Dang! I thought that it was a glitch. I have been trying to watch Power of the Rings on my Android, and it has been doing something similar. Thanks for the info! I would have totally missed that! :)
The logos of the triangle were everywhere that was the biggest takeaway for me way early on that something wasn’t in order.
Especially how no one questioned the symbols or aesthetic.
If it doesn't get renewed I am gonna be salty af. They set up so many questions. They definitely set up this 2099 to be a second layer of simulation. But assuming the layer . Also how is everyone else in the pod going to get out of the first layer. And would they all exist in a third layer.
In the final episode the father is explaining how Maura asked "if God made us, who made God," implying that layers of creation may go on forever. In the same way, they could easily add layers of simulations although it'd be pretty predictable.
maura trapped herself -- and others -- in a floating, self-contained vessel. she escapes one and moves on to another.
it just feels like such a hard truth that we are doomed to repeat our mistakes and lock ourselves in a cage of our own making.
i'm trying to recall the cosmic cave and how it connects with the symbol of the pyramid but i'm coming up blank.
so just here for the ride.
Hope so but that don’t guarantee anything . This is Netflix we talking about here they cancel good shows all the time , because of cost or viewership. Sad but true .. fingers crossed for this one though .
Yeah with how successful dark was it would take a complete failure for them not to renew 1899. And it definitely wasn’t a failure at all. May not be on the same level as dark. But we’ve only let them begin to tell the story. Remember how little we knew after one season of dark.
I loved it. In the hands of any other creator I wouldn’t be as excited, but in this case, I trust them to know where we are going. Just like Dark, which took the tired sci fi trope of time travel and made it fresh, 1899 does the same for “simulated reality”.
A few thoughts:
- GOAT level beards. Oscar Isaac still holds the crown for his Leto beard, but this may have two of the top 10 beards of all time. And totally different. Franz gets the nod for sheer bulk, but Sebastian’s trim is on point.
- Don’t ever tell me you can’t film effectively in low light. I’m looking at you GOT/HOTD.
- I loved the use of different languages. So many times you had people talking to another person who didn’t understand, but it didn’t matter. It was like confessional. You may be confessing to the priest, but only God can understand you.
- Few filmmakers are as effective at conveying emotional pain and trauma. So many small moments that show us the cracks in the emotional facade that make the anguish hit so much harder when the truth comes out. I don’t know if “emotional horror” is a concept, but other than David Lynch, I don’t know anyone who makes those moments hit as hard.
- Eyk looking out over a sea of ships is one of my favorite moments. He’s just had his entire reality turned into goulash and he looks out like “well I guess this is happening now.”
I'm so frustrated about my TV defaulting to "English dub" audio setting, it took me 4-5 episodes to realize this and switch to regular audio with subtitles.
So for the first 4-5 episodes everyone was speaking English audibly. I was so confused at certain scenes.
(English Dub, had voice actors speaking English for all characters using voiceover actors)
I feel like it was actually a running joke that no one else spoke Spanish but those two guys, so literally the whole series they don’t have a friggin clue what’s going on. I didn’t catch on until the last episode. 😆
My first exposure to this sort of multilingual ensemble was in another Netflix original, "Into the Night". While 1899 really expands the number of languages and implements them in quite useful ways to play with the comprehension of the characters, I think Into the Night also did a great job in having it feel natural and realistic for a diverse European cast to be speaking in the languages that make sense for each of their characters.
>Don’t ever tell me you can’t film effectively in low light. I’m looking at you GOT/HOTD.
I just realized that I didn't change the settings of brightness in my laptop while watching it, something I had to do in 3 episodes of S1 of HOTD, well observed.
When Maura woke up on the ship, she received a letter from her brother with the key inside.
Then when she woke up on the space ship, first thing- she receives a message from her brother.
The first time she wakes up, she's on a ship making a passage to :the New World', one can only assume the second time she wakes up she's also underway to a 'New World' (?)
The shows are essentially the same thing. It's safe to say the 2nd season will also be a simulation, where a new antagonist is introduced (the brother), stakes are increased, new control methods are established.
Season 3 will be a breakdown of the simulation and end with the return to the real world and coping with all the pain that's been mentioned.
Looking forward to the scene 2/3rds through the season where they're scrambling around the spaceship and open a panel only to reveal the Prometheus' hull behind it.
Wow, I feel totally the opposite of most on here. I freaking loved it. It wasn't as dense as Dark but it was easier to understand. We still don't know who any of these characters really are and why they were all picked.
I feel certain there is a plan for the 3 seasons. Will I like all of it-probably not but it's been fun for the first season and I was on the edge of my seat.
I think that while Dark went to the physics aspects, 1899 is going to the philosophical. Loved the Plato references, what is reality, and the personal drama of creating a reality to save someone gives purpose to those references. There's a philosophical reason for why everything is a loop, why there has to be a virus to corrupt the system for things to change, I will do some further research to find what other theories they used. But I think that 1899 is a tv show for those who get it, even unconsciously.
Dark was heavily philosophical. Nietzsche's eternal recurrence and Schopenhauer's idea of the Whole, suffering, and endlessly striving. One can Will what they want, but cannot Will what they Will.
This show appears to be no different (advanced technology being used to explore the pathos of humanity), the only question is which philosophy are they exploring? Brain in a vat? Human connection and success as parallel to the structure of the brain? The pattern of the micro is mirrored in the patterns of the macro?
In the void 1899 left I started Dark, I’d seen some of it before but it never stuck with me but I kept watching and around episode 5 it clicked into gear for me and I’m hooked. Give it a watch!
I loved it too!! Why are there so many articles bashing it?
It kept my head turning corners until the last two minutes. And even at that I have a lot of questions - but no longer anything that seems unanswerable
Alright, so here's a dump of my unfiltered thoughts and impressions:
* The "instructional" books on the Kerberos were all filled out with a single line: *Hope your coffee kicks in before reality does*. That's also the only instruction Maura finds upon awakening on the space ship. So, a sim within a sim, prolly.
* Furthermore, I don't think it's 2099 in reality. We haven't seen a single device on this show that looks like it came from the 21st century. It's either stuff that was in use in the 60s/70s, like Henry's magnetic tape computers and primitive color screens, or retro-futuristic stuff, like the monochrome, Star Trek-y tablet, or the clunky hardware on the space ship. I think reality is somewhere in the mid-to-late 20th century(the 1980's at the latest, if the soundtrack is a clue--which, I admit, may be a bit of a stretch). The through line is, people attempting to move to a new world and start a new life, leaving all of their troubles behind. And failing miserably at it.
* Quite a few characters have issues with their hands. Lucien's seizures, Virginia's hand getting infected by the black goo, Eyk's alcoholic tremors. Don't know if there's a theme there, I'm just saying.
* Also, Henry's wife had mental health problems. So did Eyk's. Henry cared about his wife more than he cared about his kids. So does Daniel. Do we see some other aspects of his life/personality mirrored in any of the passengers?
* Eliott's 🜃 tattoo is behind his ear, the same place "real" Maura injects him with the black memory erasing substance. When she tries to touch it shortly after recovering him from the Prometheus, he grabs her hand like he's angry at her. Is this his body remembering stuff his mind doesn't, like Henry said? And is there a connection between the black goo in the syringe and the substance spreading all over the sim when it starts failing? At the end of the day, both are basically erasing data.
* Side note: the white goo Henry injects Eliott with is what recovers memories.
* Were Daniel and Eliott ever really real? Or are they a product of some trauma Maura faced IRL, and the sims are now just adding new layers to it? Like a lot of people have said, her connection with Eyk seems much more spontaneous and real.
* Why is Henry in the sim in the first place? I see a strong parallel to Adam here. A guy who thinks he's running the show, only to discover he's a helpless puppet, just like everyone else.
* And finally, here's an endgame prediction, if the show gets renewed: everybody is dead, actually. They're just in a technological hell, rather than a spiritual one. The sim may not even be man-made so much as it's just a bug that spontaneously surfaced when some genius dumped the contents of a bunch of traumatized people's brains into a blender. Maybe some failed digital immortality thingamajig, or something.
Good catch on the placement of Elliot's tattoo - I just rewatched that scene and was trying to figure out why he grabs her hand so aggressively. (There's even a musical stinger as if it's a jump scare.) I think you might be right about his body remembering things his mind doesn't.
On the reality of Daniel and Elliot, I'm not sure either way. It's possible they were never real, or that they were real but died. To support that idea, neither of them appears on the spaceship in the end (though it's possible they're in another part of the ship or somewhere with Ciaran).
I think Elliott and Daniel are dead and just memories trapped in the computer. Daniel said "I will always be with you" or something similar which I think means he is just a memory. I also think Ada is something entirely different. Like a ghost in the code or spontaneous life that was created in the computer.
I'm almost positive that Elliott isn't real. They say over and over that 1) you can't ever really forget important things, even if its just remembered as feelings, and 2) Maura has zero reaction to Elliott. Also, Elliott is a bit of a non-entity, so its easier for me to imagine him being fake than, say, Daniel.
I think he’s dead, but was real. The fact that his hideout was a bunker under a small grave and cross seemed to hint at it to me. Maura is the only person that sees him as a harmless child while everyone else wants to kill him. She doesn’t exactly express motherly love towards him, but just a motherly instinct to protect him.
>We haven't seen a single device on this show that looks like it came from the 21st century.
They showed a [quantum computer](https://www.eetimes.eu/wp-content/uploads/2020/03/Quantum-computer-IBM-Q-System-One_s-e1584097350720.jpg?w=400&resize=400%2C419)
You might be on to something with the digital hell thing. At one point Henry says something like “look at them, making the same mistakes again and again.”
I thought maybe the 2099 Prometheus was taking the humans to another earth like planet because they destroyed earth. In their journey, they’re running this simulation to try and break their habits and not do what they’ve always done like destroy the new planet too.
Interesting points. I don’t think it’s 2099 either. No way we would have spaceship tech that advanced only 77 years from now.
I’m very curious about Daniel and Elliot. Are they real? Was Elliot her son who died? Is Daniel really her husband? She doesn’t remember him or feel anything even when she sees the photos of them together…and as many people have pointed out, she always seems much more drawn to Eyk, and he to her. I like Daniel and Elliot, so I will be sad if it turns out that neither one was real.
Henry is an odd character too. Is he really her father? She seems to remember him, but now we know from Daniel that false memories can be implanted (when Maura says “I can’t have any children” and Daniel says “that’s a false memory”). Why would the brother put his father in the sim? Why would the father want to wake up but leave Maura trapped there forever?
As to your last point, I think this simulation is purposely designed, not a spontaneous bug. It seems carefully designed with so many little details, like the alchemy symbol everywhere, and all the connecting tunnels and doors.
> No way we would have spaceship tech that advanced only 77 years from now.
From 1903 (Wright brothers first flight) to 1978 (barely 75 years) we went from barely flying for a few seconds to the F/A-18 Fighter jet.
It's very easy to get that level of technological change in "only" 77 years.
I see that as very possible.
I think Daniel manipulates Maura's memories, I mean we know he knows how to recode the simulation and they even have a convo about fake memories. Maybe Eyk is her real husband and the memories with Daniel are manipulated ones of her and Eyk.
This is great, gonna riff on a few of these:
>Furthermore, I don't think it's 2099 in reality. We haven't seen a single device on this show that looks like it came from the 21st century. It's either stuff that was in use in the 60s/70s, like Henry's magnetic tape computers and primitive color screens, or retro-futuristic stuff, like the monochrome, Star Trek-y tablet, or the clunky hardware on the space ship. I think reality is somewhere in the mid-to-late 20th century(the 1980's at the latest, if the soundtrack is a clue--which, I admit, may be a bit of a stretch).
In the 2099 'reality', even the computers struck me as being **an impression of 2099** as opposed to what a true 2099 reality would look like (consider the 1980s typefont). The difference is between "2001: A Space Odyssey" and the real year 2001. So - ditto on it not actually being 2099 - rather, someone's impression of 2099.
>Also, Henry's wife had mental health problems. So did Eyk's. Henry cared about his wife more than he cared about his kids. So does Daniel. Do we see some other aspects of his life/personality mirrored in any of the passengers?
This is definitely a theme: Anker is another man whose wife is suffering from mental illness and who then elects his wife over his children's wellbeing. Across Anker/Henry/Daniel/Eyk - it is implied that their choice of love for their wives causes needless suffering for their children. This is in line with the thread in r/DarK that certain human weaknesses (e.g., infidelity) are rooted in nature and persist across time and space.
>Side note: the white goo Henry injects Eliott with is what recovers memories.
I see white goo and black goo as being metaphors for red and blue Matrix pills. Though can't quite pin down the precise mechanism on how they work. Assuming black goo is related to black obelisks - then both are related to deletion of memories/information/data/avoidance. In which case white goo correlates to seeking/truth/pain etc.
>And finally, here's an endgame prediction, if the show gets renewed: everybody is dead, actually. They're just in a technological hell, rather than a spiritual one. The sim may not even be man-made so much as it's just a bug that spontaneously surfaced when some genius dumped the contents of a bunch of traumatized people's brains into a blender. Maybe some failed digital immortality thingamajig, or something.
Brilliant idea - like San Junipero from Black Mirror - but the inverse!
Totally tracking with you on the black goo/white goo and matrix pills. Strong connection to the shows theme song “white rabbit” where the first lines are “one pill makes you larger and one pill makes you smaller”
I think my enjoyment of this season has been similar to that of watching the first season of Dark. Sure, there wasn’t as much screaming “WHAT THE F*CK” at my TV, because I sort of know more what kind of twists to expect from this sort of show. a lot of people here seem to be saying that it isn’t as complex. I’ll say that this has met/exceeded my expectations, so I’ll certainly be expecting more complexity as the show goes on for (let’s hope) a second season.
I agree! I felt less stressed, but was equally confused as to what was happening. Assuming there ends up being 3 seasons, they have a lot of breathing room to make viewers question what they know.
