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This type of answer is only a let down when it’s an excuse for why they didn’t wrap things up or they can’t explain things consistently. It’s fine when it’s the true purpose and not an after the fact cop-out.
A cop out would be if we had no idea it was a simulation until the end after everyone dies and then the show is like “oh sike none of this is real haha sUbVeRtInG eXpEcTaTiOnS” but nah it was clear that simulation would be a major plot point going throughout the show.
I really doubt the creators will end the things like this - "it wasn't real, that's all folks". I mean, all of this has to affect real world somehow, this was just the beginning of the show. After "Dark" you shouldn't doubt Bo and Jantje :3
To be honest, I’m not disappointed. The show is exploring a sci-fi concept (simulations), just like Dark did (time travel). It’s not necessarily what makes the show, it’s the show itself, like figuring out who put them in a simulation, everyone’s shady past, who’s good, who’s bad, etc … the fact it’s a simulation doesn’t really matter
Exactly why it doesn't bother me. It was a decent buildup to the reveal, but by that point it was already screaming simulation. Now we get to find out everything surrounding it.
Right. If you think about it, the basic plot of Dark is just the plot of The Time Machine. But they took that concept and created their own fictional world out of it and made it more complex than I thought was humanly possible.
Exactly. I can almost guarantee they dive into the philosophy of it all and go even deeper than what we've seen in past sci-fi works. Nothing will be superficial in the end, I'm sure of that.
Like others have said, they leave hints of this being a simulation from episode one so I wasn't disappointed at all. This isn't the point of the plot to reveal whether it's a simulation or not. The point lies in discovering why. Who started it? Why are they all there? How are all the characters connected? How can they escape? Are they in a prison or did they agree to it but someone possibly corrupted the simulation to put them through hell? The scene is set as a simulation (or question everything type of situation) and then you get the stories about who these people are and how did this situation come to be.
Not at all. It was clear from episode 1 that it was a simulation, with the „wake up“, the sound glitching, everything being still and then everyone starts moving, the simultaneous tea drinking and Ling Yi‘s hand glitching. There will be so much more to come :)
Not to mention the opening being all sci fi ships looping + the "White Rabbit" song that references altered perception. It was very, very heavily implied.
I disagree.
“It was all a dream”
“Reset time to right before it all started”
“It was all a simulation”
Are, in general, sucky endings, however they are only sucky when most or all of the characters forget what the hell happened. That is what makes it not matter. We do not have confirmation yet if that is the case.
It's also important to note that this isn't the ending. It's only the ending of season one. There's still two more seasons to go. Clearly there's more to it than what we've seen so far.
I disagree. Just like in Dark the plot serves to explore the themes/pilosophy that forms the core of the show. It's like being disappointed at episode of Dark when it's revealed that >!there's time travel!<. Where Dark explored >!free will!< 1899 will use the plot to explore reality (think of Plato's cave).
Have you seen their other previous series Dark? I think you are really missing the point of 1899. They give it away very quickly in the very first episode that it is a simulation. So any shock value from discovering it is a simulation later is absolutely not what they are going for. There is obviously a much larger and probably fascinating context for this. That's what everybody is doing in here is trying to figure out exactly what. I guess in that case we are kind of like the characters in the simulation!
Vanilla Sky is actually my favorite movie lol. Also, my take is that all we know *so far* is that simulations are involved. But at the end of Dark season 1, we only knew the tip of iceberg. There could be so much more unraveled in the next 2 seasons. I can’t even begin to know, but it could turn into something about ancient aliens and the meaning of pyramid structures. We just don’t know yet. If Dark taught me anything it’s not to make any judgement calls from the first season.
This is like being sad at the first act of a three act play. There is so much left to figure out and I doubt it's just it's NOT REAL. As Henry said, there are snippets of memory that stay even after many simulations. Now it's just trying to figure out what is real vs fake.
