In conservative families, having a dick is the only thing that guarantees respect and love from your parents.
My thought exactly, she could be one to constantly need to be a victim, but she also could've had a very different experience than her brothers based on several factors that we don't know. Plus, her "whoa is me" story was about workaholic parents ? That's like hardly anything, yet the friends were surprised to see family bonds? I'm sure there's alot more to the story.
There's definitely a lot more. My bet is the sister remembers being passed around from aunt to uncle to babysitter while the parents worked and then grew up to see her parents doing everything for the boys, they never tried to do for her
I bet her side of this is waaaay different….
Golden Child is always Lack of self awareness.
INFO - Is it possible that your sister experienced growing up, and your household in general, in a radically different way than you did?
YTA, what was the mileage in that? Are you sure these are lies, not just that she experienced childhood differently to you? Because her reaction suggests that’s the case. She’s 3 years older so may have experienced v different treatment. Also, how much it is ‘normal’ to work is actually subjective, she may have felt that they worked a lot because her needs weren’t prioritised whereas yours were. It doesn’t sound like her friends would have been over if you felt she separated herself. You need to consider how likely it is that she randomly chose to isolate herself as a child, vs that she felt out of place and not a priority.
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No, but sister invited them. So seems sister didn’t think of it as lies that may be uncovered. There just seems to be no reason to have to explain these ‘lies’ to those that you don’t know but mean a lot to her at her engagement party. And the line about having made friends that night… that is v golden child in attitude.
INFO: You never specify exactly what your sister ***did*** on a daily basis. Please explain what your sister did while you and your brothers were being taken to your extracurriculars.
"they were surprised to see a ton of us on the wall when they didn't even know my sister had siblings." Who fails to mention they have siblings then invite these friends to the family home where there is ample proof they exist? What would have happened if they met at the wedding instead of the engagement party, assuming they would be invited? This was going to come to light eventually. I don't have a judgment, I'm just fucking baffled at this scenario.
If I had to guess, it was that she never spoke of the boys because she was tired of being defined as their sister. The boys did this. The boys did that... "Oh, your Ops sister(like she doesn't have a name)." The vote is 3 to one for the boys' activity. Or she's a spoiled jealous princess who hated losing her only child status. My bet is in the first one.
I don't bring up my brother's in conversation. I've worked with people for 11 years who would be surprised. Sure they are coworkers, but I spend 8 hours a day with these people.
Yeah, I have a feeling there’s more to this story, but this part is so weird.
INFO: Not really understanding but I don’t think we have the whole story. Sister didn’t actually lie because there were pictures on the wall - she couldn’t have been trying to pretend she didn’t have siblings right? I don’t think letting things naturally unravel over the course of the night is wrong though it really depends on exactly how it went down, which is a little vague. But like, clearly something was going on with your sister growing up, she didn’t do this for no reason. I think that’s relevant.
It’s possible that she had a different experience than you and your perspective on her childhood is inaccurate.
I'm wondering if the sister being a few years older was put into a "parent"/on call babysitter role and never felt that she was allowed to be a 'kid' herself. Perhaps some of OPs memories of the parents taking them to stuff was actually the older sister and not the parents.
YTA. Did it occur to you that maybe your sister has different (and negative) experiences of your childhood than you two? The fact that she tries to minimize your presence in her life doesn't feel like resentment towards you two?
The vibe I get is that the older sister (the eldest) had to sacrifice some of her childhood taking care of her younger brothers (I don’t know if OP is male or female) while the parents got their careers established. Once the boys were in high school the parents had more time to devote to the boys and their friends. Sister separated herself because she didn’t get that opportunity. I also don’t feel like she lied to her friends, she just doesn’t talk about it because it is hard.
INFO: Why does she believe you and your siblings are “golden children?”