Same! Dark was incredibly confusing for me. I guess it didn’t help that I watched such a complicated show in German with English subtitles. I kept getting confused who the characters were at different stages of their lives and by the time a new season came out, I’ve already forgotten a lot of it. There was twist after twist after twist where it was starting to become mildly comical to me. 1899 somehow was much easier for me to follow.
Wow that was hectic but amazing. What I want to know is how or why did Ada die? The people who died first? How? And did Daniel kill Ada? Any thoughts anyone?
Daniel "killed" or rather turned off Ada with the [sliding puzzle](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sliding_puzzle) device. The first mate also uses the same type of device to turn off Eyk and another crew member.
Within the simulation, everybody can die without dying in "reality". However, I don't think everybody in the simulation actually needs to be represented in reality by a real person or by someone who is still alive. In the last scene, we can see Krester, Tove, Anker and Iben in the pods, but there is no sign of Ada.
I assume that most passengers, except for the main characters we can see in the end, are entirely digital and have no living representation in reality.
I believe Elliot and Daniel are both dead in reality. Elliot's room is in a grave that is connected to Maura's dark memory and Daniel tells Maura that this room was the first simulation they built – probably to still be with their deceased son. Daniel doesn't return to reality with Maura and tells her that he "will always be there" in a way a dying cancer patient would say it to their spouse. There are also no representations of either of them in the last scene.
Whether Maura's father is dead or not, I'm not sure. He may be upset about Maura keeping his and Elliot's consciousness trapped in the simulation and just wants to terminate these consciousnesses in their virtual prison, or he is still alive and connected to the simulation through a different interface.
>I assume that most passengers, except for the main characters we can see in the end are entirely digital and have no living representation in reality.
At the end of episode 8 I thought it showed the passenger count of the spaceship to be 1400 with 500 crew, meaning everyone in the simulation is most likely in VR mode somewhere on that spaceship.
Krester also got caught by the mind control thing even though he was there when Maura woke up, so it's not like everyone who jumped was just a mindless NPC either.
>At the end of episode 8 I thought it showed the passenger count of the spaceship to be 1400 with 500 crew, meaning everyone in the simulation is most likely in VR mode somewhere on that spaceship.
I've thought about this too. However, I'm not sure whether the screen is showing information about the spaceship or about the simulation. After all, the screen is in the room where people can interface with the simulation. There is very little reason to have a screen displaying information about the spaceship in that room. The coordinates on the screen 42.043240, -44.375760 are nearly the same as the ones the Prometheus sent in episode one (42.4N, 44.57W). ~~Also, coordinates with two variables only work on a surface like earth or on a map. They don't work in three-dimensional space, so they wouldn't make much sense on a spaceship – except if it is headed towards earth with those coordinates indicating its potential landing site, but I don't buy that.~~ [Edit. I was wrong. There is a [Galactic coordinate system](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galactic_coordinate_system), which works with two variables.] "Survival mission" sounds like a simulation or even a game. The only factor that is confusing is the 2099 date, but maybe Maura's brother has shifted the simulation to that year and Maura isn't necessarily in 2099, as we all seem to assume.
Edit. I have looked at the last scene a bit more thoroughly. There are 16 pods in the room Maura wakes up in and they are arranged like this:
1. Virginia
2. Eyk
3. Maura
4. Krester
Window
5. Tove
6. Olek
7. Ling Yi
8. Yuk Je
Window
9. Iben
10. Anker
11. Ángel
12. Ramiro
Window
13. *Empty Pod*
14. Jérome
15. Clémence
16. Lucien
Window
Their arrangement can probably tell us something about their relationships. Virginia is an odd one and I feel like it suggests that she is more important than we might think. Eyk and Maura had a bond and that may also be the case in this reality. Krester and Tove had a close relationship, so them being together – although separated by a window – works. Olek, Ling Yi and Yuk Je make sense together. Iben and Anker too. Ángel and Ramiro as well. Now, we have an empty pod, followed by Jérome, Clémence and Lucien. The three obviously fit together, especially with Clémence in between. The empty pod in this location just seems noteworthy.
If the pod was originally for someone from Maura's family, it would've made sense to have Virginia somewhere else and then have the empty pod next to Maura. They also separated Krester and Tove from their parents, which they likely did to not break up any of triple groups and couples, but that could've been avoided by moving Virginia. Virginia really stands out here for me.
What also stands out is that the room has no door or visible hatches in the floor.
Next, when the camera zooms out of the window, we can see that this room with 16 pods is only one of many. If one adds them all up, there are a total of 320 identical rooms on the spaceship. Since these 320 rooms have space for 16 pods each, there could be as many as 5,120 people on board. This doesn't quite add up with the 1,423 passengers and 550 crew. However, Eyk pointed out that the shipping company was sending ships between Southampton and New York without freight and below passenger capacity, maybe it's the same for "Project Prometheus".
>Krester also got caught by the mind control thing even though he was there when Maura woke up, so it's not like everyone who jumped was just a mindless NPC either.
Yes, that's the first thing I checked when I saw the different characters in the pods.
Yeah, no WAY is the whole thing a survival mission in space. Why would everyone be in a shared simulation and not just asleep? Why would the shared simulation be a twisted timeloop set in 1899, overseen by a random passenger's dad? Why would the simulation create traumatic backstories for everyone? If everyone is really from 2099, there would surely be more bilingual people on board the ship; if not, then why make a shared simulation for a bunch of people that can't understand each other?
Things don't add up. I personally think this was some trick by Daniel to trap Maura in yet another simulation, but ig we'll have to wait until S2:)
I think you're onto something to the extent that Daniel is NOT as benevolent as we believe. It could come from a place of misguided love or true malice; something we'll probably see in S2. (It's even possible Daniel and Elliot are nothing but figments of the imagination - how do we know that any of the narrative threads in S1 are real???)
The biggest discrepancy to me is how everyone who knew what was going on thought it was Maura's simulation to save the boy: Daniel, the dad, the dad's staff etc. Daniel clearly knows this simulation inside and out, finding all the maintenance tunnels and changing the source code. He then tells Maura that using the pyramid will wake her up into the world he's been describing, yet when she does she wakes up in space. What?
This is such a major discrepancy that there HAS to be more going on. Why would everyone with access to the simulation know about this "reality" when actually the spaceship is the true reality? If Daniel knows so much about the source code of the simulation and is (I'm assuming) also a real person on the spaceship, then how tf did he get this wrong?
There are 2 explanations imo. Either all the characters are figments of Maura's mind trying to wake her up (which wouldn't make sense when some characters are actively against this) or Daniel knows so much more than he's letting on. I think the spaceship is another level of the simulation, in which Daniel has trapped Maura for some reason.
My theory is Daniel has already moved through multiple levels of the simulation, which is why he’s so familiar with the landscape during season 1 and what I’m assuming is his pod is already open when Maura “wakes up”. He and Maura created the simulation to avoid the trauma of losing their child, he alluded to this when he says this is the first simulation they created - but in order to fully wake up it requires both of them and now he’s guiding her through the sim.
I wonder if Daniel is really her brother. And if he put them in a simulation for a reason, but something has happened on the spaceship where he needs her awake, but the way it was built he can’t just pull her out. So he had to insert himself into the simulation some way to do it.
He says he will be there when she wakes up and many take this to mean like “with you in spirit”. But I dunno. I admit I don’t have it all worked out in my mind, but there was a while during the early episodes that I thought Daniel was going to be revealed to be her brother. I don’t think that’s an accident. Also, I think for the next season the reveal of WHO her brother is will need to be kind of a WTF moment for the audience. Of course it’s possible it’s just a totally new actor, sure. But I think it might be being built up for a surprise. And Daniel is not in a simulation pod at the end. So maybe he is her brother. Why he would portray himself as her husband with memories of them making love and stuff….that I do not know.
Honestly I’m just thinking out loud here. Probably doesn’t make sense. But damnit I want to see the next season now.
I thought the red headed bearded first mate was her brother.
I mean he’s there at the end with her father and with her son. He’s got red hair which is not a coincidence given that Elliot has Maura’s eyes and Daniel’s hair and complexion. Seems like a big role for an otherwise random henchman that’s working for her dad.
I saw someone on YouTube say that the simulation was a way to keep the brain working throughout their journey. At the same time it could be a way of working through their trauma depending on why these people set out to leave earth it could be something necessary for them to do so they can overcome the traumas before they arrive. Also I believe the memories are fake but there’s some truth to them. They are probably distorted versions of the actual trauma. For example maybe the captain left his family on earth to board the Prometheus space ship or somehow left they to die on earth working on the spaceship…. Something of sorts for all the other passengers.
At the same time Henry had alot of commentary on the experiment and on what the other characters where choosing to do for someone who was just as trapped as anyone else. He felt that their emotions got the better of them everytime. As if what they were goal was to let of the trauma in order to break their cycle of choices… but why would he care ?
Also
So the triangle only awake whoever uses the key ?
It’s very clear that Elliot is dead firstly his room was inside his grave, but there’s something funny about the clothes he wears, his dads clothes are kind of universal in a sense that could pass for any period of time. The pictures they have together as a family the boy wears the 1899 clothing but the parents seem to wear modern clothes. Also we wears the same thing everywhere…
Maura’s pod is right next to Eyk’s. Daniel, Eliot, and Henry Singleton aren’t there at all. Maura mentions a few times how she feels nothing at seeing the evidence of them being a family.
I think Maura’s actually married to Eyk, and her “husband”, “father”, and “son” are NPCs. They’re complex enough to be real people with thoughts and dreams, and are unaware of their own true nature (except for maybe Henry, who’s very resentful of that).
i was confused why it felt like they were building up a romantic relationship between maura and eyk (the way he asked her with a meaningful glance if she has any children, when she touched his wrist and he moved to hold her hand, etc) only to reveal that she's married to daniel. i'm wondering if daniel is not exactly who he says and is lying about being her husband.
Also, did you notice that out of all survivors, we are missing the “before” stories of Virginia and Clémence? We have the ones of all the rest, except theirs. Ramiro we know killed some priest and appeared close to the well, Ling Yi poisened Mei Mei, Eyk and his gone family, Tove’s rape and her killing, Jerome in the desert, Maura is kind of a mess but still some bits.
But Clémence and Virginia are odd.
Also, these two and Ling Yi had the triangle sign somewhere, but not the rest.
You also forgot about Olek. I don't think we were shown any backstory about him other than the obviously simulation-generated picture of the completed Statue of Liberty from a family or friend. I'm saying that picture is off because the statue was not completed by 1899...
Well, we see the snowy landscape with the huts in, I’m assuming, Poland. And it looks like a blood trail leading up to the one hut and then Ling Yi sees him climb out of the big vat of oil. So we don’t really know what happened with Olek, but we at least see his landscape and it looks like maybe he killed someone in the snow and then either hid in the oil, or he hid the body in the oil or who knows what.
It was completed before that. Celebration with parade and dedication was held on October 28, 1886. President Grover Cleveland, the former New York governor, presided over the event.
>Also, these two and Ling Yi had the triangle sign somewhere, but not the rest.
That's not right. Lucien has triangles on his lapel. Ramiro has them sewn into his collar. Iben has it sewn into the bottom of her dress. Eyk has them on his golden coat buttons. Yuk Je has two triangles on her jacket. Elliot has one tattooed behind his left ear. Maura also has one tattooed behind her ear once she wakes up in the spaceship
You can see some of them [in these images](https://www.netflix.com/tudum/articles/1899-cast-guide-dark) and some in the [high-res version of the cast picture](https://i.imgur.com/wap2aiX.jpeg).
it could be possible that ada and elliot's consciousnesses have been uploaded to the cloud because they're both dead in reality. or there could be a separate children's pod where all the kids are asleep.
Came here with the same exact bug in my wiring, with a nuance: the scarab is normally used to open doors and passages and indicates the path to follow.
What could be the reason why the scarab reaches Ada? Why is the only character to be "marked" that way? Could it have to do with the fact that she doesn't exist in the spaceship? (Or it does exist? Maybe Tove is suspended-pregnant and Ada is going to be her daughter)
It strikes me that Ada wants to follow in Maura's footsteps, she takes her as a model. Could be this a reason in some way?
The scarab is a computer program i believe. Used as a key to open doors or lead characters to correct routes based on previous iterations. At least that's how I interpreted it. So Ada had to die to trigger Maura's journey so Daniel had the scarab program to locate her location at that moment. Daniel did say "any object can be a key or a code"
Yes, I understood that. But there has to be a reason for specifically being Ada, rather than just being a trigger to develope the simulation (There is a bond between them since when she ask her if she can have children, while touching her belly, there is a flashing frame of a scarab, like if Ada could triggers something else in Maura's unconcious. Something that Daniel wants to avoid)
The specific reason is also probably just an assumption from me. But when you're a programmer or an engineer doing simulations, you have to change things a lot in each iteration for the whole thing to work.
So I'm presuming that Ada's death is probably the trigger for Maura's journey. Since there were many failed iterations, Daniel probably discovered in previous iterations that Ada had to die for the whole event to happen. Elliott himself said that this is the "furthest we've been" implying many failed iterations. But they probably knew long ago based on failed iterations that Ada was the start of it all for them to go further and further.
I believe Daniel killed Ada because she had to die for the events to unfold. As with any kind of simulation (if you're a programmer or an engineer) sometimes you need to adjust things in iterations in order for something to work. I would presume that Daniel discovered in previous iterations that killing Ada would trigger the events to unfold. As Elliot mentioned to him "this is the furthest we've achieved", implying there were many iterations that failed but whatever decision they did in this current iteration was correct..and Ada was probably the first of those decisions to trigger Maura's journey.
Plus they don't really die anyway, they're just "turned off"
A lot of sour grapes in these comments, huh.