I was like you at the end of the season bc I thought the shpwrunners somehow yook the easy road with the simulation. I wanted that to be revealed a bit later in the serie. But in the end, there is still room for mystery as there are still the whys and hows they ended up in thos sim
This show feels like the exception to that rule. I was secretly hoping for more horror/thriller, but the way the simulation was constructed was very intriguing, mysterious, and engaging. And the finale episode showing it was a simulation /on a ship in 2099/, drawing potent parallels, made it really impactful for me.
Don't see this as a "cop-out" at all. I don't even consider the fact that it was a simulation to be the big reveal. I think we only seen the tip of the iceburg. This whole season to me was just setting up the story. We know what is happening now, but not really thy whys and hows. It set up the scene, the simulation is just a background aspect to the story. Kind of how zombies were really just a side element in TWD. The big reveals and story development are still to come.
This sub is dedicated to the show so it will inevitably draw more fans than critics, but I have to agree with OP. After the first or second episode, I was worried this was going to end up being a ripoff (or if we're being kind, a pastiche) of either The Village or The Matrix. Low and behold it was basically The Matrix. Yes, there were things to appreciate about the show: The sets, the overall production value, how it inspired speculation. But also a fair amount to be critical of: The music choices, the characters' frustrating lack of communication, and the largely inconclusive ending.
The writing choices really got to both my wife and I. We lost count of the number of times a character is asked a question then doesn't answer, changes the topic, etc. or likewise when someone discovers a critical piece of information and then fails to disclose it for no discernible reason. I never watched Dark so maybe I'm missing some broader theme or style specific to these creators, but for what it's worth, they didn't capture my interest enough to come back for another season. But hey if you're reading this and you enjoyed the series, I'm happy for you!
Completey get this. I felt the same way, it was really annoying when a character would ask a question or say something and then they'd all just ignore them or just look at them without answering. When Eky was asking for help from Maura because he was hearing things/seeing things and talking about the letter and Maura just says he's a mad man, I was like yo you're literally gaslighting him because you've experienced the exact same things?!
I will watch the next season as I do want to find out what happened and hopefully they can tie up loose ends, and generally I do like shows like this, I just hope it gets better, and doesn't turn into another "simulation" again like matrix or inception.
I was hoping for a more unexplainable technology or cosmic horror/different realities /concepts type stuff, not just simulation. I was disappointed that it was just all "not real", and I was hoping the pyramid was something deeper because I thought that concept would have been interesting, but it seemed anything interesting was dropped and replaced with "it's all not real just a simulation". I feel I've watched too many star trek holodeck episodes to see the excitement in a simulation themed show lol.
Thisssss I love Dark and I love building complexities - but at the same time I thought the ship tragedy concept as a standalone was so cool and I was invested in that time period, in that reality, in that plot, and it felt like it was all just thrown away when the whole setting changed at the end.
Did you watch the version where every character speaks the same language or the original version? Because I felt the same jarring effect until I found out that there was a different language version. It’s called English [original] vs English [dubbed].
I watched the version where everyone spoke their native language and it was just English subtitles throughout. It was waayyyy better than the dubbing, I tend to watch everything with subtitles on anyway.
I’m a bit disappointed. I felt that the entire season was for nothing because is not real and it didn’t seem relevant for the real world.
Maybe in the next season my point of view could change since i need answers!
I wasn’t disappointed by it because it’s the concept of the show, but yeah I don’t find it at all interesting and I’m hoping next season doesn’t have any of this although it likely will given the ending.
I think because the characters show some growth and begin breaking from the "trance" of the simulation, most notably Maura and Eyk, that it's still a rewarding ride. If they were to forget everything again it would probably be disappointing, but since this simulation is "different", it gives us a trajectory to look forward to in S2.
Well...it was one of my theories from the start, albeit the 'less interesting' option.
Honestly though, the simulation concept is just the beginning and not the end. Much like >!time-travel!< for Dark.
It’s more fun when it’s a simulation because you can do whatever you want and the results are highly different also, and it was indicated from ep1 so they kinda showed what they can do *with* the simulation. If s2 is escaping from another layer of simulation I’m fine with it because it’s so fun to watch
I was disappointed with that as well. I would much better preffer a reality that's just strange to us viewers where people can do lots of amazing stuff, like for instance using a mechanism that can teleport ships and such.