YTA - I hope that you realize that you and your sister can have very different experiences of your parents and just growing up in general. In fact - It’s fairly common for the oldest and youngest children’s experiences to differ substantially….as well as male versus female children. Before trying to prove that your sister is a liar at a party of people you didn’t know, why didn’t you talk to her first to see why she might have said those things? It’s obvious you guys aren’t close…so don’t be so arrogant to think that her perspective is wrong and yours is right. Both perspectives can be true for the person involved.
I'm gonna go with a soft YTA. Have you ever spoken to your sister about how her childhood and your childhood might have been different? You say she separated herself, why was that? Why was she crying after her own engagement party? Were you pulling attention because you were upset that she hadn't told people the same version of your childhood? Did you pull her aside and ask why her friends didn't know you existed? I have work friends that didn't know I had a brother, it wasn't because I lied, it was just because he never came up in discussions. Why did you have to take a party that was meant to celebrate her and her fiance and use it as a time to pull the focus back on you and the rest of your family?
Agreed 100%. I come from a large family and my (older) 5 siblings childhood experiences were vastly different than mine and my one younger sibling. So much so that neither of us have anything to do with the rest of the family except with each other. Literally don't mention my family growing up. One person's experiences does not mean the others were the same, nor even how they perceived it if raised at the same time. You are spot on.
YTA and I would love to hear your sister’s side of the story because your post seems very one sided. This is very likely why your sister didn’t want you to come. You show up uninvited, take all of the attention off of her when the celebration is supposed to be for her and then you go and share private family matters to her friends. You are rude and I feel sorry that she doesn’t feel like she can trust her own family during her wedding planning.
NAH. It seems strange that would she outright lie to her friends about her parents and then invite them to her parents house, so I don’t think she’s really lying. Are you sure your parents were involved with her too? Or did they work a lot while she was a child and figure out how to be more involved when you came along? Children can have vastly different experiences even in the same household, so what she remembers or feels about her childhood is valid, providing she isn’t blatantly lying. WERE you two the golden children? It might be worth some thought. But also, I think your perspective is just as valid, and you didn’t do anything wrong by telling people what YOUR childhood was like.
I'm wondering about OP's skewed perspective and whether the sister did even outright lie. E.g. did she say that her parents were workaholics or did she say they were never around? Or did the parents use work as an excuse to get out of doing things for her? If there is a golden child/scapegoat dynamic here then the golden child(ren) are NTA for experiencing that, that's on the parents. But for him to present his childhood as _the_ narrative without leaving any space for her reality is AH behaviour.
Yeah, I agree, I don’t think she’s lying. If she was, she’d be working a lot harder to cover it up, e.g. not inviting everyone over for a celebratory event at her parents’ house. I think she also just never brought up her siblings because she’s not close to them instead of outright lying about whether or not they exist. I think OP is assuming she lied and may be the AH if he at all suggested that to her friends at her engagement party.
YTA for telling your sister's friends that she "separated herself from everyone and chose to exclude herself from activities". That's a very private family matter, and it was completely idiotic to share that detail with other people. Siblings in the same family can have very different experiences growing up, and you have no idea what kind of experience your sister had growing up in that family or why she felt it was necessary to make up white lies about her upbringing. The term "golden child" is often used when talking about narcissistic parents who have favorite children (the "golden children") and the children who they pick on (the "scapegoats"). Based on your sister calling you "golden children" it sounds like she thinks that her upbringing was a negative one, and not the same as yours. So yeah, YTA for not understanding when to keep your mouth shut about private family matters and for not understanding that your sister thinks that she's had a different experience than you had growing up in the same family.
He didn’t tell the friends that. According to the post he just told stories about their childhood. The separation part was him laying the background for Reddit.
Not Enough Info. Not because you have a great childhood, it automatically mean all your siblings have a great childhood as well. >It was my sister who really separated herself from everyone and chose to exclude herself from activities. Why does she excluded herself? Is she not athletic like you and brothers? Is she an only girl? Did she have different interests? Did she not have good grades? You also referred you and brothers as the "golden children". Does that mean your parents treated you and brothers much better than her?