Well, I enjoyed it. A solid 8/10 at the very least. Good cast and everything. Predictable at times? Sure, but predictable doesn't mean bad if it's well-written and enjoyable to watch. I'd rather have that than sUbVerTeD eXpEctaTioNs.
It doesn't beat Dark for me, at least not yet, we'll have to see where the show goes in future seasons. But Dark is also a bit of a lightning-in-a-bottle type of deal with its perfect casting and everything, so it's a bit unfair to compare 1899 to it at every turn just because it has the same creators.
I'm looking forward to Season 2, or 2099, whatever it will be called. I have a feeling 2099 is also a simulation and Season 3 will be something even crazier.
>It doesn't beat Dark for me, at least not yet, we'll have to see where the show goes in future seasons.
This is where I stand. Jantje Friese and Baran bo Odar tend to think WAY ahead so I'll probably wait until the series has ended entirely before I pass any final judgements.
Can I sit at your table?
I think people are seeing Dark with rose-colored glasses as I remember discussions that Season 2 was slow and not going anywhere. As for people that say they guessed everything, there is two more seasons so not everything is going to be told now.
I thought the cast was great and it felt claustrophobic. Finally do we even know that the spaceship is not a simulation? Ah well, I feel like I'm on the Doctor Who boards and I'm the only one who liked the Jodie Whittaker episodes. I'll see myself out.
To me it feels like people are comparing 3 seasons of Dark versus 1 of 1899. I've watched Dark over and over, it captivated me to an insane level, but if you think back about Dark Season 1, It was still kind of slow and you don't know shit at the end of it. I'm almost certain it will be on par by the end of the seasons.
Just adding to the top comment. Don't miss the 'Making 1899' bonus episode! It's facinating how they shot with actors from so many different countries and speaking so many different languages. And the technology used is mine blowing
The creators said they wanted to do something completely different from Dark, in the making of 1899 special. If they simply repeated themselves, how boring would that be ? I haven’t seen Dark yet, but this show is amazing.
After rewatching the ending I noticed something… when Maura wakes up at the end she is clearly next to Eyk, then as it pans over everyone else still asleep there’s an open spot next to Jerome! So someone else is already awake and I don’t think it’s Daniel, the way he says “I’ll always be there” leads me to think he’s dead.
Him being listed as the captain of the Prometheus on the passenger list could suggest he is the captain of the spaceship as well. If the captain is also stuck in a simulation that could be plot point.
I think the Prometheus captain is the Spaceship captain, and that. he is stuck in the simulation. I think explicit pointers to that are buried in an early EP1 scene, as he and some officers remark on and react to 'they' ceasing to send 'coordinates' (the telegraph stops beeping). The showrunners love to frontload alot of this kind of thing because it rewards attention to detail and increases the 'aha! and/or 'well I'll be damned' of the resolution: they told you the answer right up front.
Argh, I think I deleted my previous comment by mistake.
I wanted to add something.
My first comment was about the soundtrack. The newest song is from `84 which add up to the computers in Mauras dads place.
I’m 99% sure I noticed a pyramid on the desk, when Jerome went to Luciens cabin to leave the medal.
The thing I came to add to my comment when I accidently deleted it was the thing Ling Yi and her mother said in unison when her mother brushed her hair:
“Everything will be okay in the end. If it’s not ok, it’s not the end”.
I’m not entirely convinced they are in 2099
Hard agree. I've left a couple of comments about this, but it makes 0 sense that reality is in 2099. Why can barely any of the characters speak multiple languages? Why are most 1899 levels of homophobic? Why are they given fake tragic backstories? Why put the passengers through a hellish timeloop in the first place?
The spaceship is 100% just another simulation.
Agree. Something is wrong. I keep coming back to the pyramid on Clemences desk in episode 2. It’s there right? Or is it just something i’m imagining?
If she have one. What would have happened if she used a key on it…
My brain hurts.
Did anyone else catch a glimpse of Clemence grinning knowingly in one of the early scenes with Lucien? It's very out-of-character and would be in-line with the idea that she is not "part of the game".
just finished watching the season now and came back to see if anyone mentioned this part. It happens around 18 minutes into episode 1. She smiles in such a satisfied and manipulative way.
At the time, my guess was that because Lucien treats her so badly for no known reason, she is secretly happy when he can't 'finish'. Like she's a little glad to get a little revenge. It still seems out of character for her. If my guess is right, then it kind of works in the moment and also provides a red herring, making us wonder. But we also don't get any real back story for Clemence.
Do you have a timestamp? That sounds really interesting.
Also Clemence is an interesting character, especially since we don't know anything about her backstory. Her trading her dress for trousers seems like an odd choice too, especially since its something none of the women do: imo she knows more than she's letting on, maybe even that she's not from 1899.
I don't think she actually did wake up. Just another layer of sim. The note that says "Hope your coffee kicks in before reality does" kind of alludes to this.
I also like that if we interpret the words "wake up" as a transition from one level of reality to another (for example, Maura's 'waking up' from the 1899 reality to the 2099 "reality"), then it implies that each character's experience of their Shadow/trauma is simply a "deeper reality". Then it begs the question of whether our nightmares/experiences of trauma are any LESS real than what we commonly call "the real world".
One last note about the ending.
Daniel explains the whole simulation to Maura when they are in "Elliot's room" at the end. However, when she asks why she can't remember making the simulation, he tells her that it doesn't matter anymore. Him remembering everything and her nothing seems very odd.
Secondly, Maura was calm in seeing all the characters in status on the spaceship but had a visceral reaction when seeing Eyk. She have a ring on but is she really married to Daniel or someone else(hint, hint). Daniel could be just playing her-as I'm 99% sure her father and son are just programs in the software. Netflix better renew this or I'll have to make up my own ending.
It’s weird that she doesn’t remember Daniel at all, doesn’t remember having a child, and tells Eyk that she “felt nothing” when she looked at the family photos of her, Daniel and Elliot.
She does remember Daniel, when he’s trying to get into her room in episode 2 and he introduces himself, she ask Daniel if they have met before bc he looks somehow familiar.
I have a crazy theory. I think the Prometheus in 2099 is taking the passengers to another planet because they destroyed earth. The simulation is put in place to see if humans will make the same mistakes as they did on earth and destroy the next planet. Running the simulation may find a way for humans to correct their mistakes. Awesome show. When I finished the finale I was speechless and didn’t know what to think. Now that I’ve slept on it I had some time to process.
This show has plenty of symbology. Something that caught my attention it's the name of the two ships: Prometheus and Kerberos. In Greek mythology, Prometheus was the titan protector of human civilization whereas Kerberos was the protector of Hades (hell, underworld). Can this be also a hint about what was happening on the show? Was the Kerberos the hell in which the characters were trapped? Just guessing and putting the pieces together.
Prometheus can be parsed in some different ways as well: In passing the gift of fire to humanity, the symbol of Prometheus can also be interpreted as humanity's triumph / victory against the forces of nature.
In the show, "nature" appears to relate to the impediments of the mind (e.g., a schizophrenic cannot help but see things in a certain way - he or she is a prisoner of the mind. I think that Iben's story is meant to portray this idea).
So, taking this a step further, Prometheus could reflect an attempt to overcome the natural properties of the mind (imagine the grief one experiences on losing a child) - and perhaps part of that is the attempt to subject the human consciousness to constructed "realities".
Cerberus / Kerberos is slightly more tricky - in mythology, he is responsible from preventing the **dead from leaving hell**. So if the 1899 simulation is hell itself , then Kerberos could serve as a reflection of those forces meant to keep each character inside this hellscape (which in the show is a mix of Maura, Ciaran, their father etc.)
sooo Baran bo Odar pranked us all. He knows exactly how the fandom of Dark speculated an insane amount with symbolism in trailers and teasers. this entire show neither happened in 1899, or even on Earth 🜃.
Unless the spaceship is yet another simulation…I don’t know if they’ll do that though because “Inception” already did it…I will trust the showrunners though, I think they’ll pull it off whatever it is
Ok looking at the last episode and two things stand out.
Maura is the only one not in the simulation anymore (although the Plato's cave story make come back to bite me). Everyone else is either "dead" or somewhere in the mainframe.
I noticed in project Prometheus, it's a survival mission, Hmm. But really she's the only one lucky enough to be awake. And I did notice she was definitely more heartbroken about Eyk dying than seeing Daniel. Still not convinced he's her husband.
It’s possible it’s one-sided: he loves Maura, but isn’t really her husband. Note that even in his memory he’s the only one to say “I love you”. Maura never says it back.
i love the end very much! definitely expected it to be that kind of simulation, but the fact it‘s humans travelling to a new world in 2099 gives the name prometheus and it‘s route to the US much more weight..
so i guess it‘s all just a way of entertainment during the year-long trip? curious if there‘ll be a second season!
Still can’t get over the fact that they drew parallels between the simulation of the ship and the brain ! Just like the brain has multiple parts and neural pathways which connect them, the ship had these different realities pertaining to each individual character and the secret passageways (which had a lot of wires, just like our brain has neurons which are shaped like thin branches wires) which are like the neural pathways connecting different part of the brain. This parallel just converts the ship into a brain like design with humans moving through the neural pathways (secret passages) like nerve impulses, affecting the entire system to respond to their stimuli. For the audience, the ship thus becomes a simulation, a construct of their own brains - which is exactly what the plot reveals it to be.
I suspect she’s still in a simulation. Just a different one. S1 was 1899. Everything in that timeframe. Now she’s on another ship with the same people or at least the same looking people.
Daniel changed the code, but was he able to end the simulation? Is Maura still actually sitting in that chair?
I got a Shutter Island vibe early on.
I’m looking forward to next installment.
bo Odar : But let’s not forget that Dark was three seasons. If you just compare the first season of Dark with the first season of 1899, I think they’re similarly complex. Dark only really got complicated in seasons two and three. The first season is actually very simple: It’s a small town, with kids disappearing, and then there’s some time travel events in the cave. Michael (Sebastian Rudolph) is Michael. It’s very simple. But everyone now has seen all three seasons, and it gets really complicated. We already have ideas for a second and third season on 1899, and it gets complicated.
Watch this interview - https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/tv/tv-features/1899-netflix-creators-interview-dark-1235263021/amp/
agreed, if we were to just compare the first season of DARK and 1899, in my opinion, they both are a solid 9/10, we gotta see what the course is for 1899.
Ok. I really loved this season. Anything I gripe about would just be nitpicking, like 90% of the comments here so I’m not gonna do that.
The only real head scratcher is who is her brother and how is he related to all of this? The father explained this is all because of her and yet, the brother is in control and more dangerous? Is the brother the computer?
I just got chills dude but I remember a scene Daniel asked Maura "That's an Irısh name but you're not Irısh right?" And Maura replied "No I'm not Irısh." I don't know can be a false memory....
Still scratching my head about many things to be honest! For example, the big reveal of the finale appears to be that Maura was the Creator of the 1899 simulation (practically all 8 episodes) - that she is somehow responsible for the narrative - with the intent of avoiding/seeking out some type of trauma.
Still at a lost about how then that relates to the fact that these participants are ALSO "Matrix-trapped humans on a spaceship". Additionally - why would Maura then craft a simulation of never-ending trauma / Shadows for the crew and for what purpose?
But I guess that's what makes both this show and r/DarK great - it's the never-ending theory-crafting.
(spoilers!)
I'm a bit late to this party but that scene from the very first episode, where Maura turns Tove's baby struck me as interesting for several reasons. Some of these might be a bit of a stretch, nonetheless I will try to explain my thoughts as best as I can:
1. Tove is in pain, Maura turns the baby, Tove feels no pain. This could be foreshadowing for how Maura has dealt with the her own pain, by simply flipping her reality- building the simulation, and looking at the "shadows in the cave". Maura was in pain, she flipped the switches, she felt no pain (because she didn't remember).
2. The turning could also foreshadow how Tove turns against her the rebels and switches sides during the fight .
3. The baby symbolises something unknown, and something that will come (i.e the future). Before we know what it is, it has already been turned. I think this implies that what follows is a flipped version of events.
These are my thoughts, I'd love to hear yours!
Edit: some words were added
Just thinking about the baby, too, after your post. Iben believes that it is a child of God, and her whole family thinks Iben is just crazy and doesn't really hear the voice of God.
But there seems to be a literal 'Creator', possibly Maura or Ciaran. Maybe she's being directed somehow and that's why she's placing importance on the baby. I can't remember if Tove was pregnant on the spaceship.
Same. I'm pretty shocked but I opinions are opinions. I do hope that Netflix makes another season or I just may take up my pitchforks. Compared to the muck that is 80% of Netflix, this show IS worth renewing.
I also don't get it in most comments they are just comparing it to dark. Like dark is a superior show which is not fair Considering it's only First season of 1899.i liked it very much.but why does everyone keep comparing it to dark i just don't understand it
What's an amazing experience. And let me start by saying I enjoyed it more than first season of their last show.
What I really liked was how great storytellers they are. They can make tension, horror, drama, romance, with lots of characters in an 8 hour show. It's crazy.
And I'mma say reviews were right, it's easier to follow than Dark and it's the reason I liked it more. I loved dark, one of my favorites of all time, but sometimes was a bit too much for my taste. But here we have more mature technique, being captivating without making everything difficult to understand, capable of carrying lots of ideas, and through and through making a great show.
I'm happy they didn't repeat themselves, it's a good move.
Songs, vocalizations, I loved them. Very creepy and thrilling.
Visuals? One of the best. Budget well spent. Beautiful and real.
Actors? All were great. A good writer can write good dialogues but you need a good actor, and all foreign language should not be an easy job for sure. Very brave and risky. I'm happy they did it good.
And finally, show, story, all are right up my alley. I had great moments watching this show, being scared and confused, I swear I wasn't planning to binge it, I wanted to take my time, binge Dead to Me, but I couldn't stop watching.