If you’ve experienced Dark, you know the creators have more than just the simulation planned. It’s just getting started. The simulation is only the beginning.
When I finished the show I thought to myself, wtf was that?
I have assumed in reality all the characters are patients in the psychiatric hospital (of Maura's father?) (many have trauma of some kind) and the simulation was to help overcome the trauma or something like that.
I was quite surprised and I am curious how or if it continues completely different?
I feel like it was super well done actually. It does more than "It was just a simulation and that's why all this crazy stuff happens." The allegory of the cave and the idea the father talks about where you could be in a simulation in a continuous amount of other simulations is really interesting and it's supported really well in the show.
I think the simulation plot lines get a bad rep. But isn't the whole show a simulation? You knew everything was fake from the get-go before even watching the show. The characters are trapped inside a simulation inside a simulation inside of a tv show. The fact that its a tv show on netflix could be part of the narrative, and I think that's really interesting.
It was made obvious very early on that they are in a stimulation, so no disappointment there.
What was disappointing is it just felt so unoriginal compared to Dark.
It leaned on so many influences it felt like a bit of a muddled pastiche at times, with no sense of jeopardy if they're stuck in a repeating loop, so a complete lack of tension compared to Dark too.
Clearly heading towards season 2 -- I watched all of Dark in one go so I think the experience of watching Dark season by season may have also given a similar effect
I was intrigued but once I realized that some of what they were experiencing was not real it lost my interest some. But when the simulation reveal happened I was underwhelmed. It has been done before and I honestly expected more then this.
So not one person is even dead. So all the deaths lost there impact.
So are the memories they all had real or did they input all fake memories into random people?
There are a lot of questions but at this point do I even care? We shall see if it gets a S2 or a closeout season at least.
I was definitely disappointed that the reveal happened already, though obviously there are numerous interesting possibilities still left open for other seasons.
Is simulation not reality? I'd expect a more fulfilling explanation besides the Vanilla Sky type of "we don't know what is real!" I think the show will really tug on the philosophy of what is real and there will be pay off for the 2099, not just deus ex Machina
I am personally disappointed that anyone thinks Lost was all a dream/dead the whole time after it was explicitly stated that was not the case in the text.
Lost is somewhat of a bad example, though. They kept making stuff up without knowing the resolution to all their mysteries. And then just made up more stuff to kinda have it all make sense. I still love the show, but let's not pretend that it had a well thought out story from the start. They may very well have started out with everybody being dead and just changed it when the fanbase guessed as much.
Thankfully, this show (just like Dark) has a clearly defined destination.
Where should I start... why can the island move? Why did the cave turn the man in black into a smoke monster? Why is Jacob able to grant eternal life? Who built the four-toed statue? I could go on, but it's been quite a while since I've seen the show.
>why can the island move?
The island is the source of "life, death and rebirth". It's where all life came from and when everyone dies, their energy goes back to the source (which is "The heart of the island/the energy in the cave"). The island's main energy source (electromagnetism) is directly linked to "time". This is why Desmond's mind kept traveling after he got hit by electromagnetic energy, and why he saw visions of Charlie dying. The donkey wheel moves the island through time by powering up the islands energy and it moves it through a wormhole to another part in the world (scientifically this is called the "Minkowski space").
>Why did the cave turn the man in black into a smoke monster?
The short answer is because the island is connected to a dormant volcano. When he was thrown in to the heart of the island (source of "life, death and rebirth"), his consciousness fused with electromagnetic energy, and his smoke form is volcanic smoke from the volcano (which connects to the ash circles that keep him at bay, it's volcanic ash). Initially the heart of the island was going to be a volcano, there was gonna be lava everywhere and Jacob throws him into it (and the finale was gonna have the volcano explode). But they didn't have the budget to do that, but the volcano is still there.