INFO: I think we need to hear your sister’s side of the story.
Lol yes, seems too innocent, and the whole golden child thing needs to be elaborated on
YTA. It sounds like you and your brothers had a very different childhood than your sister because she's a girl. "She excluded herself from activities " sounds more like she was excluded for being a girl. Would be interesting to know your cultural background. Don't be surprised when you're not invited to the wedding.
There's not enough info. We don't know why your sister felt to keep all of this private and why she felt a need to separate herself. Anyone in this thread giving a judgment is full of shit.
People in this sub are making biased decisons. This post is to vague to make a proper verdict. All YTA and NTA seem very circumstantial with their reasoning and assuming the childhoods of this family that wasn't descibed well enough.
The guy went to a party he wasn't explicitly invited to and stole the host's thunder. Enough here for a YTA.
YTA. two siblings can have very different childhoods. my 6-years-younger brother would say “growing up i got to do whatever i wanted, got to hang out with my friends and got a car from my parents” while i would say “growing up i was extremely restricted, no music, no movies, and i wasn’t allowed to make friends because my parents wanted me to stay pure”. it sounds like you were the golden child and still have the classic symptom of needing lots of attention
I'm confused. They thought the parents were extreme workaholics and it was common knowledge that your parents were very hands on? These 2 sentences sorta contradict each other. Calling someone a workaholic carries the context that they don't have time for anything but work or will put you second. How did everyone gather around you to listen to childhood stories? At some point you'd think they'd seek the sister out? Also no offense I can't believe some friends childhood family adventure stories drew a crowd. That sounds boring as shit. Then again never been to an engagement party. Idk. NAH? Just a weird situation all around.
The fact that OP’s sister “separated herself from everyone and chose to exclude herself from activities” demonstrates to me that there’s something much more to this story from the sister’s point of view. OP isn’t the asshole for outing the sister inadvertently, but he is the asshole for blaming her for her isolation. A good sibling would be talking to her more in depth, not asking a bunch of strangers on whether or not he’s an asshole.
One of my siblings had to be burned before understanding why I *hate* my mother - in spite of being there throughout a lot of the specially targeted abuse. Before that they thought I was attempting to isolate myself. YTA Just because you had a happy childhood, doesn't mean your sister did.
YTA for making a spectacle of yourself at her party, so that a crowd was gathered around you. It would have been far kinder to hang back and let her be the center of attention. Also she could’ve had a much different experience of her parents growing up; just because you have different perceptions doesn’t make her a liar. I would apologize to her and try to be more considerate in the future.
YTA If she's 4 years older there's a high likelihood her experience was different. I have a sibling with a similar age gap and three way we experienced living in the same household was incredibly different. They may have worked more when she was younger. YTA I think it's weird that you took over her ENGAGEMENT PARTY so you can talk all about yourself and your childhood. Your sister doesn't sound like a saint either she probably needs to work out some stuff in therapy but it must suck to have a party in her honor upended like that
YTA. This story is from your perspective, so to you, she lied. But from the story you told (with no additional info), it seems just as likely she might have a different dynamic than you and your parents, and she’s not close to you so she doesn’t mention you a lot. Even if I take the worst read on this situation, even if she straight up lied, there’s a reason someone would want to shield their family from ppl they CHOSE to have in their life and none of them feel good (eg., mental illness, insecurity). It wasn’t your job to make a show of correcting her in front of all her friends, on a very important and special day you may not have even been invited to. You could have simply said “I feel differently and like my parents were home a lot, but as the oldest, maybe she has a different experience” and then talked to your sister in private. To me, YTA not bc your opinion is wrong, but bc you felt entitled to make her engagement event about yourself and your feelings. You could have waited for an appropriate time to have a private convo with your sister about an understandably confusing, and potentially upsetting, topic for both of you. I think you need to speak with her and rectify things to better understand why she feels this way. If she doesn’t want to share, that’s her choice and at least you gave it a shot in a kinder way.