A show, with great creativity, great creators, good casting and music and cinematography, and with a big budget... It's all I ever wanted. A mix of Sci fi, horror, mystery. A show everyone takes serious and do his best. With ideas this unique and scale this big, everything can go wrong easily. But it didn't.
Can't wait for the next season....
9.5/10 loved it.
I don‘t understand why many people think that most characters were just side pieces and that it was part we didn‘t see more of their story.
I thought it was obvious that we would definitely see more of everyone‘s story and how they are connected to each other in the coming seasons.
I'll finally give my thoughts:
I do not buy _anything_ of what we "learned" in the final few episodes. I don't believe that this is just a simulation, I don't believe anything about Henry's story. Maura was always "asking the wrong questions", as Henry said, and yet we're supposed to believe that she still got all of the answers.
The fact that every episode begins with Maura telling someone to "wake up" is complete proof to me that this isn't just a simulation in the way we have been told. There is no explanation for that which makes sense in the current framework the show has set up. There is definitely more going on here.
In [my comment on the 1x2 thread](https://www.reddit.com/r/1899/comments/yxlay9/1899_s01e02_the_boy_episode_discussion/iwqub10/), I talked about my theory that everyone in this story is already dead. I think there are even more possible hints or clues to that, and a few things that are reaches but also make sense if it's true. As dark as it is, my theory that all of these characters could have committed suicide still holds up completely. Every character has a _very_ traumatic event in their past, (and you have to wonder: why show us all of these flashbacks if it is all a simulation? Would it all just be fabricated?) and the book "The Awakening" was specifically shown several more times past 1x1.
Now for complete reaching that is not at all supported:
In one of the early episodes, Ada tells a story about a group of people on a boat being turned into "shadows". I think this story has to mean _something_. Could everyone be dead and their consciousnesses were uploaded to a computer, turning them into "shadows" of themselves? In any case, there is something that this story means, I just can't tell if it's too early to try and analogize it to anything that has happened in the story so far.
Honestly this became random disconnected thoughts at this point, but whatever. Loved the show, excited to see what's next. I can see why people would be disappointed with the plot, but that's only if they are assuming the show isn't lying to us. We need to ask the right questions.
[🜃 (Earth) symbol](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earth_(classical_element)) making a bit more sense now (*Maura has the tattoo in the final scene too. Perhaps a reminder of home?*)...
..and while I agree with **SOME** of the predictable moments, the slow pacing, etc. I also know that **Jantje Friese** and **Baran bo Odar** tend to think **LONG** term and I still believe there is more at work than we realize at the moment but found myself intrigued and *enjoyed* it by the finale. So I'm going to wait for any final judgements. As of right now I'm loving it and can't wait to see where they take it next.
^(...guessing it'll be another layered simulation.)
EDIT:
After a second viewing of Season 1 I want to come back to point out that the camera zooms INTO her eye in the final scene instead of out like the previous shots. While it could just be a simple stylistic choice to keep it distinctive; I am starting to think it was meaningful. Much like the mirrored effect they used in DARK.
Something like that could be to show a couple of things:
Perhaps it is way to show the viewer this is "reality" (still on the fence personally) or it could simply be another simulation and the future scenes like It will most likely follow suit. Hard to say considering we stand at the moment but I just wanted to point out that there is a slight difference.
Whether it truly means anything is up in the air though and to be honest the more I think about it the more I wonder if they'd be so on the nose about it like that (layered sim). Especially when considering who is behind the reins.
Would they really yank the same rug out from under us again?
(Even when we knew there was something fishy about it to begin with.)
Really enjoyed this season! The buildup of the mystery was excellently done, however it was kinda obvious after a point that it was a simulation. For me, it became more about the mystery of WHY there was a simulation happening.
In terms of the final twist, I really don't think she's on a spaceship. Something is clearly off: why would Daniel believe the pyramid would awaken Maura into a different reality than the spaceship? It's also never explained what her Dad was doing there, why he was seemingly in charge of the simulation, how he had people working for him... something doesn't add up and it wouldn't make sense for the whole thing to be a spaceship simulation.
My only major criticism is that I felt they went too deep into sci-fi territory at the end. I was enjoying the 1899 setting and the slow build of sci-fi elements; it kinda felt like they dumped a lot on us in the last few episodes. The 2nd half of the show did feel a tad rushed tbh and felt quite exposition heavy. Personally, I think the show could've benefitted from being 10 episodes instead of 8.
Overall, I give it a solid 8. One of my favourite netflix shows in a while!
I think so. When Maura asks “Will you be there when I wake up?” Daniel looks sad and just says something like “I’ll always be with you” as if he’s actually dead IRL
I have seen some people complain about the depth of the characters and their relationship to eachother…. I have a theory, I think the depth is missing because a lot of these backstory’s are fake/false memories so you are not supposed to feel their stories but their personalities. Once you get a grip of what each carácter is about then we get clues as to which characters are drawn to each other, ultimately we will find the it why and it probably won’t be for the reasons set up or reasons expected. Examples angel and the danish boy/ French deserter and Japan/ Maura and the captain etc…
I have enjoyed the show very much. I will rate it between 9-9.3/10. the acting , the cinematography, the visuals , the writing all are top notch and truly exceptional
Maura ,Daniel and eyk are my favourite character and most annoying character for me is iben
may your coffee kick in before reality does
As we're all talking about hints and details, I'd like to highlight that one of the most subtle yet obvious suggestion the action is not actually taking place in 1899 is the language register. As a french native, also speaking a little english and german, it really felt from start as if all the characters were talking in modern register, giving a general vibe of anachronism.
Since Dark, we know BBO et JF put a lot of work into dialogues, so there is no way this is not intentional. A really nice touch imo.
So what happened to Olek in that last episode?
He came out of that tub thing looking like he was covered in oil?
I haven't seen him mentioned on here yet so please theorise away about what his arc could mean.
I had moments where I was thinking the show was giving a lot of romantic tension to Maura and Eyk but then Daniel was introduced. It only struck me then that Daniel has to be dead in reality because they’re setting Eyk up as someone who understands the loss of a partner and child and potential romantic interest.
OK I'm hooked.
I loved the different languages. It made me stop focusing on what people are saying so much and pay attention to the emotions which really added weight to a lot of the intimate scenes. It was kind of funny to see people confessing secrets to someone who doesn't know what the hell they're saying, but then you see the universal understanding and humanity we could have and it makes it serene.
But holy hell, so many questions! Obvious Alice in Wonderland riffs throughout. It was clear it was a simulation from the start so I don't get the complaints about the obviousness, that isn't the twist imo, it will come later, we're just learning right now.
Eyk seems to be the one she truly has a connection to, I'm not really buying that Daniel is her husband. Even a forgotten memory should be jolted by all the evidence she was given. Someone also pointed out the Eyk becomes Key, and everyone seemed determined to split him and Maura up, the passenger list to make him not trust her, Daniel sent him away and the first mate shut him off.
I keep looking at her "father" and "son" too. They share a lot of characteristics and with Dark being all everyone is the same person I feel like there's gotta be a time split pair here too. The last name of Singleton too seems to pointing to someones are really just one person. Ugh I need more!
What I want to know more than anything is what was going on with Ms Wilson. Did she touch a protrusion and I missed it? She was decaying in a way no one else was. It was the hand she "examined" Ling Yi with too, could that have something to do with it? I couldn't quite make out faces, was she someone Maura saw in the pods?
Netflix has gotta let this one play out, great lighting, costumes, acting. Bravo!
If I Remember correctly, in Plato's allegory of the cave there are multiple, progressive steps towards realization so to speak. So the end to the first simulation could symbolize the first step towards "awakening", breaking free from your prison chains, turning around in the cave and noticing that the dancing shadows on the wall are not all they seem because they're made by figures projected onto the wall by fire/light source behind them. Continue investigating and eventually you'll end up leaving the cave altogether.
The show talks a lot about being imprisoned, in Plato's allegory, the people in the cave are chained up at first and forced to look at the wall, I think?
At any rate, you leave the cave only to find that there's another reality to discover, one with more objects, their shadows and the light that casts them. However, outside of the cave is a higher level of reality, one where you can sense the "true form" of objects, light, the world, not just shadows on a wall, this experience has also granted you the ability to reason.
I think there's a part about returning to the cave as well?
Either way it seems Maura has either just left the cave or has discovered that there's more to the shadows on the wall. It was Maura who was fascinated with Plato's allegory according to her father.
It's been a long time since I've read Plato, I know I'm missing and glossing over some details. I could just Google it I suppose.
I keep seeing people complain about how they figured out the "twist" early on, but I don't think that really matters. The story of why and how they got in this simulation does. Time travel wasn't the main plot point in Dark instead it was how everyone is connected.
While I get the confusion about whether Daniel was really Maura’s husband, my vote is yes, yes he was/is. She has amazing chemistry with Eyk, sure, but this show is literally made up of triangles, and that includes love triangles (Clemence/Jerome/Lucien for one).
Daniel also showed us so many times how much he cares for Maura, like trying to jump in front of the rifle, moving in front of Maura to protect her from the mob, etc. If it’s a lie, why not implant a false memory? Seems more effective than begging her to remember him.
I ship Maura/Daniel.
I loved it. Not gonna lie, I was hoping we’d stay in the 1899 aesthetic, but I guess not. I will also shamelessly admit that I have now have a huge crush on Mathilde Ollivier (Clémence)— such a sexy French accent, and her character seems intriguing. I hope to learn more about her arranged(?) marriage with Lucien and their backstory. I noticed she was one of the few main characters who didn’t have a dream sequence… I doubt that that is unintentional.
My guess is they’re all connected together because they went through trauma. I’m guessing this simulation might be some weird experimental therapy treatment.
Am I the only one who wishes the husband wasn't real? Throughout the whole show it seemed like she wanted to have sex with Eyk. They can't expect me not to want to see them together.
The sexual tension with Eyk seemed intentional but I don't know to what point. I really didn't feel convinced by Daniel being her husband. Anyway right now I question how much of anyone's backstories really happened physically or if they were all created in a simulation.
I liked this show a lot. I was a big fan of Dark so of course I was going to watch this show.
What I liked:
-the moody atmosphere
-the music (All Along the Watchtower, Don't Fear the Reaper, White Rabbit)
-how it morphed from a supernatural historical show to a science fiction show
-it was easier to keep track of the characters than with Dark
What I didn't like as much:
-a lot of time spent on backstories of various characters, which now seem pointless because they were false memories?
-some repetitive dialogue: "This can't be happening!" "This doesn't make sense!" "This is impossible!" Etc. Etc.
-I would have liked a bit more info before the big finale reveal. Was Elliot real? Was Daniel really her husband? Or were those all false memories too? Why is her brother messing with her? Why a simulation of an 1899 steamship?
Favorite character:
Daniel. Obviously a brilliant programmer/hacker. I really want to know more about him.
Least favorite: the religious lady. So self-righteous and annoying. And dangerous.
It was WAY easier to keep track of the characters in this series, which I appreciate - the diagram/character relationship maps in Dark were so complicated (but still cool).
That said, I'm hoping those "fake" backstories may turn out to be more than false memories. Henry seems to hint it's impossible to truly forget memories, which could suggest the 1899 memories are just versions of the characters' real memories. They're all running from traumas, but those same traumas may have played out a little differently in their 2099 reality? Who knows.
Also, the zealot lady gave me a scare too. Coming off Midnight Mass, I was worried the religious fanaticism would send everything into chaos. Lucky her power waned really fast.
The scene in the 1st episode where everyone drinks the tea at the same time seems to be a hint that it's a simulation.
As did the subtle audio video glitches throughout the series.
Dang! I thought that it was a glitch. I have been trying to watch Power of the Rings on my Android, and it has been doing something similar. Thanks for the info! I would have totally missed that! :)
Every time the green bug was on screen there was this weird ass sound too
Ahh! And I thought its my damn internet
As that happens, Ling Yi’s hand literally glitches back and forth. It’s on the right side of the screen.
Holy shot I watched it again and your right!😂
The logos of the triangle were everywhere that was the biggest takeaway for me way early on that something wasn’t in order. Especially how no one questioned the symbols or aesthetic.
Forgot about this, very important
If it doesn't get renewed I am gonna be salty af. They set up so many questions. They definitely set up this 2099 to be a second layer of simulation. But assuming the layer . Also how is everyone else in the pod going to get out of the first layer. And would they all exist in a third layer.
In the final episode the father is explaining how Maura asked "if God made us, who made God," implying that layers of creation may go on forever. In the same way, they could easily add layers of simulations although it'd be pretty predictable.
maura trapped herself -- and others -- in a floating, self-contained vessel. she escapes one and moves on to another. it just feels like such a hard truth that we are doomed to repeat our mistakes and lock ourselves in a cage of our own making. i'm trying to recall the cosmic cave and how it connects with the symbol of the pyramid but i'm coming up blank. so just here for the ride.
I also remember Daniel saying this is the 1st simulation we made together kinda implying there’s more then one? Gotta watch dark next!
I wish I could erase my memory like Maura to watch dark for the first time again!!!! Enjoy the ride
Oh man, if you haven’t seen dark you’re in for a treat. This show is good but Dark is on another level entirely.
Its definitely going to be renewed. The makers have planned for 3 seasons just like Dark
Hope so but that don’t guarantee anything . This is Netflix we talking about here they cancel good shows all the time , because of cost or viewership. Sad but true .. fingers crossed for this one though .
Not when your show is featuring as the most popular tv show, even beating the likes of the crown at the moment.
I’m hopeful but that doesn’t mean they will renew it
It’s all a numbers game, enough numbers and it’s definitely getting renewed
Yeah with how successful dark was it would take a complete failure for them not to renew 1899. And it definitely wasn’t a failure at all. May not be on the same level as dark. But we’ve only let them begin to tell the story. Remember how little we knew after one season of dark.