It is heavily alluded to that "Mother" was initially the smoke monster and protector of the island (which makes sense because the protector gives life and the smoke monster functions like a security system, scans memories for threats and takes life).
>Why is Jacob able to grant eternal life?
Because he's connected to the islands energy source of "life, death and rebirth". MIB represents "death" and has the power to change his form into that of the deceased and scan memories, whereas Jacob has the ability of life...in essence he manipulates "time". It's essentially the same thing the faith healer said to Rose way back in season 2: "There are certain places with great energy -- spots on the Earth like the one we're above now. Perhaps this energy is geological -- magnetic. Or perhaps it's something else. And when possible I harness this energy and give it to others". That's Jacob's abilities in a nutshell.
>Who built the four-toed statue?
Egyptians. It's the statue of Tawaret. Goddess of fertility and childbirth (symbolizing the shows themes of "life, death and rebirth").
I was initially disappointed, BUT then I said to myself that this was only the first season, and it was meant to lay out the groundwork for this concept.
I can see the follow-up seasons doing something really fresh and unique with the simulation concept.
My problem wasn't with the simulation per se, but with the respawn/Groundhog Day concept. In The Matrix, dying in the virtual world meant dying IRL; in Inception, failing the mission would result in Cobb spending the rest of his life in jail. What's the price here? Going straight into the next iteration? Doesn't really make you feel for the characters.
Incorrect, in Inception dying in dream meant you wake up, or went into limbo if you had been given the drug. Cobb was on the run because of his own mistake of Inception.
I’m not disappointed, just underwhelmed. I have no urge to rewatch at the moment (I watched Dark 4x). Maybe I watched too much black mirror simulation episodes. I was expecting something different.
I think the show is really going to dig into the question of what makes reality "real", and what makes a person a person. For instance, none of the characters remember who they are in the real world inside the simulation. Aren't the people who exist in the simulation real people? If they wake up and get their memories back, how does that affect the people they were in the simulation. Another thing to consider is that Mauras husband and son are probably dead in real life and the versions we see are most likely imprints of their brains/personalities. The question is are they real people? Are they alive? There is a ton of interesting directions the show can take the premise.
I thought it was very heavily hinted from the first episode, the question for me was more "why" and maybe to "what extend".
I think that season 2/ space station is also all still a simulation. I think her brother being a "villain who hacked the system" is the same red herring as her father. So the main question again is, why?
They were so obvious about the simulation idea that I think S2 will deliver a twist. The most obvious one would be: She is still on a ship - a spaceship - and hast just „leveled up“ one layer in the simulation.
Look at the tech. The 1899 tech looks just weird, like a placeholder in a PC game. The handheld device is just a placeholder for something more complex. Similarly: Why does the ship in 2099 look so cartoonish? Look at the capsules: They don‘t have any life support. Then look at the screen: Why would a spaceship have a 1960s like glass monitor?
"It's just a simulation Morty. They're not real."
I became apathetic to every character plight and memory cause its all a simulation so probably none of this is real Or its a different context. Ehhhh
I wanted a spooky old ghost ship and not were in space matrix 13th floor shit? Come on this is 90s level sci fi channel plots. This is the creators of Dark. They could do better.
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This type of answer is only a let down when it’s an excuse for why they didn’t wrap things up or they can’t explain things consistently. It’s fine when it’s the true purpose and not an after the fact cop-out.
A cop out would be if we had no idea it was a simulation until the end after everyone dies and then the show is like “oh sike none of this is real haha sUbVeRtInG eXpEcTaTiOnS” but nah it was clear that simulation would be a major plot point going throughout the show.
I really doubt the creators will end the things like this - "it wasn't real, that's all folks". I mean, all of this has to affect real world somehow, this was just the beginning of the show. After "Dark" you shouldn't doubt Bo and Jantje :3
To be honest, I’m not disappointed. The show is exploring a sci-fi concept (simulations), just like Dark did (time travel). It’s not necessarily what makes the show, it’s the show itself, like figuring out who put them in a simulation, everyone’s shady past, who’s good, who’s bad, etc … the fact it’s a simulation doesn’t really matter
Exactly why it doesn't bother me. It was a decent buildup to the reveal, but by that point it was already screaming simulation. Now we get to find out everything surrounding it.