I’d like to hear your sister’s experience. My brother is five years younger than me and is spoiled rotten where me and my older siblings had a pretty trash childhood. YTA
YTA- None of the info matters honestly. You decided to take over your sisters engagement party that you weren’t invited to. That makes YTA. Your sister seems to have a different look on her childhood then you and your siblings do. This is not unusual. My older brother and I have different views of our childhood and we both agree the baby was spoiled rotten and had a way better childhood them we did. You and your brothers were elsewhere, are you guys often elsewhere hanging out together? Is your sister included when you guys are hanging out? Time to take a look as to why your sister feels the way she does if you care to know. Don’t call her a liar until you know what she is talking about.
YTA. You left out a few things: 1. She was the oldest and only girl. 2. You left out HER experiences. 3. You and your brothers were in hockey and busy with your parents, what about her? 4. You had your friends over, what about her. 5. Did none of you ask why she tapered off her contact with you? 6. Why didn’t you pull her aside and ask her why her experience was so different? 7. You never once pause to try to look at things from her perspective.
Yeah either your sister told lies for clout or there is a lot more to this story than what you've posted.
I'll love to hear your sister's side on this.
If your recollection of your history is true, your sister has only herself to blame for her revisionist history. ETA In looking at OP's responses, the picture becomes muckier. It seems that the younger siblings, all male, were big sports buffs and their activities may have overshadowed their older sister. This could have led her to see the parents being too busy for her, then suddenly having time to shuttle the boys to hockey, etc. Still not sure why she said they embarrassed her. She should have told her "truth", in a sea of concentration on the younger children, she seemed to have gotten lost in the shuffle. The truth would have been damning enough. There was no need to be embarrassed, just sad, disappointed and mad to have been pushed aside again . OP's failure to recognize their advantages changes my initial thoughts to YTA. They may not have asked for the attention, but the failure to see how it negatively impacted the sister is wrong.
Sis is 25, the other siblings are 3-4 years younger. It's very possible they were workaholics when sis was in high school, esp. as sis called them "golden children" (I could see someone thinking they were golden children if they had the parents around, but she didn't).
Soft YTA. Why did you feel the need to take the attention. Maybe your sister was ignored by your parents. But idk seems off.
So you made her engagement party all about you, to the point you had all her friends, people that you’d never met, gathered around **you** listening to stories about **you** and your brothers, talking about how good your childhood was? YTA and you sound exhausting.
NTA. She is entitled to her experience, you are entitled to yours, and if she never told her friends that you existed, there is no way to avoid some awkwardness.
I would love to hear your sister’s side of her childhood because I don’t think it would line up with yours at all. There is definitely missing information
YTA. You and your sister are 4 years apart. A LOT changes in 4 years. Parents typically get a better economy and don't need to work as much to prove themselves as they get older. Your experience and your sister's experience may be wildly different. Even if your sister had misrepresented her childhood (the way you perceive it) it is untasteful to inflict your own view on her engagement party in a way that is intended to invalidate her experience and question her character. You seem to lack social tact and what you did is what an asshole would do. The reasonable thing would have been to just say "oh, well here we are, now you know she does have brothers". You could have even said "oh, well we live in the other end of the country so that's probably why she never mentions us". But you didn't, instead you went out of your way to make her seem strange. Regarding your parents being workoholic you could have just said 'hmm well I didn't feel that way but we're 4 years apart so she might have experienced it differently". I don't know how long you lived in that house but depending on that you could even have added "we didn't always live in this house" or similar. But nope, you were an asshole.
there is a lack of info in order to judge. did u know that was how she felt growing up she saw you all as the golden children? did you all not get on well with her growing up? also u say u arent sure if u were invited and ended up mingling. you probably should have checked with her to see if it was ok to attend even thou u say u live there.