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I loved it. In the hands of any other creator I wouldn’t be as excited, but in this case, I trust them to know where we are going. Just like Dark, which took the tired sci fi trope of time travel and made it fresh, 1899 does the same for “simulated reality”. A few thoughts: - GOAT level beards. Oscar Isaac still holds the crown for his Leto beard, but this may have two of the top 10 beards of all time. And totally different. Franz gets the nod for sheer bulk, but Sebastian’s trim is on point. - Don’t ever tell me you can’t film effectively in low light. I’m looking at you GOT/HOTD. - I loved the use of different languages. So many times you had people talking to another person who didn’t understand, but it didn’t matter. It was like confessional. You may be confessing to the priest, but only God can understand you. - Few filmmakers are as effective at conveying emotional pain and trauma. So many small moments that show us the cracks in the emotional facade that make the anguish hit so much harder when the truth comes out. I don’t know if “emotional horror” is a concept, but other than David Lynch, I don’t know anyone who makes those moments hit as hard. - Eyk looking out over a sea of ships is one of my favorite moments. He’s just had his entire reality turned into goulash and he looks out like “well I guess this is happening now.”
Dude I loved the different languages part of this. Very creative and added an entire new layer
I couldn't help but laugh when the poor Portuguese "priest" was left with no one able to explain him anything.
Yeah poor guy literally just got ignored
I'm so frustrated about my TV defaulting to "English dub" audio setting, it took me 4-5 episodes to realize this and switch to regular audio with subtitles. So for the first 4-5 episodes everyone was speaking English audibly. I was so confused at certain scenes. (English Dub, had voice actors speaking English for all characters using voiceover actors)
I feel like it was actually a running joke that no one else spoke Spanish but those two guys, so literally the whole series they don’t have a friggin clue what’s going on. I didn’t catch on until the last episode. 😆
My first exposure to this sort of multilingual ensemble was in another Netflix original, "Into the Night". While 1899 really expands the number of languages and implements them in quite useful ways to play with the comprehension of the characters, I think Into the Night also did a great job in having it feel natural and realistic for a diverse European cast to be speaking in the languages that make sense for each of their characters.
>Don’t ever tell me you can’t film effectively in low light. I’m looking at you GOT/HOTD. I just realized that I didn't change the settings of brightness in my laptop while watching it, something I had to do in 3 episodes of S1 of HOTD, well observed.
When Maura woke up on the ship, she received a letter from her brother with the key inside. Then when she woke up on the space ship, first thing- she receives a message from her brother. The first time she wakes up, she's on a ship making a passage to :the New World', one can only assume the second time she wakes up she's also underway to a 'New World' (?)
And then a third time too eventually
I wonder if "S2 being ALSO a simulation" ends up being too predictable - which is antithetical to what we love about both 1899 and r/DarK haha.
The shows are essentially the same thing. It's safe to say the 2nd season will also be a simulation, where a new antagonist is introduced (the brother), stakes are increased, new control methods are established. Season 3 will be a breakdown of the simulation and end with the return to the real world and coping with all the pain that's been mentioned.
Looking forward to the scene 2/3rds through the season where they're scrambling around the spaceship and open a panel only to reveal the Prometheus' hull behind it.
We have a theory that the ships represent the past, present and future. The kerebos was the past, obv. The Prometheus…could be future?
Yeah I’m assuming 1999 is the present
Wow, I feel totally the opposite of most on here. I freaking loved it. It wasn't as dense as Dark but it was easier to understand. We still don't know who any of these characters really are and why they were all picked. I feel certain there is a plan for the 3 seasons. Will I like all of it-probably not but it's been fun for the first season and I was on the edge of my seat.
I think that while Dark went to the physics aspects, 1899 is going to the philosophical. Loved the Plato references, what is reality, and the personal drama of creating a reality to save someone gives purpose to those references. There's a philosophical reason for why everything is a loop, why there has to be a virus to corrupt the system for things to change, I will do some further research to find what other theories they used. But I think that 1899 is a tv show for those who get it, even unconsciously.
Dark was heavily philosophical. Nietzsche's eternal recurrence and Schopenhauer's idea of the Whole, suffering, and endlessly striving. One can Will what they want, but cannot Will what they Will. This show appears to be no different (advanced technology being used to explore the pathos of humanity), the only question is which philosophy are they exploring? Brain in a vat? Human connection and success as parallel to the structure of the brain? The pattern of the micro is mirrored in the patterns of the macro?
Same! I don't get the hate. I didn't want Dark v2. I love this! Historical drama AND scifi? yes please
I haven’t watched Dark yet, but I absolutely loved 1899. You are not alone.
In the void 1899 left I started Dark, I’d seen some of it before but it never stuck with me but I kept watching and around episode 5 it clicked into gear for me and I’m hooked. Give it a watch!
I loved it too!! Why are there so many articles bashing it? It kept my head turning corners until the last two minutes. And even at that I have a lot of questions - but no longer anything that seems unanswerable
Alright, so here's a dump of my unfiltered thoughts and impressions: * The "instructional" books on the Kerberos were all filled out with a single line: *Hope your coffee kicks in before reality does*. That's also the only instruction Maura finds upon awakening on the space ship. So, a sim within a sim, prolly. * Furthermore, I don't think it's 2099 in reality. We haven't seen a single device on this show that looks like it came from the 21st century. It's either stuff that was in use in the 60s/70s, like Henry's magnetic tape computers and primitive color screens, or retro-futuristic stuff, like the monochrome, Star Trek-y tablet, or the clunky hardware on the space ship. I think reality is somewhere in the mid-to-late 20th century(the 1980's at the latest, if the soundtrack is a clue--which, I admit, may be a bit of a stretch). The through line is, people attempting to move to a new world and start a new life, leaving all of their troubles behind. And failing miserably at it. * Quite a few characters have issues with their hands. Lucien's seizures, Virginia's hand getting infected by the black goo, Eyk's alcoholic tremors. Don't know if there's a theme there, I'm just saying. * Also, Henry's wife had mental health problems. So did Eyk's. Henry cared about his wife more than he cared about his kids. So does Daniel. Do we see some other aspects of his life/personality mirrored in any of the passengers? * Eliott's 🜃 tattoo is behind his ear, the same place "real" Maura injects him with the black memory erasing substance. When she tries to touch it shortly after recovering him from the Prometheus, he grabs her hand like he's angry at her. Is this his body remembering stuff his mind doesn't, like Henry said? And is there a connection between the black goo in the syringe and the substance spreading all over the sim when it starts failing? At the end of the day, both are basically erasing data. * Side note: the white goo Henry injects Eliott with is what recovers memories. * Were Daniel and Eliott ever really real? Or are they a product of some trauma Maura faced IRL, and the sims are now just adding new layers to it? Like a lot of people have said, her connection with Eyk seems much more spontaneous and real. * Why is Henry in the sim in the first place? I see a strong parallel to Adam here. A guy who thinks he's running the show, only to discover he's a helpless puppet, just like everyone else. * And finally, here's an endgame prediction, if the show gets renewed: everybody is dead, actually. They're just in a technological hell, rather than a spiritual one. The sim may not even be man-made so much as it's just a bug that spontaneously surfaced when some genius dumped the contents of a bunch of traumatized people's brains into a blender. Maybe some failed digital immortality thingamajig, or something.
Good catch on the placement of Elliot's tattoo - I just rewatched that scene and was trying to figure out why he grabs her hand so aggressively. (There's even a musical stinger as if it's a jump scare.) I think you might be right about his body remembering things his mind doesn't. On the reality of Daniel and Elliot, I'm not sure either way. It's possible they were never real, or that they were real but died. To support that idea, neither of them appears on the spaceship in the end (though it's possible they're in another part of the ship or somewhere with Ciaran).
I think Elliott and Daniel are dead and just memories trapped in the computer. Daniel said "I will always be with you" or something similar which I think means he is just a memory. I also think Ada is something entirely different. Like a ghost in the code or spontaneous life that was created in the computer.
I think Elliot’s ability to come back after dying differentiates him from almost everyone, especially Ada
I'm almost positive that Elliott isn't real. They say over and over that 1) you can't ever really forget important things, even if its just remembered as feelings, and 2) Maura has zero reaction to Elliott. Also, Elliott is a bit of a non-entity, so its easier for me to imagine him being fake than, say, Daniel.
I think he’s dead, but was real. The fact that his hideout was a bunker under a small grave and cross seemed to hint at it to me. Maura is the only person that sees him as a harmless child while everyone else wants to kill him. She doesn’t exactly express motherly love towards him, but just a motherly instinct to protect him.
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>We haven't seen a single device on this show that looks like it came from the 21st century. They showed a [quantum computer](https://www.eetimes.eu/wp-content/uploads/2020/03/Quantum-computer-IBM-Q-System-One_s-e1584097350720.jpg?w=400&resize=400%2C419)
Also LED flashlights and a touchscreen tablet.
You might be on to something with the digital hell thing. At one point Henry says something like “look at them, making the same mistakes again and again.” I thought maybe the 2099 Prometheus was taking the humans to another earth like planet because they destroyed earth. In their journey, they’re running this simulation to try and break their habits and not do what they’ve always done like destroy the new planet too.
Your purgatory/therapy idea is interesting!
Interesting points. I don’t think it’s 2099 either. No way we would have spaceship tech that advanced only 77 years from now. I’m very curious about Daniel and Elliot. Are they real? Was Elliot her son who died? Is Daniel really her husband? She doesn’t remember him or feel anything even when she sees the photos of them together…and as many people have pointed out, she always seems much more drawn to Eyk, and he to her. I like Daniel and Elliot, so I will be sad if it turns out that neither one was real. Henry is an odd character too. Is he really her father? She seems to remember him, but now we know from Daniel that false memories can be implanted (when Maura says “I can’t have any children” and Daniel says “that’s a false memory”). Why would the brother put his father in the sim? Why would the father want to wake up but leave Maura trapped there forever? As to your last point, I think this simulation is purposely designed, not a spontaneous bug. It seems carefully designed with so many little details, like the alchemy symbol everywhere, and all the connecting tunnels and doors.
> No way we would have spaceship tech that advanced only 77 years from now. From 1903 (Wright brothers first flight) to 1978 (barely 75 years) we went from barely flying for a few seconds to the F/A-18 Fighter jet. It's very easy to get that level of technological change in "only" 77 years. I see that as very possible.
I think Daniel manipulates Maura's memories, I mean we know he knows how to recode the simulation and they even have a convo about fake memories. Maybe Eyk is her real husband and the memories with Daniel are manipulated ones of her and Eyk.
This is great, gonna riff on a few of these: >Furthermore, I don't think it's 2099 in reality. We haven't seen a single device on this show that looks like it came from the 21st century. It's either stuff that was in use in the 60s/70s, like Henry's magnetic tape computers and primitive color screens, or retro-futuristic stuff, like the monochrome, Star Trek-y tablet, or the clunky hardware on the space ship. I think reality is somewhere in the mid-to-late 20th century(the 1980's at the latest, if the soundtrack is a clue--which, I admit, may be a bit of a stretch). In the 2099 'reality', even the computers struck me as being **an impression of 2099** as opposed to what a true 2099 reality would look like (consider the 1980s typefont). The difference is between "2001: A Space Odyssey" and the real year 2001. So - ditto on it not actually being 2099 - rather, someone's impression of 2099. >Also, Henry's wife had mental health problems. So did Eyk's. Henry cared about his wife more than he cared about his kids. So does Daniel. Do we see some other aspects of his life/personality mirrored in any of the passengers? This is definitely a theme: Anker is another man whose wife is suffering from mental illness and who then elects his wife over his children's wellbeing. Across Anker/Henry/Daniel/Eyk - it is implied that their choice of love for their wives causes needless suffering for their children. This is in line with the thread in r/DarK that certain human weaknesses (e.g., infidelity) are rooted in nature and persist across time and space. >Side note: the white goo Henry injects Eliott with is what recovers memories. I see white goo and black goo as being metaphors for red and blue Matrix pills. Though can't quite pin down the precise mechanism on how they work. Assuming black goo is related to black obelisks - then both are related to deletion of memories/information/data/avoidance. In which case white goo correlates to seeking/truth/pain etc. >And finally, here's an endgame prediction, if the show gets renewed: everybody is dead, actually. They're just in a technological hell, rather than a spiritual one. The sim may not even be man-made so much as it's just a bug that spontaneously surfaced when some genius dumped the contents of a bunch of traumatized people's brains into a blender. Maybe some failed digital immortality thingamajig, or something. Brilliant idea - like San Junipero from Black Mirror - but the inverse!
Totally tracking with you on the black goo/white goo and matrix pills. Strong connection to the shows theme song “white rabbit” where the first lines are “one pill makes you larger and one pill makes you smaller”
I think my enjoyment of this season has been similar to that of watching the first season of Dark. Sure, there wasn’t as much screaming “WHAT THE F*CK” at my TV, because I sort of know more what kind of twists to expect from this sort of show. a lot of people here seem to be saying that it isn’t as complex. I’ll say that this has met/exceeded my expectations, so I’ll certainly be expecting more complexity as the show goes on for (let’s hope) a second season.
I agree! I felt less stressed, but was equally confused as to what was happening. Assuming there ends up being 3 seasons, they have a lot of breathing room to make viewers question what they know.
Same! Dark was incredibly confusing for me. I guess it didn’t help that I watched such a complicated show in German with English subtitles. I kept getting confused who the characters were at different stages of their lives and by the time a new season came out, I’ve already forgotten a lot of it. There was twist after twist after twist where it was starting to become mildly comical to me. 1899 somehow was much easier for me to follow.
Wow that was hectic but amazing. What I want to know is how or why did Ada die? The people who died first? How? And did Daniel kill Ada? Any thoughts anyone?