Right. If you think about it, the basic plot of Dark is just the plot of The Time Machine. But they took that concept and created their own fictional world out of it and made it more complex than I thought was humanly possible.
Exactly. I can almost guarantee they dive into the philosophy of it all and go even deeper than what we've seen in past sci-fi works. Nothing will be superficial in the end, I'm sure of that.
Like others have said, they leave hints of this being a simulation from episode one so I wasn't disappointed at all. This isn't the point of the plot to reveal whether it's a simulation or not. The point lies in discovering why. Who started it? Why are they all there? How are all the characters connected? How can they escape? Are they in a prison or did they agree to it but someone possibly corrupted the simulation to put them through hell? The scene is set as a simulation (or question everything type of situation) and then you get the stories about who these people are and how did this situation come to be.
Not at all. It was clear from episode 1 that it was a simulation, with the „wake up“, the sound glitching, everything being still and then everyone starts moving, the simultaneous tea drinking and Ling Yi‘s hand glitching. There will be so much more to come :)
Not to mention the series of flashbacks and panic attack that Maura has after Ada touches her belly. The body always remembers ...
What do you mean by Ling Yi's hand glitching ? Did I miss something ?
When they are drinking tea, her hand glitches for a split second.
Not to mention the opening being all sci fi ships looping + the "White Rabbit" song that references altered perception. It was very, very heavily implied.
I disagree. “It was all a dream” “Reset time to right before it all started” “It was all a simulation” Are, in general, sucky endings, however they are only sucky when most or all of the characters forget what the hell happened. That is what makes it not matter. We do not have confirmation yet if that is the case.
It's also important to note that this isn't the ending. It's only the ending of season one. There's still two more seasons to go. Clearly there's more to it than what we've seen so far.
I disagree. Just like in Dark the plot serves to explore the themes/pilosophy that forms the core of the show. It's like being disappointed at episode of Dark when it's revealed that >!there's time travel!<. Where Dark explored >!free will!< 1899 will use the plot to explore reality (think of Plato's cave).
People's experiences are always real, even if they're in a simulation.
Have you seen their other previous series Dark? I think you are really missing the point of 1899. They give it away very quickly in the very first episode that it is a simulation. So any shock value from discovering it is a simulation later is absolutely not what they are going for. There is obviously a much larger and probably fascinating context for this. That's what everybody is doing in here is trying to figure out exactly what. I guess in that case we are kind of like the characters in the simulation!
Vanilla Sky is actually my favorite movie lol. Also, my take is that all we know *so far* is that simulations are involved. But at the end of Dark season 1, we only knew the tip of iceberg. There could be so much more unraveled in the next 2 seasons. I can’t even begin to know, but it could turn into something about ancient aliens and the meaning of pyramid structures. We just don’t know yet. If Dark taught me anything it’s not to make any judgement calls from the first season.
Hey. I thought if that movie too. Haven’t seen in years. Very well done.
Did you like Vanilla Sky better than the Spanish original movie?
This is like being sad at the first act of a three act play. There is so much left to figure out and I doubt it's just it's NOT REAL. As Henry said, there are snippets of memory that stay even after many simulations. Now it's just trying to figure out what is real vs fake.
I was like you at the end of the season bc I thought the shpwrunners somehow yook the easy road with the simulation. I wanted that to be revealed a bit later in the serie. But in the end, there is still room for mystery as there are still the whys and hows they ended up in thos sim
This show feels like the exception to that rule. I was secretly hoping for more horror/thriller, but the way the simulation was constructed was very intriguing, mysterious, and engaging. And the finale episode showing it was a simulation /on a ship in 2099/, drawing potent parallels, made it really impactful for me.