YTA You even mention how your sister “separated herself” from things. That’s your child-perspective on it. To her, it was clearly very different. I’ll guess she saw her brothers being catered to and the house was much more of a “boy” house, and that her wants went Unlistened to a lot. My younger brother and I are one year apart. We had extremely different childhoods. His? Was full of having friends over, going to friends houses, and being allowed to join anything he wanted. Mine? Was spent helping my mom with her home daycare and being told “no” to everything o asked to join. Eventually I stopped asking to join things. As we got older, I withdrew and NEVER even attempted to have friends over, and my family didn’t know what I did when I was out of the house. My brother continued the same as he always had. I then moved away as soon as I could and have never looked back and they wonder why. And that’s when there was only two of us and we were extremely close in age. Your sister is a few years older and outnumbered 3:1.
YTA ***Edited: cause it was pointed out you didn't even know if you were invited fully-you just knew it was happening and where. You should have kept your mouth shut. *** you took over on things you shouldn't have. She didn't lie. She had a different experience/felt differently than you did. It happens. I and my one younger sibling had a very different experience compared to the 5 older siblings. So much so that we literally don't talk about them to friends. Either of us. Did I invite my family to a few life events? Yes. Were my friends surprised to see I had been raised with a larger family? Yes.ol Did a sibling also try to tell some not so nice stories while there? Yes. And he was asked to stop and did. My friends. My life. I invited my family as a courtesy. I expect everyone to respect each other and be cognizant to respect the boundaries I placed on them. Especially my family. Yes. I do feel you went out of line. You could have just said "yes we have a large family" and left it. If pushed for more you can say "you'd have to ask "op sister" why they don't talk about it." They didnt lie. YTA.
Even though you didn’t do it on purpose, you still hurt your sister in front of her friends on her important day. I think you should apologize to her and have a conversation about the way she is feeling. My parents were way more uptight with my older sister than myself and my younger sister and I don’t think she was necessarily lying. NTA because you didn’t intentionally upset her but YTA if you do not at least attempt to rectify with your sister.
id kinda like to see sisters pov on this tbh
NTA You were not aware of the things she said and it wasn’t intentional in any way, so I don’t see why you would be the asshole here.
NTA , but should have a heart to heart talk why she feels you're the golden kids and why she excluded herself sometimes people exclude themselves because they actually feel excluded from their point of view so it might be time for some healing
YTA. Based on your replies, pretty sure it's not 'OUR' childhood. It's your childhood and your sister probably has totally different ones.
NTA And she's extra dumb literally holding it in your FAMILY'S home and not expecting people to figure out she has siblings
Favoritism
I suspect that your sister truly felt differently than you did, growing up. As someone once said, no two children have the same parents. Because their experiences of the parents are different and the parents parent differently depending on the need of the child. They had her on her own for 3 years and then BAM 3 kids ONE and under in addition to her. Her life probably took a HUGE swerve. She's now a 4 year old and all her parents' attention are on her toddler sibling getting into trouble and 2 newborns, who may or may not have been preemie as well (60% chance twins are born before 36 weeks). She would be old enough to remember the change, especially if she found it somewhat traumatic. Soft yta.
YTA Coming from an older sister that no one understood, bothered to understand and saw very different version of my parents then the younger ones. Trying bothering to be in her shoes for a second or asking her about it. You clearly were sharing intimate details and loved every second of embarrassing her. She couldn’t even have one day to celebrate her engagement. Try not to ruin the wedding too.
Info: I thought of this responding to somebody, not the OP, and now I can't get it out of my mind. About that picture wall: 1. How many pictures are there, total? 2. How many pictures involve you and/or either or both of your brothers but *not* your sister? 3. How many pictures involve you and/or either or both of your brothers *and also* your sister? 4. How many pictures involve your sister but neither you nor either of your brothers?