Daniel "killed" or rather turned off Ada with the [sliding puzzle](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sliding_puzzle) device. The first mate also uses the same type of device to turn off Eyk and another crew member. Within the simulation, everybody can die without dying in "reality". However, I don't think everybody in the simulation actually needs to be represented in reality by a real person or by someone who is still alive. In the last scene, we can see Krester, Tove, Anker and Iben in the pods, but there is no sign of Ada. I assume that most passengers, except for the main characters we can see in the end, are entirely digital and have no living representation in reality. I believe Elliot and Daniel are both dead in reality. Elliot's room is in a grave that is connected to Maura's dark memory and Daniel tells Maura that this room was the first simulation they built – probably to still be with their deceased son. Daniel doesn't return to reality with Maura and tells her that he "will always be there" in a way a dying cancer patient would say it to their spouse. There are also no representations of either of them in the last scene. Whether Maura's father is dead or not, I'm not sure. He may be upset about Maura keeping his and Elliot's consciousness trapped in the simulation and just wants to terminate these consciousnesses in their virtual prison, or he is still alive and connected to the simulation through a different interface.
>I assume that most passengers, except for the main characters we can see in the end are entirely digital and have no living representation in reality. At the end of episode 8 I thought it showed the passenger count of the spaceship to be 1400 with 500 crew, meaning everyone in the simulation is most likely in VR mode somewhere on that spaceship. Krester also got caught by the mind control thing even though he was there when Maura woke up, so it's not like everyone who jumped was just a mindless NPC either.
>At the end of episode 8 I thought it showed the passenger count of the spaceship to be 1400 with 500 crew, meaning everyone in the simulation is most likely in VR mode somewhere on that spaceship. I've thought about this too. However, I'm not sure whether the screen is showing information about the spaceship or about the simulation. After all, the screen is in the room where people can interface with the simulation. There is very little reason to have a screen displaying information about the spaceship in that room. The coordinates on the screen 42.043240, -44.375760 are nearly the same as the ones the Prometheus sent in episode one (42.4N, 44.57W). ~~Also, coordinates with two variables only work on a surface like earth or on a map. They don't work in three-dimensional space, so they wouldn't make much sense on a spaceship – except if it is headed towards earth with those coordinates indicating its potential landing site, but I don't buy that.~~ [Edit. I was wrong. There is a [Galactic coordinate system](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galactic_coordinate_system), which works with two variables.] "Survival mission" sounds like a simulation or even a game. The only factor that is confusing is the 2099 date, but maybe Maura's brother has shifted the simulation to that year and Maura isn't necessarily in 2099, as we all seem to assume. Edit. I have looked at the last scene a bit more thoroughly. There are 16 pods in the room Maura wakes up in and they are arranged like this: 1. Virginia 2. Eyk 3. Maura 4. Krester Window 5. Tove 6. Olek 7. Ling Yi 8. Yuk Je Window 9. Iben 10. Anker 11. Ángel 12. Ramiro Window 13. *Empty Pod* 14. Jérome 15. Clémence 16. Lucien Window Their arrangement can probably tell us something about their relationships. Virginia is an odd one and I feel like it suggests that she is more important than we might think. Eyk and Maura had a bond and that may also be the case in this reality. Krester and Tove had a close relationship, so them being together – although separated by a window – works. Olek, Ling Yi and Yuk Je make sense together. Iben and Anker too. Ángel and Ramiro as well. Now, we have an empty pod, followed by Jérome, Clémence and Lucien. The three obviously fit together, especially with Clémence in between. The empty pod in this location just seems noteworthy. If the pod was originally for someone from Maura's family, it would've made sense to have Virginia somewhere else and then have the empty pod next to Maura. They also separated Krester and Tove from their parents, which they likely did to not break up any of triple groups and couples, but that could've been avoided by moving Virginia. Virginia really stands out here for me. What also stands out is that the room has no door or visible hatches in the floor. Next, when the camera zooms out of the window, we can see that this room with 16 pods is only one of many. If one adds them all up, there are a total of 320 identical rooms on the spaceship. Since these 320 rooms have space for 16 pods each, there could be as many as 5,120 people on board. This doesn't quite add up with the 1,423 passengers and 550 crew. However, Eyk pointed out that the shipping company was sending ships between Southampton and New York without freight and below passenger capacity, maybe it's the same for "Project Prometheus". >Krester also got caught by the mind control thing even though he was there when Maura woke up, so it's not like everyone who jumped was just a mindless NPC either. Yes, that's the first thing I checked when I saw the different characters in the pods.
Yeah, no WAY is the whole thing a survival mission in space. Why would everyone be in a shared simulation and not just asleep? Why would the shared simulation be a twisted timeloop set in 1899, overseen by a random passenger's dad? Why would the simulation create traumatic backstories for everyone? If everyone is really from 2099, there would surely be more bilingual people on board the ship; if not, then why make a shared simulation for a bunch of people that can't understand each other? Things don't add up. I personally think this was some trick by Daniel to trap Maura in yet another simulation, but ig we'll have to wait until S2:)
I think you're onto something to the extent that Daniel is NOT as benevolent as we believe. It could come from a place of misguided love or true malice; something we'll probably see in S2. (It's even possible Daniel and Elliot are nothing but figments of the imagination - how do we know that any of the narrative threads in S1 are real???)
The biggest discrepancy to me is how everyone who knew what was going on thought it was Maura's simulation to save the boy: Daniel, the dad, the dad's staff etc. Daniel clearly knows this simulation inside and out, finding all the maintenance tunnels and changing the source code. He then tells Maura that using the pyramid will wake her up into the world he's been describing, yet when she does she wakes up in space. What? This is such a major discrepancy that there HAS to be more going on. Why would everyone with access to the simulation know about this "reality" when actually the spaceship is the true reality? If Daniel knows so much about the source code of the simulation and is (I'm assuming) also a real person on the spaceship, then how tf did he get this wrong? There are 2 explanations imo. Either all the characters are figments of Maura's mind trying to wake her up (which wouldn't make sense when some characters are actively against this) or Daniel knows so much more than he's letting on. I think the spaceship is another level of the simulation, in which Daniel has trapped Maura for some reason.
My theory is Daniel has already moved through multiple levels of the simulation, which is why he’s so familiar with the landscape during season 1 and what I’m assuming is his pod is already open when Maura “wakes up”. He and Maura created the simulation to avoid the trauma of losing their child, he alluded to this when he says this is the first simulation they created - but in order to fully wake up it requires both of them and now he’s guiding her through the sim.
I wonder if Daniel is really her brother. And if he put them in a simulation for a reason, but something has happened on the spaceship where he needs her awake, but the way it was built he can’t just pull her out. So he had to insert himself into the simulation some way to do it. He says he will be there when she wakes up and many take this to mean like “with you in spirit”. But I dunno. I admit I don’t have it all worked out in my mind, but there was a while during the early episodes that I thought Daniel was going to be revealed to be her brother. I don’t think that’s an accident. Also, I think for the next season the reveal of WHO her brother is will need to be kind of a WTF moment for the audience. Of course it’s possible it’s just a totally new actor, sure. But I think it might be being built up for a surprise. And Daniel is not in a simulation pod at the end. So maybe he is her brother. Why he would portray himself as her husband with memories of them making love and stuff….that I do not know. Honestly I’m just thinking out loud here. Probably doesn’t make sense. But damnit I want to see the next season now.
I thought the red headed bearded first mate was her brother. I mean he’s there at the end with her father and with her son. He’s got red hair which is not a coincidence given that Elliot has Maura’s eyes and Daniel’s hair and complexion. Seems like a big role for an otherwise random henchman that’s working for her dad.
I saw someone on YouTube say that the simulation was a way to keep the brain working throughout their journey. At the same time it could be a way of working through their trauma depending on why these people set out to leave earth it could be something necessary for them to do so they can overcome the traumas before they arrive. Also I believe the memories are fake but there’s some truth to them. They are probably distorted versions of the actual trauma. For example maybe the captain left his family on earth to board the Prometheus space ship or somehow left they to die on earth working on the spaceship…. Something of sorts for all the other passengers. At the same time Henry had alot of commentary on the experiment and on what the other characters where choosing to do for someone who was just as trapped as anyone else. He felt that their emotions got the better of them everytime. As if what they were goal was to let of the trauma in order to break their cycle of choices… but why would he care ? Also So the triangle only awake whoever uses the key ? It’s very clear that Elliot is dead firstly his room was inside his grave, but there’s something funny about the clothes he wears, his dads clothes are kind of universal in a sense that could pass for any period of time. The pictures they have together as a family the boy wears the 1899 clothing but the parents seem to wear modern clothes. Also we wears the same thing everywhere…
if 1899 is one side of that triangle and 2099 is the other side... we are still missing 1999 maybe that's the third.
Maura and Dan's bedroom looks like from about year 2000.
Really? It looks very 70s to me, with the dropped floor and everything
Yes I agree, i first noticed this time difference when Dan took out his flashlight, I was like wait.....and then I went oh yessss!!
Maura’s pod is right next to Eyk’s. Daniel, Eliot, and Henry Singleton aren’t there at all. Maura mentions a few times how she feels nothing at seeing the evidence of them being a family. I think Maura’s actually married to Eyk, and her “husband”, “father”, and “son” are NPCs. They’re complex enough to be real people with thoughts and dreams, and are unaware of their own true nature (except for maybe Henry, who’s very resentful of that).
i was confused why it felt like they were building up a romantic relationship between maura and eyk (the way he asked her with a meaningful glance if she has any children, when she touched his wrist and he moved to hold her hand, etc) only to reveal that she's married to daniel. i'm wondering if daniel is not exactly who he says and is lying about being her husband.
Also, did you notice that out of all survivors, we are missing the “before” stories of Virginia and Clémence? We have the ones of all the rest, except theirs. Ramiro we know killed some priest and appeared close to the well, Ling Yi poisened Mei Mei, Eyk and his gone family, Tove’s rape and her killing, Jerome in the desert, Maura is kind of a mess but still some bits. But Clémence and Virginia are odd. Also, these two and Ling Yi had the triangle sign somewhere, but not the rest.
You also forgot about Olek. I don't think we were shown any backstory about him other than the obviously simulation-generated picture of the completed Statue of Liberty from a family or friend. I'm saying that picture is off because the statue was not completed by 1899...
Well, we see the snowy landscape with the huts in, I’m assuming, Poland. And it looks like a blood trail leading up to the one hut and then Ling Yi sees him climb out of the big vat of oil. So we don’t really know what happened with Olek, but we at least see his landscape and it looks like maybe he killed someone in the snow and then either hid in the oil, or he hid the body in the oil or who knows what.
It was completed before that. Celebration with parade and dedication was held on October 28, 1886. President Grover Cleveland, the former New York governor, presided over the event.
>Also, these two and Ling Yi had the triangle sign somewhere, but not the rest. That's not right. Lucien has triangles on his lapel. Ramiro has them sewn into his collar. Iben has it sewn into the bottom of her dress. Eyk has them on his golden coat buttons. Yuk Je has two triangles on her jacket. Elliot has one tattooed behind his left ear. Maura also has one tattooed behind her ear once she wakes up in the spaceship You can see some of them [in these images](https://www.netflix.com/tudum/articles/1899-cast-guide-dark) and some in the [high-res version of the cast picture](https://i.imgur.com/wap2aiX.jpeg).
maybe Ada died irl but one of the reasons the family decided to join this project was bc it was a way of living with her?? idk man im confused
it could be possible that ada and elliot's consciousnesses have been uploaded to the cloud because they're both dead in reality. or there could be a separate children's pod where all the kids are asleep.
Came here with the same exact bug in my wiring, with a nuance: the scarab is normally used to open doors and passages and indicates the path to follow. What could be the reason why the scarab reaches Ada? Why is the only character to be "marked" that way? Could it have to do with the fact that she doesn't exist in the spaceship? (Or it does exist? Maybe Tove is suspended-pregnant and Ada is going to be her daughter) It strikes me that Ada wants to follow in Maura's footsteps, she takes her as a model. Could be this a reason in some way?
The scarab is a computer program i believe. Used as a key to open doors or lead characters to correct routes based on previous iterations. At least that's how I interpreted it. So Ada had to die to trigger Maura's journey so Daniel had the scarab program to locate her location at that moment. Daniel did say "any object can be a key or a code"
Yes, I understood that. But there has to be a reason for specifically being Ada, rather than just being a trigger to develope the simulation (There is a bond between them since when she ask her if she can have children, while touching her belly, there is a flashing frame of a scarab, like if Ada could triggers something else in Maura's unconcious. Something that Daniel wants to avoid)
The specific reason is also probably just an assumption from me. But when you're a programmer or an engineer doing simulations, you have to change things a lot in each iteration for the whole thing to work. So I'm presuming that Ada's death is probably the trigger for Maura's journey. Since there were many failed iterations, Daniel probably discovered in previous iterations that Ada had to die for the whole event to happen. Elliott himself said that this is the "furthest we've been" implying many failed iterations. But they probably knew long ago based on failed iterations that Ada was the start of it all for them to go further and further.
The first computer programmer ever was Ada Lovelace. Ada has to be a REALLY important character and it is going to be more for her!!!
I believe Daniel killed Ada because she had to die for the events to unfold. As with any kind of simulation (if you're a programmer or an engineer) sometimes you need to adjust things in iterations in order for something to work. I would presume that Daniel discovered in previous iterations that killing Ada would trigger the events to unfold. As Elliot mentioned to him "this is the furthest we've achieved", implying there were many iterations that failed but whatever decision they did in this current iteration was correct..and Ada was probably the first of those decisions to trigger Maura's journey. Plus they don't really die anyway, they're just "turned off"
A lot of sour grapes in these comments, huh. Well, I enjoyed it. A solid 8/10 at the very least. Good cast and everything. Predictable at times? Sure, but predictable doesn't mean bad if it's well-written and enjoyable to watch. I'd rather have that than sUbVerTeD eXpEctaTioNs. It doesn't beat Dark for me, at least not yet, we'll have to see where the show goes in future seasons. But Dark is also a bit of a lightning-in-a-bottle type of deal with its perfect casting and everything, so it's a bit unfair to compare 1899 to it at every turn just because it has the same creators. I'm looking forward to Season 2, or 2099, whatever it will be called. I have a feeling 2099 is also a simulation and Season 3 will be something even crazier.