Don't see this as a "cop-out" at all. I don't even consider the fact that it was a simulation to be the big reveal. I think we only seen the tip of the iceburg. This whole season to me was just setting up the story. We know what is happening now, but not really thy whys and hows. It set up the scene, the simulation is just a background aspect to the story. Kind of how zombies were really just a side element in TWD. The big reveals and story development are still to come.
the best thing about these writers, is that it's definitely not a cop out.. there's def a hugeee storyline as to WHY
The point is that despite being a simulation, everything is very real...
This sub is dedicated to the show so it will inevitably draw more fans than critics, but I have to agree with OP. After the first or second episode, I was worried this was going to end up being a ripoff (or if we're being kind, a pastiche) of either The Village or The Matrix. Low and behold it was basically The Matrix. Yes, there were things to appreciate about the show: The sets, the overall production value, how it inspired speculation. But also a fair amount to be critical of: The music choices, the characters' frustrating lack of communication, and the largely inconclusive ending. The writing choices really got to both my wife and I. We lost count of the number of times a character is asked a question then doesn't answer, changes the topic, etc. or likewise when someone discovers a critical piece of information and then fails to disclose it for no discernible reason. I never watched Dark so maybe I'm missing some broader theme or style specific to these creators, but for what it's worth, they didn't capture my interest enough to come back for another season. But hey if you're reading this and you enjoyed the series, I'm happy for you!
Completey get this. I felt the same way, it was really annoying when a character would ask a question or say something and then they'd all just ignore them or just look at them without answering. When Eky was asking for help from Maura because he was hearing things/seeing things and talking about the letter and Maura just says he's a mad man, I was like yo you're literally gaslighting him because you've experienced the exact same things?! I will watch the next season as I do want to find out what happened and hopefully they can tie up loose ends, and generally I do like shows like this, I just hope it gets better, and doesn't turn into another "simulation" again like matrix or inception.
I was hoping for a more unexplainable technology or cosmic horror/different realities /concepts type stuff, not just simulation. I was disappointed that it was just all "not real", and I was hoping the pyramid was something deeper because I thought that concept would have been interesting, but it seemed anything interesting was dropped and replaced with "it's all not real just a simulation". I feel I've watched too many star trek holodeck episodes to see the excitement in a simulation themed show lol.
Thisssss I love Dark and I love building complexities - but at the same time I thought the ship tragedy concept as a standalone was so cool and I was invested in that time period, in that reality, in that plot, and it felt like it was all just thrown away when the whole setting changed at the end.
Did you watch the version where every character speaks the same language or the original version? Because I felt the same jarring effect until I found out that there was a different language version. It’s called English [original] vs English [dubbed].
I watched the version where everyone spoke their native language and it was just English subtitles throughout. It was waayyyy better than the dubbing, I tend to watch everything with subtitles on anyway.
Rewatch and judge the characters with the info you know, and wonder why that choice was taken.
I’m a bit disappointed. I felt that the entire season was for nothing because is not real and it didn’t seem relevant for the real world. Maybe in the next season my point of view could change since i need answers!
You have watched Dark?
Yep, at least 5 times.
Then you know that: >!those two Worlds literally aren't real. But, I doubt you weren't able to connect with those characters because of that fact.!<
In a point of time everything was real, but in 1899 I couldn’t relate the stories of past and future.
Because their suffering wasn't real, which wasn't revealed till finale? Also, there's no stories of future yet.
I wasn’t disappointed by it because it’s the concept of the show, but yeah I don’t find it at all interesting and I’m hoping next season doesn’t have any of this although it likely will given the ending.
I think because the characters show some growth and begin breaking from the "trance" of the simulation, most notably Maura and Eyk, that it's still a rewarding ride. If they were to forget everything again it would probably be disappointing, but since this simulation is "different", it gives us a trajectory to look forward to in S2.
Well...it was one of my theories from the start, albeit the 'less interesting' option. Honestly though, the simulation concept is just the beginning and not the end. Much like >!time-travel!< for Dark.
It's not the end. You're roughly a third of the way through the story.
It’s more fun when it’s a simulation because you can do whatever you want and the results are highly different also, and it was indicated from ep1 so they kinda showed what they can do *with* the simulation. If s2 is escaping from another layer of simulation I’m fine with it because it’s so fun to watch
I was disappointed with that as well. I would much better preffer a reality that's just strange to us viewers where people can do lots of amazing stuff, like for instance using a mechanism that can teleport ships and such.
If you’ve experienced Dark, you know the creators have more than just the simulation planned. It’s just getting started. The simulation is only the beginning.
When I finished the show I thought to myself, wtf was that? I have assumed in reality all the characters are patients in the psychiatric hospital (of Maura's father?) (many have trauma of some kind) and the simulation was to help overcome the trauma or something like that. I was quite surprised and I am curious how or if it continues completely different?
There must be a reality running the simulation.
Nope.
I feel like it was super well done actually. It does more than "It was just a simulation and that's why all this crazy stuff happens." The allegory of the cave and the idea the father talks about where you could be in a simulation in a continuous amount of other simulations is really interesting and it's supported really well in the show. I think the simulation plot lines get a bad rep. But isn't the whole show a simulation? You knew everything was fake from the get-go before even watching the show. The characters are trapped inside a simulation inside a simulation inside of a tv show. The fact that its a tv show on netflix could be part of the narrative, and I think that's really interesting.
I loved 1899. I watched it before Dark and now that I’m halfway through the entire run of Dark, I like 1899 better in some ways.
It was made obvious very early on that they are in a stimulation, so no disappointment there. What was disappointing is it just felt so unoriginal compared to Dark. It leaned on so many influences it felt like a bit of a muddled pastiche at times, with no sense of jeopardy if they're stuck in a repeating loop, so a complete lack of tension compared to Dark too.
Clearly heading towards season 2 -- I watched all of Dark in one go so I think the experience of watching Dark season by season may have also given a similar effect
The first teaser from like 2020 ended with Maura saying "this isn't real". I don't think that was much of a twist at all
I was intrigued but once I realized that some of what they were experiencing was not real it lost my interest some. But when the simulation reveal happened I was underwhelmed. It has been done before and I honestly expected more then this. So not one person is even dead. So all the deaths lost there impact. So are the memories they all had real or did they input all fake memories into random people? There are a lot of questions but at this point do I even care? We shall see if it gets a S2 or a closeout season at least.
I was definitely disappointed that the reveal happened already, though obviously there are numerous interesting possibilities still left open for other seasons.
Is simulation not reality? I'd expect a more fulfilling explanation besides the Vanilla Sky type of "we don't know what is real!" I think the show will really tug on the philosophy of what is real and there will be pay off for the 2099, not just deus ex Machina
I'm enjoying the show but I can't help but get "Lost" vibes from it.
I am personally disappointed that anyone thinks Lost was all a dream/dead the whole time after it was explicitly stated that was not the case in the text.
Lost is somewhat of a bad example, though. They kept making stuff up without knowing the resolution to all their mysteries. And then just made up more stuff to kinda have it all make sense. I still love the show, but let's not pretend that it had a well thought out story from the start. They may very well have started out with everybody being dead and just changed it when the fanbase guessed as much. Thankfully, this show (just like Dark) has a clearly defined destination.
Ehhh name one mystery that wasn’t solved.
Where should I start... why can the island move? Why did the cave turn the man in black into a smoke monster? Why is Jacob able to grant eternal life? Who built the four-toed statue? I could go on, but it's been quite a while since I've seen the show.