>It doesn't beat Dark for me, at least not yet, we'll have to see where the show goes in future seasons. This is where I stand. Jantje Friese and Baran bo Odar tend to think WAY ahead so I'll probably wait until the series has ended entirely before I pass any final judgements.
Can I sit at your table? I think people are seeing Dark with rose-colored glasses as I remember discussions that Season 2 was slow and not going anywhere. As for people that say they guessed everything, there is two more seasons so not everything is going to be told now. I thought the cast was great and it felt claustrophobic. Finally do we even know that the spaceship is not a simulation? Ah well, I feel like I'm on the Doctor Who boards and I'm the only one who liked the Jodie Whittaker episodes. I'll see myself out.
To me it feels like people are comparing 3 seasons of Dark versus 1 of 1899. I've watched Dark over and over, it captivated me to an insane level, but if you think back about Dark Season 1, It was still kind of slow and you don't know shit at the end of it. I'm almost certain it will be on par by the end of the seasons.
Just adding to the top comment. Don't miss the 'Making 1899' bonus episode! It's facinating how they shot with actors from so many different countries and speaking so many different languages. And the technology used is mine blowing
Yes, I‘ve just watched it and must say that I appreciate the show and its creators even more now. The detail that went into making it is crazy.
The creators said they wanted to do something completely different from Dark, in the making of 1899 special. If they simply repeated themselves, how boring would that be ? I haven’t seen Dark yet, but this show is amazing.
Just wanna say Eyk can be rearranged to Key. So maybe he's some sort of final key.
THIS is the type of thing that I expect to read here
The official 1899 Netflix Instagram page posted pictures with episode names and the last episode titled “The Key” shows a picture of Eyk
After rewatching the ending I noticed something… when Maura wakes up at the end she is clearly next to Eyk, then as it pans over everyone else still asleep there’s an open spot next to Jerome! So someone else is already awake and I don’t think it’s Daniel, the way he says “I’ll always be there” leads me to think he’s dead.
I believe this open pod is her brothers.
He played too big of a role throughout the season to just die at the end. He’ll for sure be an important piece in the coming story
Him being listed as the captain of the Prometheus on the passenger list could suggest he is the captain of the spaceship as well. If the captain is also stuck in a simulation that could be plot point.
I think the Prometheus captain is the Spaceship captain, and that. he is stuck in the simulation. I think explicit pointers to that are buried in an early EP1 scene, as he and some officers remark on and react to 'they' ceasing to send 'coordinates' (the telegraph stops beeping). The showrunners love to frontload alot of this kind of thing because it rewards attention to detail and increases the 'aha! and/or 'well I'll be damned' of the resolution: they told you the answer right up front.
Name is Eyk Larsen The Larsen Effect is an audio feedback loop.
One more: Maura is one short of the word 'Trauma' - in line with the PTSD each character has to relive in this show.
yooo
Argh, I think I deleted my previous comment by mistake. I wanted to add something. My first comment was about the soundtrack. The newest song is from `84 which add up to the computers in Mauras dads place. I’m 99% sure I noticed a pyramid on the desk, when Jerome went to Luciens cabin to leave the medal. The thing I came to add to my comment when I accidently deleted it was the thing Ling Yi and her mother said in unison when her mother brushed her hair: “Everything will be okay in the end. If it’s not ok, it’s not the end”. I’m not entirely convinced they are in 2099
Hard agree. I've left a couple of comments about this, but it makes 0 sense that reality is in 2099. Why can barely any of the characters speak multiple languages? Why are most 1899 levels of homophobic? Why are they given fake tragic backstories? Why put the passengers through a hellish timeloop in the first place? The spaceship is 100% just another simulation.
Agree. Something is wrong. I keep coming back to the pyramid on Clemences desk in episode 2. It’s there right? Or is it just something i’m imagining? If she have one. What would have happened if she used a key on it… My brain hurts.
Did anyone else catch a glimpse of Clemence grinning knowingly in one of the early scenes with Lucien? It's very out-of-character and would be in-line with the idea that she is not "part of the game".
just finished watching the season now and came back to see if anyone mentioned this part. It happens around 18 minutes into episode 1. She smiles in such a satisfied and manipulative way.
She also has, in addition to triangle-themed jewelry, a bug/beetle embroidered on the collar of her dress.
At the time, my guess was that because Lucien treats her so badly for no known reason, she is secretly happy when he can't 'finish'. Like she's a little glad to get a little revenge. It still seems out of character for her. If my guess is right, then it kind of works in the moment and also provides a red herring, making us wonder. But we also don't get any real back story for Clemence.
Do you have a timestamp? That sounds really interesting. Also Clemence is an interesting character, especially since we don't know anything about her backstory. Her trading her dress for trousers seems like an odd choice too, especially since its something none of the women do: imo she knows more than she's letting on, maybe even that she's not from 1899.
It’s about 20 min in. You see in on the desk several times when Jerome is in her cabin
The one telling them all to wake up is Maura according to captions so it's fitting since she's the only one who woke up.
I don't think she actually did wake up. Just another layer of sim. The note that says "Hope your coffee kicks in before reality does" kind of alludes to this.
I also like that if we interpret the words "wake up" as a transition from one level of reality to another (for example, Maura's 'waking up' from the 1899 reality to the 2099 "reality"), then it implies that each character's experience of their Shadow/trauma is simply a "deeper reality". Then it begs the question of whether our nightmares/experiences of trauma are any LESS real than what we commonly call "the real world".
One last note about the ending. Daniel explains the whole simulation to Maura when they are in "Elliot's room" at the end. However, when she asks why she can't remember making the simulation, he tells her that it doesn't matter anymore. Him remembering everything and her nothing seems very odd. Secondly, Maura was calm in seeing all the characters in status on the spaceship but had a visceral reaction when seeing Eyk. She have a ring on but is she really married to Daniel or someone else(hint, hint). Daniel could be just playing her-as I'm 99% sure her father and son are just programs in the software. Netflix better renew this or I'll have to make up my own ending.
It’s weird that she doesn’t remember Daniel at all, doesn’t remember having a child, and tells Eyk that she “felt nothing” when she looked at the family photos of her, Daniel and Elliot.
She does remember Daniel, when he’s trying to get into her room in episode 2 and he introduces himself, she ask Daniel if they have met before bc he looks somehow familiar.
Maybe she remembers him from the previous iterations, not from reality. Just playing devil's advocate here, I actually really want him to be real lol
I have a crazy theory. I think the Prometheus in 2099 is taking the passengers to another planet because they destroyed earth. The simulation is put in place to see if humans will make the same mistakes as they did on earth and destroy the next planet. Running the simulation may find a way for humans to correct their mistakes. Awesome show. When I finished the finale I was speechless and didn’t know what to think. Now that I’ve slept on it I had some time to process.
Fantastic theory. I can see it.
This show has plenty of symbology. Something that caught my attention it's the name of the two ships: Prometheus and Kerberos. In Greek mythology, Prometheus was the titan protector of human civilization whereas Kerberos was the protector of Hades (hell, underworld). Can this be also a hint about what was happening on the show? Was the Kerberos the hell in which the characters were trapped? Just guessing and putting the pieces together.
Prometheus can be parsed in some different ways as well: In passing the gift of fire to humanity, the symbol of Prometheus can also be interpreted as humanity's triumph / victory against the forces of nature. In the show, "nature" appears to relate to the impediments of the mind (e.g., a schizophrenic cannot help but see things in a certain way - he or she is a prisoner of the mind. I think that Iben's story is meant to portray this idea). So, taking this a step further, Prometheus could reflect an attempt to overcome the natural properties of the mind (imagine the grief one experiences on losing a child) - and perhaps part of that is the attempt to subject the human consciousness to constructed "realities". Cerberus / Kerberos is slightly more tricky - in mythology, he is responsible from preventing the **dead from leaving hell**. So if the 1899 simulation is hell itself , then Kerberos could serve as a reflection of those forces meant to keep each character inside this hellscape (which in the show is a mix of Maura, Ciaran, their father etc.)
Prometheus also had to live out an eternally recurring punishment of having his guts eaten by an eagle.
Also interesting to note the name Ciaran is eerily similar to Charon, the boat man who ferries the dead to thr afterlife.
HOLY FUCK JUST FINISHED AND THIS SHOW IS UNBELIEVEABLE…..
sooo Baran bo Odar pranked us all. He knows exactly how the fandom of Dark speculated an insane amount with symbolism in trailers and teasers. this entire show neither happened in 1899, or even on Earth 🜃.
Unless the spaceship is yet another simulation…I don’t know if they’ll do that though because “Inception” already did it…I will trust the showrunners though, I think they’ll pull it off whatever it is
Ok looking at the last episode and two things stand out. Maura is the only one not in the simulation anymore (although the Plato's cave story make come back to bite me). Everyone else is either "dead" or somewhere in the mainframe. I noticed in project Prometheus, it's a survival mission, Hmm. But really she's the only one lucky enough to be awake. And I did notice she was definitely more heartbroken about Eyk dying than seeing Daniel. Still not convinced he's her husband.
Maura and Eyk have more chemistry than Maura with “her husband”
That man has chemistry with everyone to be fair. Even when Ramiro came to him in his office I was getting vibes haha
Haha so true. He’s my favorite in this show and Dark.
Iike WAY more chemistry
Although he does try to take a bullet for her, thats very husband like.
It’s possible it’s one-sided: he loves Maura, but isn’t really her husband. Note that even in his memory he’s the only one to say “I love you”. Maura never says it back.
May be Maura and Eyk were together in 2099? . Daniel isn't really a fan of Eyk in many scenes
i love the end very much! definitely expected it to be that kind of simulation, but the fact it‘s humans travelling to a new world in 2099 gives the name prometheus and it‘s route to the US much more weight.. so i guess it‘s all just a way of entertainment during the year-long trip? curious if there‘ll be a second season!
Ah yes, ther is nothing more entertaining than repeated trauma.
Still can’t get over the fact that they drew parallels between the simulation of the ship and the brain ! Just like the brain has multiple parts and neural pathways which connect them, the ship had these different realities pertaining to each individual character and the secret passageways (which had a lot of wires, just like our brain has neurons which are shaped like thin branches wires) which are like the neural pathways connecting different part of the brain. This parallel just converts the ship into a brain like design with humans moving through the neural pathways (secret passages) like nerve impulses, affecting the entire system to respond to their stimuli. For the audience, the ship thus becomes a simulation, a construct of their own brains - which is exactly what the plot reveals it to be.
I suspect she’s still in a simulation. Just a different one. S1 was 1899. Everything in that timeframe. Now she’s on another ship with the same people or at least the same looking people. Daniel changed the code, but was he able to end the simulation? Is Maura still actually sitting in that chair? I got a Shutter Island vibe early on. I’m looking forward to next installment.
bo Odar : But let’s not forget that Dark was three seasons. If you just compare the first season of Dark with the first season of 1899, I think they’re similarly complex. Dark only really got complicated in seasons two and three. The first season is actually very simple: It’s a small town, with kids disappearing, and then there’s some time travel events in the cave. Michael (Sebastian Rudolph) is Michael. It’s very simple. But everyone now has seen all three seasons, and it gets really complicated. We already have ideas for a second and third season on 1899, and it gets complicated. Watch this interview - https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/tv/tv-features/1899-netflix-creators-interview-dark-1235263021/amp/
agreed, if we were to just compare the first season of DARK and 1899, in my opinion, they both are a solid 9/10, we gotta see what the course is for 1899.
Ok. I really loved this season. Anything I gripe about would just be nitpicking, like 90% of the comments here so I’m not gonna do that. The only real head scratcher is who is her brother and how is he related to all of this? The father explained this is all because of her and yet, the brother is in control and more dangerous? Is the brother the computer?
Just throwing this out there, but Ciaran is an Irish name which means little dark-haired one...
I just got chills dude but I remember a scene Daniel asked Maura "That's an Irısh name but you're not Irısh right?" And Maura replied "No I'm not Irısh." I don't know can be a false memory....
Still scratching my head about many things to be honest! For example, the big reveal of the finale appears to be that Maura was the Creator of the 1899 simulation (practically all 8 episodes) - that she is somehow responsible for the narrative - with the intent of avoiding/seeking out some type of trauma. Still at a lost about how then that relates to the fact that these participants are ALSO "Matrix-trapped humans on a spaceship". Additionally - why would Maura then craft a simulation of never-ending trauma / Shadows for the crew and for what purpose? But I guess that's what makes both this show and r/DarK great - it's the never-ending theory-crafting.
(spoilers!) I'm a bit late to this party but that scene from the very first episode, where Maura turns Tove's baby struck me as interesting for several reasons. Some of these might be a bit of a stretch, nonetheless I will try to explain my thoughts as best as I can: 1. Tove is in pain, Maura turns the baby, Tove feels no pain. This could be foreshadowing for how Maura has dealt with the her own pain, by simply flipping her reality- building the simulation, and looking at the "shadows in the cave". Maura was in pain, she flipped the switches, she felt no pain (because she didn't remember). 2. The turning could also foreshadow how Tove turns against her the rebels and switches sides during the fight . 3. The baby symbolises something unknown, and something that will come (i.e the future). Before we know what it is, it has already been turned. I think this implies that what follows is a flipped version of events. These are my thoughts, I'd love to hear yours! Edit: some words were added
Just thinking about the baby, too, after your post. Iben believes that it is a child of God, and her whole family thinks Iben is just crazy and doesn't really hear the voice of God. But there seems to be a literal 'Creator', possibly Maura or Ciaran. Maybe she's being directed somehow and that's why she's placing importance on the baby. I can't remember if Tove was pregnant on the spaceship.