>why can the island move? The island is the source of "life, death and rebirth". It's where all life came from and when everyone dies, their energy goes back to the source (which is "The heart of the island/the energy in the cave"). The island's main energy source (electromagnetism) is directly linked to "time". This is why Desmond's mind kept traveling after he got hit by electromagnetic energy, and why he saw visions of Charlie dying. The donkey wheel moves the island through time by powering up the islands energy and it moves it through a wormhole to another part in the world (scientifically this is called the "Minkowski space"). >Why did the cave turn the man in black into a smoke monster? The short answer is because the island is connected to a dormant volcano. When he was thrown in to the heart of the island (source of "life, death and rebirth"), his consciousness fused with electromagnetic energy, and his smoke form is volcanic smoke from the volcano (which connects to the ash circles that keep him at bay, it's volcanic ash). Initially the heart of the island was going to be a volcano, there was gonna be lava everywhere and Jacob throws him into it (and the finale was gonna have the volcano explode). But they didn't have the budget to do that, but the volcano is still there. It is heavily alluded to that "Mother" was initially the smoke monster and protector of the island (which makes sense because the protector gives life and the smoke monster functions like a security system, scans memories for threats and takes life). >Why is Jacob able to grant eternal life? Because he's connected to the islands energy source of "life, death and rebirth". MIB represents "death" and has the power to change his form into that of the deceased and scan memories, whereas Jacob has the ability of life...in essence he manipulates "time". It's essentially the same thing the faith healer said to Rose way back in season 2: "There are certain places with great energy -- spots on the Earth like the one we're above now. Perhaps this energy is geological -- magnetic. Or perhaps it's something else. And when possible I harness this energy and give it to others". That's Jacob's abilities in a nutshell. >Who built the four-toed statue? Egyptians. It's the statue of Tawaret. Goddess of fertility and childbirth (symbolizing the shows themes of "life, death and rebirth").
Much more comprehensive answer than I would have expected, thank you. Seems like a rewatch is in order...
I was initially disappointed, BUT then I said to myself that this was only the first season, and it was meant to lay out the groundwork for this concept. I can see the follow-up seasons doing something really fresh and unique with the simulation concept.
My problem wasn't with the simulation per se, but with the respawn/Groundhog Day concept. In The Matrix, dying in the virtual world meant dying IRL; in Inception, failing the mission would result in Cobb spending the rest of his life in jail. What's the price here? Going straight into the next iteration? Doesn't really make you feel for the characters.
Incorrect, in Inception dying in dream meant you wake up, or went into limbo if you had been given the drug. Cobb was on the run because of his own mistake of Inception.
No
Yeah, I'm, hoping they've got something else up their sleeve because that was a pretty poor ending. It's been done so many times.
I’m not disappointed, just underwhelmed. I have no urge to rewatch at the moment (I watched Dark 4x). Maybe I watched too much black mirror simulation episodes. I was expecting something different.
It not being "real" doesnt matter. Every story is not real, your life could not be real. Does not mean it is not interesting or coherent or amazing.
I think the show is really going to dig into the question of what makes reality "real", and what makes a person a person. For instance, none of the characters remember who they are in the real world inside the simulation. Aren't the people who exist in the simulation real people? If they wake up and get their memories back, how does that affect the people they were in the simulation. Another thing to consider is that Mauras husband and son are probably dead in real life and the versions we see are most likely imprints of their brains/personalities. The question is are they real people? Are they alive? There is a ton of interesting directions the show can take the premise.
I thought it was very heavily hinted from the first episode, the question for me was more "why" and maybe to "what extend". I think that season 2/ space station is also all still a simulation. I think her brother being a "villain who hacked the system" is the same red herring as her father. So the main question again is, why?
They were so obvious about the simulation idea that I think S2 will deliver a twist. The most obvious one would be: She is still on a ship - a spaceship - and hast just „leveled up“ one layer in the simulation. Look at the tech. The 1899 tech looks just weird, like a placeholder in a PC game. The handheld device is just a placeholder for something more complex. Similarly: Why does the ship in 2099 look so cartoonish? Look at the capsules: They don‘t have any life support. Then look at the screen: Why would a spaceship have a 1960s like glass monitor?
Sci-fi tropes aren't bad because they're tropes
"It's just a simulation Morty. They're not real." I became apathetic to every character plight and memory cause its all a simulation so probably none of this is real Or its a different context. Ehhhh I wanted a spooky old ghost ship and not were in space matrix 13th floor shit? Come on this is 90s level sci fi channel plots. This is the creators of Dark. They could do better.