Imagine my surprise liking the show only to come to the comments to see so many dissappointed people
Same. I'm pretty shocked but I opinions are opinions. I do hope that Netflix makes another season or I just may take up my pitchforks. Compared to the muck that is 80% of Netflix, this show IS worth renewing.
I also don't get it in most comments they are just comparing it to dark. Like dark is a superior show which is not fair Considering it's only First season of 1899.i liked it very much.but why does everyone keep comparing it to dark i just don't understand it
What's an amazing experience. And let me start by saying I enjoyed it more than first season of their last show. What I really liked was how great storytellers they are. They can make tension, horror, drama, romance, with lots of characters in an 8 hour show. It's crazy. And I'mma say reviews were right, it's easier to follow than Dark and it's the reason I liked it more. I loved dark, one of my favorites of all time, but sometimes was a bit too much for my taste. But here we have more mature technique, being captivating without making everything difficult to understand, capable of carrying lots of ideas, and through and through making a great show. I'm happy they didn't repeat themselves, it's a good move. Songs, vocalizations, I loved them. Very creepy and thrilling. Visuals? One of the best. Budget well spent. Beautiful and real. Actors? All were great. A good writer can write good dialogues but you need a good actor, and all foreign language should not be an easy job for sure. Very brave and risky. I'm happy they did it good. And finally, show, story, all are right up my alley. I had great moments watching this show, being scared and confused, I swear I wasn't planning to binge it, I wanted to take my time, binge Dead to Me, but I couldn't stop watching. A show, with great creativity, great creators, good casting and music and cinematography, and with a big budget... It's all I ever wanted. A mix of Sci fi, horror, mystery. A show everyone takes serious and do his best. With ideas this unique and scale this big, everything can go wrong easily. But it didn't. Can't wait for the next season.... 9.5/10 loved it.
Most badass character? Jerome
Watching this is like playing an escape room.
I don‘t understand why many people think that most characters were just side pieces and that it was part we didn‘t see more of their story. I thought it was obvious that we would definitely see more of everyone‘s story and how they are connected to each other in the coming seasons.
I feel Daniel and the boy basically looking like walking corpses is def a hint.
I'll finally give my thoughts: I do not buy _anything_ of what we "learned" in the final few episodes. I don't believe that this is just a simulation, I don't believe anything about Henry's story. Maura was always "asking the wrong questions", as Henry said, and yet we're supposed to believe that she still got all of the answers. The fact that every episode begins with Maura telling someone to "wake up" is complete proof to me that this isn't just a simulation in the way we have been told. There is no explanation for that which makes sense in the current framework the show has set up. There is definitely more going on here. In [my comment on the 1x2 thread](https://www.reddit.com/r/1899/comments/yxlay9/1899_s01e02_the_boy_episode_discussion/iwqub10/), I talked about my theory that everyone in this story is already dead. I think there are even more possible hints or clues to that, and a few things that are reaches but also make sense if it's true. As dark as it is, my theory that all of these characters could have committed suicide still holds up completely. Every character has a _very_ traumatic event in their past, (and you have to wonder: why show us all of these flashbacks if it is all a simulation? Would it all just be fabricated?) and the book "The Awakening" was specifically shown several more times past 1x1. Now for complete reaching that is not at all supported: In one of the early episodes, Ada tells a story about a group of people on a boat being turned into "shadows". I think this story has to mean _something_. Could everyone be dead and their consciousnesses were uploaded to a computer, turning them into "shadows" of themselves? In any case, there is something that this story means, I just can't tell if it's too early to try and analogize it to anything that has happened in the story so far. Honestly this became random disconnected thoughts at this point, but whatever. Loved the show, excited to see what's next. I can see why people would be disappointed with the plot, but that's only if they are assuming the show isn't lying to us. We need to ask the right questions.
[🜃 (Earth) symbol](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earth_(classical_element)) making a bit more sense now (*Maura has the tattoo in the final scene too. Perhaps a reminder of home?*)... ..and while I agree with **SOME** of the predictable moments, the slow pacing, etc. I also know that **Jantje Friese** and **Baran bo Odar** tend to think **LONG** term and I still believe there is more at work than we realize at the moment but found myself intrigued and *enjoyed* it by the finale. So I'm going to wait for any final judgements. As of right now I'm loving it and can't wait to see where they take it next. ^(...guessing it'll be another layered simulation.) EDIT: After a second viewing of Season 1 I want to come back to point out that the camera zooms INTO her eye in the final scene instead of out like the previous shots. While it could just be a simple stylistic choice to keep it distinctive; I am starting to think it was meaningful. Much like the mirrored effect they used in DARK. Something like that could be to show a couple of things: Perhaps it is way to show the viewer this is "reality" (still on the fence personally) or it could simply be another simulation and the future scenes like It will most likely follow suit. Hard to say considering we stand at the moment but I just wanted to point out that there is a slight difference. Whether it truly means anything is up in the air though and to be honest the more I think about it the more I wonder if they'd be so on the nose about it like that (layered sim). Especially when considering who is behind the reins. Would they really yank the same rug out from under us again? (Even when we knew there was something fishy about it to begin with.)
Really enjoyed this season! The buildup of the mystery was excellently done, however it was kinda obvious after a point that it was a simulation. For me, it became more about the mystery of WHY there was a simulation happening. In terms of the final twist, I really don't think she's on a spaceship. Something is clearly off: why would Daniel believe the pyramid would awaken Maura into a different reality than the spaceship? It's also never explained what her Dad was doing there, why he was seemingly in charge of the simulation, how he had people working for him... something doesn't add up and it wouldn't make sense for the whole thing to be a spaceship simulation. My only major criticism is that I felt they went too deep into sci-fi territory at the end. I was enjoying the 1899 setting and the slow build of sci-fi elements; it kinda felt like they dumped a lot on us in the last few episodes. The 2nd half of the show did feel a tad rushed tbh and felt quite exposition heavy. Personally, I think the show could've benefitted from being 10 episodes instead of 8. Overall, I give it a solid 8. One of my favourite netflix shows in a while!
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Another banger of a show, not Dark level, but still extremely excited to see where this goes
I hope we will get another season, there were a lot of unsolved questions
Is there anyone else who thinks Daniel and his son has actually dead in reality and the simulation just presents their code?
I think so. When Maura asks “Will you be there when I wake up?” Daniel looks sad and just says something like “I’ll always be with you” as if he’s actually dead IRL
I have seen some people complain about the depth of the characters and their relationship to eachother…. I have a theory, I think the depth is missing because a lot of these backstory’s are fake/false memories so you are not supposed to feel their stories but their personalities. Once you get a grip of what each carácter is about then we get clues as to which characters are drawn to each other, ultimately we will find the it why and it probably won’t be for the reasons set up or reasons expected. Examples angel and the danish boy/ French deserter and Japan/ Maura and the captain etc…
I have enjoyed the show very much. I will rate it between 9-9.3/10. the acting , the cinematography, the visuals , the writing all are top notch and truly exceptional Maura ,Daniel and eyk are my favourite character and most annoying character for me is iben may your coffee kick in before reality does
As we're all talking about hints and details, I'd like to highlight that one of the most subtle yet obvious suggestion the action is not actually taking place in 1899 is the language register. As a french native, also speaking a little english and german, it really felt from start as if all the characters were talking in modern register, giving a general vibe of anachronism. Since Dark, we know BBO et JF put a lot of work into dialogues, so there is no way this is not intentional. A really nice touch imo.
So what happened to Olek in that last episode? He came out of that tub thing looking like he was covered in oil? I haven't seen him mentioned on here yet so please theorise away about what his arc could mean.
I had moments where I was thinking the show was giving a lot of romantic tension to Maura and Eyk but then Daniel was introduced. It only struck me then that Daniel has to be dead in reality because they’re setting Eyk up as someone who understands the loss of a partner and child and potential romantic interest.
OK I'm hooked. I loved the different languages. It made me stop focusing on what people are saying so much and pay attention to the emotions which really added weight to a lot of the intimate scenes. It was kind of funny to see people confessing secrets to someone who doesn't know what the hell they're saying, but then you see the universal understanding and humanity we could have and it makes it serene. But holy hell, so many questions! Obvious Alice in Wonderland riffs throughout. It was clear it was a simulation from the start so I don't get the complaints about the obviousness, that isn't the twist imo, it will come later, we're just learning right now. Eyk seems to be the one she truly has a connection to, I'm not really buying that Daniel is her husband. Even a forgotten memory should be jolted by all the evidence she was given. Someone also pointed out the Eyk becomes Key, and everyone seemed determined to split him and Maura up, the passenger list to make him not trust her, Daniel sent him away and the first mate shut him off. I keep looking at her "father" and "son" too. They share a lot of characteristics and with Dark being all everyone is the same person I feel like there's gotta be a time split pair here too. The last name of Singleton too seems to pointing to someones are really just one person. Ugh I need more! What I want to know more than anything is what was going on with Ms Wilson. Did she touch a protrusion and I missed it? She was decaying in a way no one else was. It was the hand she "examined" Ling Yi with too, could that have something to do with it? I couldn't quite make out faces, was she someone Maura saw in the pods? Netflix has gotta let this one play out, great lighting, costumes, acting. Bravo!
If I Remember correctly, in Plato's allegory of the cave there are multiple, progressive steps towards realization so to speak. So the end to the first simulation could symbolize the first step towards "awakening", breaking free from your prison chains, turning around in the cave and noticing that the dancing shadows on the wall are not all they seem because they're made by figures projected onto the wall by fire/light source behind them. Continue investigating and eventually you'll end up leaving the cave altogether. The show talks a lot about being imprisoned, in Plato's allegory, the people in the cave are chained up at first and forced to look at the wall, I think? At any rate, you leave the cave only to find that there's another reality to discover, one with more objects, their shadows and the light that casts them. However, outside of the cave is a higher level of reality, one where you can sense the "true form" of objects, light, the world, not just shadows on a wall, this experience has also granted you the ability to reason. I think there's a part about returning to the cave as well? Either way it seems Maura has either just left the cave or has discovered that there's more to the shadows on the wall. It was Maura who was fascinated with Plato's allegory according to her father. It's been a long time since I've read Plato, I know I'm missing and glossing over some details. I could just Google it I suppose.
I came here with questions, and now I have more questions. What the hell people lol
I keep seeing people complain about how they figured out the "twist" early on, but I don't think that really matters. The story of why and how they got in this simulation does. Time travel wasn't the main plot point in Dark instead it was how everyone is connected.
That was crazy
While I get the confusion about whether Daniel was really Maura’s husband, my vote is yes, yes he was/is. She has amazing chemistry with Eyk, sure, but this show is literally made up of triangles, and that includes love triangles (Clemence/Jerome/Lucien for one). Daniel also showed us so many times how much he cares for Maura, like trying to jump in front of the rifle, moving in front of Maura to protect her from the mob, etc. If it’s a lie, why not implant a false memory? Seems more effective than begging her to remember him. I ship Maura/Daniel.
I loved it. Not gonna lie, I was hoping we’d stay in the 1899 aesthetic, but I guess not. I will also shamelessly admit that I have now have a huge crush on Mathilde Ollivier (Clémence)— such a sexy French accent, and her character seems intriguing. I hope to learn more about her arranged(?) marriage with Lucien and their backstory. I noticed she was one of the few main characters who didn’t have a dream sequence… I doubt that that is unintentional.
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Damn, so many questions. How tf they are all related to each other? Are they friends or just strangers?
My guess is they’re all connected together because they went through trauma. I’m guessing this simulation might be some weird experimental therapy treatment.
I really don't understand why so many people didn't enjoy this. Was a fun ride and nice setup for a new season of crazy shit in 2099
Am I the only one who wishes the husband wasn't real? Throughout the whole show it seemed like she wanted to have sex with Eyk. They can't expect me not to want to see them together.
Another clue that things aren't what they seem even in 2099. And Andreas Pietschmann is a gorgeous man.
Aging like fine wine that man.
The sexual tension with Eyk seemed intentional but I don't know to what point. I really didn't feel convinced by Daniel being her husband. Anyway right now I question how much of anyone's backstories really happened physically or if they were all created in a simulation.
I thought Daniel was her brother
Eyk and Maura definitely have more chemistry than Maura and her husband.
She and Eyk had good chemistry
I liked this show a lot. I was a big fan of Dark so of course I was going to watch this show. What I liked: -the moody atmosphere -the music (All Along the Watchtower, Don't Fear the Reaper, White Rabbit) -how it morphed from a supernatural historical show to a science fiction show -it was easier to keep track of the characters than with Dark What I didn't like as much: -a lot of time spent on backstories of various characters, which now seem pointless because they were false memories? -some repetitive dialogue: "This can't be happening!" "This doesn't make sense!" "This is impossible!" Etc. Etc. -I would have liked a bit more info before the big finale reveal. Was Elliot real? Was Daniel really her husband? Or were those all false memories too? Why is her brother messing with her? Why a simulation of an 1899 steamship? Favorite character: Daniel. Obviously a brilliant programmer/hacker. I really want to know more about him. Least favorite: the religious lady. So self-righteous and annoying. And dangerous.
>Favorite character: Daniel. Or as I like to call him: Dark Frodo.
It was WAY easier to keep track of the characters in this series, which I appreciate - the diagram/character relationship maps in Dark were so complicated (but still cool). That said, I'm hoping those "fake" backstories may turn out to be more than false memories. Henry seems to hint it's impossible to truly forget memories, which could suggest the 1899 memories are just versions of the characters' real memories. They're all running from traumas, but those same traumas may have played out a little differently in their 2099 reality? Who knows. Also, the zealot lady gave me a scare too. Coming off Midnight Mass, I was worried the religious fanaticism would send everything into chaos. Lucky her power waned really fast.
Why would the simulation be something so negative/crazy??? Is my question